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TWS Query


pauldy

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We know that at the upper part of the VSD in TWS radar mode, there are two values when using an AIM-120,

 

The M(n) time for the last missile fired to become active or tracking a target on it's own, the Time to active counter.

 

Then the nn (enter any numerical value) beside the Time to active counter, that tells us the Time for the last missile fired to hit the target, the Time to Impact counter.

 

I'm just wondering about the given values of both counters after the last missile you launched already went active or pitbull, despite not launching another AIM-120 yet.

 

"M15 31"

 

15 seconds to active and 31 seconds to impact for what?

 

I remember another counter below the VSD, M(x) which counts the time to active for the current missile selected still attached to the pylon rail.

 

but both M counters above and below the VSD don't match.

 

So all in all, what's this M15 and 31 seconds?


Edited by pauldy
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Urm did you try the ironhand tutorial?

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Yah, actually i first saw the "M15 31" readings in that tutorial

 

Then i tried take a look at it myself in a quick mission, results were the same~

 

15 seconds to active and 31 seconds to impact for what missile?

even though i haven't launched another AIM-120 towards the Secondary target yet..

 

Maybe this is a data bit Ironhand forgot to explain? or it has something to do with the last launched missile that's already racing towards the Primary designated target?

 

I dunno but it really adds to my confusion..

 

 

 

 

EDIT: Ok I tried it again and noticed something

 

If you fire your 1st missile against your PDT, once the Time to active counter reaches zero, it then changes the value into Time To impact, hence, the now "pitbull" launched missile will hit the target in 15 seconds.

 

e.g. after M0 (last launched AIM-120 now active) --> M15 = Time to impact

 

Now the only thing the bugs me is the previously "Time to impact" counter.

the one beside M(n).

 

I noticed that when the last launched missile becomes active, the supposedly "Time to impact" counter reverts back to 30 seconds.

 

e.g. M0 10 (last launched AIM-120 now active) then --> M15 30

 

..30 seconds of what?

 

and it doesn't match the M(x) reading that states the Time for the current missile selected to go active.

 

Anyway i've made a TWS engagement track file against two IL-76s at high altitude.. to show what i'm talking about..


Edited by pauldy

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Crunch. The "Pre launch timer" at the bottom. Is that the "Time to active" for the next missile you fire? So, if you fired NOW it would go active in "9" seconds.

 

Saw ironhands video but that bit didn't sink in my brain.

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Yes, I believe that is correct coolts as noted on the picture above by Teka Teka. (edit watch pauldy's example track and it confirms the number is TTA for next missile.)

 

I think in the Iron Hand's video he does describe it differently though. Can anyone else confirm?


Edited by Crunch
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I noticed that when the last launched missile becomes active, the supposedly "Time to impact" counter reverts back to 30 seconds.

 

e.g. M0 10 (last launched AIM-120 now active) then --> M15 30

 

..30 seconds of what?

 

and it doesn't match the M(x) reading that states the Time for the current missile selected to go active.

 

Anyway i've made a TWS engagement track file against two IL-76s at high altitude.. to show what i'm talking about..

 

What you describe pauldy I believe to be a bug. If you watch the very last AIM-120 you fire in your example track that kills the second IL-76, you see the post launch counters for TTA:TTI for the missile in the air gets reset to new numbers. I have seen this many times and from I can tell, it is a bug.

 

Anyone else confirm? Maybe it can be corrected in LO 2?

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I think the Track while scan mode of the F-15 in Lock On yields an extra numerical value that has no function at all.

 

If one would consider the last missile to have already gone active, thus

"M(n)" becomes a counter for Time to impact.

 

The number beside "M(n)", the "nn"

previously known as the Time to impact counter now shows a numerical value that doesn't make sense.

 

It reverts back to 30 seconds. Doesn't make sense to me, by the time you have pitbulled a missile.

Any of the three timers should have lower starting values; be it Time to active for the next missile, time to impact or time to minimum range, because most likely your now nearer to your targets..

unless you have turned away and run..

