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HUD bug(s) since launch, all related to FPM & Pitch ladder.


SCU

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In a couple of posts up I mentioned the erratic behavior of the ILS HUD localiser line and anchor point. This video is of an A319 ILS approach. It clearly shows the logic of how the Localiser HUD line and its anchor point should behave in the MIIR2K HUD.

 

The A319 HUD has both the Synthetic runway ILS localiser line and the ILS Anchor point. It differs in that the Pitch ladder is caged to the centre of the HUD rather than the velocity vector To get to the main ILS HUD video start at 9:54.

 

This is a turn to intercept the localiser.

 

 

 

Thanks for the video.

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In a couple of posts up I mentioned the erratic behavior of the ILS HUD localiser line and anchor point. This video is of an A319 ILS approach. It clearly shows the logic of how the Localiser HUD line and its anchor point should behave in the MIIR2K HUD.

 

The A319 HUD has both the Synthetic runway ILS localiser line and the ILS Anchor point. It differs in that the Pitch ladder is caged to the centre of the HUD rather than the velocity vector To get to the main ILS HUD video start at 9:54.

 

This is a turn to intercept the localiser.

 

 

 

Lovely video. :smartass:

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  • 2 weeks later...
To be honest, we took care of a handful of HUD issues but I think there is still work to be done, if you seen anything in this latest updates, please let me know so we can get them figured out.

 

The FPM and pitch ladder are so close to being accurate to reality, but it still needs some fine tuning. The lower limits of the FPM in 'normal' Nav mode should be lower down in DCS, it's too shallow at the moment. While in 'app' mode the opposite is true; it's slightly deeper (lower) than reality. I suggest that you work on normal mode FPM limits first and then match 'app' mode to it.

 

It's easy to figure out precisely where on the HUD the FPM limit is by watching the video & comparing the pitch ladder's numbers to the Magics' G & D indications while in a 90 degrees bank angle. Because the Magic missile indicator are in a fixed position, we can get an accurate modeling of the FPM in the sim assuming the G-D are correctly positioned (<--they seem fairly accurate to me).

Some pictures to help you..

 

The FPM limit in DCS: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148050&stc=1&d=1473601575

 

How it should be: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148051&stc=1&d=1473601575

 

How to get the exact limit: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148052&stc=1&d=1473601575

Deduced from this: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148054&stc=1&d=1473601596

 

As you can see, at a 90° bank, with the fpm at its limits, the lower portion of the G or D indication should just tangentially touch the pitch ladder's number.

 

Should be the same for Approach mode as far as I know.

 

Note: the upper limit needs to be slightly higher than it is now, just a tad more above the heading tape.

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842585458_Untitled5.thumb.jpg.184c0868c1488d15774fd19c5ab54521.jpg

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The FPM and pitch ladder are so close to being accurate to reality, but it still needs some fine tuning. The lower limits of the FPM in 'normal' Nav mode should be lower down in DCS, it's too shallow at the moment. While in 'app' mode the opposite is true; it's slightly deeper (lower) than reality. I suggest that you work on normal mode FPM limits first and then match 'app' mode to it.

 

It's easy to figure out precisely where on the HUD the FPM limit is by watching the video & comparing the pitch ladder's numbers to the Magics' G & D indications while in a 90 degrees bank angle. Because the Magic missile indicator are in a fixed position, we can get an accurate modeling of the FPM in the sim assuming the G-D are correctly positioned (<--they seem fairly accurate to me).

Some pictures to help you..

 

The FPM limit in DCS: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148050&stc=1&d=1473601575

 

How it should be: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148051&stc=1&d=1473601575

 

How to get the exact limit: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148052&stc=1&d=1473601575

Deduced from this: https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=148054&stc=1&d=1473601596

 

As you can see, at a 90° bank, with the fpm at its limits, the lower portion of the G or D indication should just tangentially touch the pitch ladder's number.

 

Should be the same for Approach mode as far as I know.

 

Note: the upper limit needs to be slightly higher than it is now, just a tad more above the heading tape.

 

Thank you SCU, greatly appreciated :)

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Thank you SCU, greatly appreciated :)

 

Thank you! :thumbup:

Please can you also look at the FPM not being linked to the Pitch Ladder while on the ground (Weight on Wheels).

 

And also this: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2619123&postcount=2

 

I hope they get into the next update, cheers for the nice work :).

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I also think that the "fly-to" direction in the ILS glideslope "box" is reversed in the horizontal.

 

I can confirm Catseye's observation. The Localiser Arrows on the ILS Flight Director HUD box are reversed. Should be as in the inset , See below:

 

Mir2kILSFD_zpsp0dzlecw.jpg

 

Steering cues to Glideslope are correct.

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I can confirm Catseye's observation. The Localiser Arrows on the ILS Flight Director HUD box are reversed. Should be as in the inset , See below:

 

Mir2kILSFD_zpsp0dzlecw.jpg

 

Steering cues to Glideslope are correct.

 

Thank you IvanK. I've reported it a couple of times and the last I heard from Zeus was that he would look at it later when he started to work more on the ILS system. This was several months ago. Hopefully, this is in his upper file folder now. :)

 

Cheers,

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  • 9 months later...
In a couple of posts up I mentioned the erratic behavior of the ILS HUD localiser line and anchor point. This video is of an A319 ILS approach. It clearly shows the logic of how the Localiser HUD line and its anchor point should behave in the MIIR2K HUD.

 

The A319 HUD has both the Synthetic runway ILS localiser line and the ILS Anchor point. It differs in that the Pitch ladder is caged to the centre of the HUD rather than the velocity vector To get to the main ILS HUD video start at 9:54.

 

This is a turn to intercept the localiser.

 

 

Thanks for the video.

 

 

Is there an update on attaching the localizer HUD line to the synthetic runway/anchor point so it is 'ground stabilised' and doesn't swing about due to roll, etc.

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=165259&stc=1&d=1498939234

M2000C_HUD_ILS.thumb.jpg.12eae4b1e76506c59fd80bff6133dbe1.jpg

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M-2000C_ILS_DCS_1_5_6.thumb.jpg.67911034d09da817e21ad2861e39d335.jpg

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Agreed, Ramsay.

 

The localizer HUD line should be attached to Runway position (not to the synthetic runway itself, because you may have the line displayed without the synthetic runway, IIRC - will check).

 

What's needed to display correctly the loc line:

- Current Wpt (should be the runway position)

- CP parameter (runway heading); As you may know, CP (and PD) parameters of the INS are not active at the moment (but the runway heading can be known if there is a "landing" waypoint set in the ME).

- Aircraft current position & heading, of course.

 

Perhaps an update should look at that too (or first), to be able to display correctly the Loc line.


Edited by Azrayen

spacer.png

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  • 4 months later...
In a couple of posts up I mentioned the erratic behavior of the ILS HUD localiser line and anchor point. This video is of an A319 ILS approach. It clearly shows the logic of how the Localiser HUD line and its anchor point should behave in the MIIR2K HUD.

 

The A319 HUD has both the Synthetic runway ILS localiser line and the ILS Anchor point. It differs in that the Pitch ladder is caged to the centre of the HUD rather than the velocity vector To get to the main ILS HUD video start at 9:54.

 

This is a turn to intercept the localiser.

 

 

 

Hi everyone.

 

This didnt get fixed, right? Cause the closed box still behaves wrong during ILS approaches.

 

The video clearly shows how the FPM is centered on the box based on roll and pitch like an FD.

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  • 2 years later...

@Ramsay: If that would get fixed as you suggested, the whole ILS approach concept would make a lot more sense in the M2000. I never knew what I was chasing with that dashed line in its current state. :)

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I just went towards the TACAN selected heading at very low speed and got into within 10 nm, after which I checked out runway shape and then maneuvered to visually line up with the runway heading, hoping I'm not taking the 180 degrees opposite heading XD Later on I just started checking the Caucasus aerodrome chart to figure out the right heading for my runway.

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@Ramsay: If that would get fixed as you suggested, the whole ILS approach concept would make a lot more sense in the M2000. I never knew what I was chasing with that dashed line in its current state. :)

 

Yes, it seems Dassault was heavily inspired by Gilbert Klopfstein's 1966 work at Thomson-CSF.

 

YqWba5s.jpg

 

https://www.ecologique-solidaire.gouv.fr/sites/default/files/head_up_display_symbology.pdf


Edited by Ramsay
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  • 1 year later...

I can confirm the HUD ILS guidance now looks correct in Open Beta 2.7

 

zS0xXJd.jpg

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  • 4 weeks later...
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