 

Maybe the "30" seconds value has something to do with the M61 vulcan? i dunno..

 

Also i think, that all of the data for the last missile fired stays on the upper part of the VSD. On the HUD, it's on the lower left corner.

 

Then the data for the current selected missile, is on the lower part of the VSD. On the HUD, it's on the lower right corner.

 

 

 

To sum it up, I think it's a clutter data, like Crunch said, hope it gets addressed in FC 2.0 ^^

 

EDIT: Here's some screens to visualize even further. Note that by this time, my 1st launched AIM-120 had already gone active or pitbull. Anyway the confusions start when your missile/s goes active.

 

screenshot013hr.th.jpg

 

screenshot014l.th.jpg

 

screenshot015f.th.jpg

 

screenshot016hf.th.jpg

 

EDIT2: By the way, i tried launching an AIM-120 in STT mode. The results were the same, an extra "30" second clutter data.


Edited by pauldy

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so, the function of the numerical value "nn" beside "M(n)" that becomes Time to impact counter once a missile goes active, ..is not known?

 

Oh well, i'll just ignore it for now and consider it insignificant...

 

useless, nothing, dead weight, clutter, waste of avionics memory ... ;)

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In the screens that i posted, My first launched Missile had already gone ACTIVE.

 

So the M(n) Time to active counter should have already stopped counting.. but in the game, it's not.

Instead it's displaying another time data. That's why i'm thinking M(n) switches roles from being a Time to active counter into a Time to impact counter..

 

Why? it's because if you watch closely, once the last missile becomes active and M0, it quickly changes value.

The current M(n) value after the last launched missile goes active is 1 digit smaller than the last count of the Time to Impact counter.

 

e.g. M0 15

 

then becomes --> M14 31

 

The counter beside it, Time to impact timer had changed in to a higher value. Shouldn't it become smaller since the last launched AIM-120 is now much closer to it's target?

 

If the M(n) Post launch time to active counter were to retain its function, it should be ZERO already because in the given shots, I have not yet launched any second missile to the 2nd IL-76

 

Maybe it's because the "Resetting" values why i'm getting confused.

 

Another batch of screens, still using the same track.

They're listed chronologically.

 

screenshot018sf.th.jpg

 

screenshot019q.th.jpg

 

screenshot020kg.th.jpg

 

screenshot021il.th.jpg

 

screenshot022d.th.jpg

 

screenshot023qc.th.jpg


Edited by pauldy

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e.g. M0 15

 

then becomes --> M14 31

 

Again Pauldy, this appears to be a known bug. If you are still trying to apply logic to this, I don't think you'll get anywhere, unless I am wrong. I do know that once the second set of numbers appear, as in your example "M14 31", then this second set of numbers is accurate.

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TWS in LOMAC-F-C...1.0 is Almost Useless in the "Right" conditions... As I have stated on many posts about TWS.....TWS---is a tool in the F-15c to single out a SPECIFIC bandit and make "Off-set" bandits evade a under-modeled AIM-120 so you can GO IN FOR THE KILL...

 

The Timers are off by 4 seconds.....

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  • 3 months later...
TWS in LOMAC-F-C...1.0 is Almost Useless in the "Right" conditions... As I have stated on many posts about TWS.....TWS---is a tool in the F-15c to single out a SPECIFIC bandit and make "Off-set" bandits evade a under-modeled AIM-120 so you can GO IN FOR THE KILL...

 

The Timers are off by 4 seconds.....

 

considering that all of these posts are near or around the release of FC2 the utilization of TWS within FC1 sorta like the Spanish Inquisition. Nobody expects it. but nobody really cares.

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To be honest, this thread helped me out when i was getting my head around the F-15 avionics. I've not noticed much change in that area in FC2.0, (i wasnt au fait with the "issues" of FC1.12b so now that it "just works", i am none the wiser.

 

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