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Hi everyone, Would it be possible in the future to add some more Cold War era MANPADS? Namely systems such as: 9K32M Strela-2M [SA-7B Grail] - early 70s FIM-43C/D Redeye Block III/IV - late 60s 9K34 Strela-3 [SA-14 Gremlin] - mid 70s FIM-92A Stinger Basic - early 80s FIM-92B Stinger POST - late 80s Blowpipe - mid 70s RBS 70 Mk. 1 - mid 70s Javelin - mid 80s The 9K32M Strela-2M [SA-7B Grail] in particular was/is incredibly prolific, if not probably the most prolific MANPADS, with absolutely tonnes of operators (both former and current) with a lengthy and rich service life in many conflicts around the world. It's also a staple air defence system for Cold War REDFOR. The FIM-43C/D and FIM-92A are more appropriate BLUFOR contemporaries for a Cold War setting. Blowpipe and FIM-92A/B would also fit the South Atlantic map (former used by both sides, latter used by British SOF). EDIT: Now that an Afghanistan map has been formerly announced, the FIM-92A/B and 9K32/32M would also be perfect for Afghanistan missions (where we already have 2 helicopters that more or less fit). Though the Afghanistan map will likely be a modern day one. At the moment we only have the following MANPADS: 9K38 Igla [SA-18 Grouch] (though unsure of the missile used in DCS, though both the Igla and Igla-S fire the same missile, see here) - early 1980s 9K338 Igla-S [SA-24 Grinch] - mid 2000s FIM-92C Stinger RMP (which is also the missile fired by our M1907 Heavy Avenger and M6(A2?) Linebacker) - early 90s So out of all of them it's only really the Igla that fits the Cold War, only it's just a copied Igla-S with a different name as far as I can tell.
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In the current state of DCS, capable SAM batteries such as the SA-15, SA-11 and S-300 are able to counter air-launched weapons such as the AGM-88, AGM-65, cruise missiles,(which is expected and it was as such since I tried AGM-88 for the 1st time back to 2018 by hornet) and these systems can engage with CBUs(such as 97 and I have no idea if it can/should engage with bombs) and INS/GPS guided. However, it seems the AI knows which weapons it should intercept and which it should not. It recognizes that it shouldn't engage with weapons that can't harm the site, such as the AIM-7, AIM-120, BDU, and practice weapons. This is strange! How can it differentiate between a CBU-97 and a BDU, or an AGM-88 and an AIM-7? Maybe each SAM system should have its own thread! (which is very much possible depends on internal team and implementation)
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So the S300 detection/tracking range is still very low...at my example it detects a F16 at ~30k ft, Mach 1,7 only at 22km and engages at 18km an that over bone flat terrain..the patriot SAM for comparison detects and engages the F16 at 52 km regardles of skill level....something seems still wrong here with the S300 Performance. S300 detection attack at 18,4km.acmi S300 low tracking distance.trk patriot SAM.trk
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- surface to air
- s300
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Howdy, I have been working on making my first mod for DCS for the last 2 weeks, decided to go with the Nike Hercules launcher and Missile. So far I have been able to create the Missile and Launcher model within blender with animations on the launcher that works (roughly) and have been able to get those models exported in EDM format and working in game replacing the SA-2 models. I then started to work on creating the custom mod folder for my mod and getting the lua files set up working with other existing sam mods and their lua codes. All the lua code just to get it to run is done and in the mod folder but I am stuck at the game not wanting to launch if the mod is in the mod folder so somewhere the code is broke and I have not been able to get any help from the DCS forms or on modding discords. Because of that, I am releasing my models, blender files and broke mod file for anyone to work on and play around with. It's pretty basic but the missile still looks cool in game. Please let me know if you decide to work on it and get it working or are able to help me with the coding issue. Thanks! Nike Hurcules Mod BROKE.rar
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Checked all of the Soviet- and Russian-made SAMs and MANPADS, from SA-5 to SA-18. There is a kind of booster noise when missile starts (looking from F7 mode), but there is no sound of rocket motors in F6 Missile view mode. And SA-2 does not have even launch sound, missiles take off in vacuum silence. Firstly, I thought its because of supersonic missile speed, but from the rear there is no sound too
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- sound bugs
- missiles
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Here is the "first" video, it is the cont. of the series about the Soviet SAM systems. Move video will come about this and many other topics soon.
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HI everyone, As of the 2.7.4 update to the OB, the Tin Shield radar has incorrectly been given the name "SAM SA-5 S-200 Gammon SR". IRL however, the Tin Shield is actually associated with S-300/SA-10 system (or used a general purpose EWR). Given that we have the S-300PS [SA-10b Grumble], we should have the 5N59S [Tin Shield B] (though it has a host of other designations which use different rules - I prefer the 5NXXX for radars as it's cleaner to work with). It's especially puzzling because the 5V28 missile of the S-200V "Vega" [SA-5b Gammon] has a maximum range of 240km, but the Tin Shield RADAR only has a maximum instrumented range of 150km, 60% less range.
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Does anyone know the approximate percentage of old SA-2 and SA-3 systems failing? I've heard that many of these old Russian SAM missiles can fail to launch or track quite often and I was trying to implement that failure in DCS as a trigger percentage to replicate Syrian bought, Russian made SA-2s and SA-3s. If anyone has any information it would be greatly appreciated.
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When driving the Roland SAM system, it takes 10 seconds to acquire the target. This seems way too long to be realistic. It leads to surreal moments where a target is slowly turning towards you while you are unable to react even when the perfect shot is lined up. Is reducing it to 4 or 5 seconds possible? (similar to TOR) roland aq time.trk
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There is not one good official description of how exactly SAM sites need to be set up, how they communicate with other groups (if they do at all) what types of groups they can communicate with. What do the skill levels in SAM systems actually do. I've been setting them up for a while now and understand how to make most systems work but there just isn't information on what the game is actually capable of doing with SAM sites. I don't know how much of the real world capabilities DCS actually models and based on my struggles trying to research this for the past years, I'm not so sure that anyone else really knows either. Most videos on explaining how the mission editor works give of the vibe of "Well I do it this way and it seems to work" This is also true with the logistics system, I would love to make use of this, but how the hell does it work? It's not in your manual which looks like it goes back like 10 years when the only aircraft was the Black Shark. There are also not any videos that describe the whole system. If you don't want to update the actual manual then maybe wags needs to do a series on like, actually using the editor, like a big series, that explains every part of what DCS is capable of from a mission editor point of view. I think a lack of good and accessible documentation on the game generally is a contributing factor to the game being hard for new players to get into.
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So me and 5 others flew an Elint flight but we didn't pick up the ELINT data even if we flew over the radars at 4000-6000m and they pinged us with search and tracking radars. Is the elint in the Viggen outdated? or what is up with it?
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So about the estimated coverage area of the Patriot STR. And, the radar body being static, not sweeping 360 deg. Do I need to add 4 search/track radars to one single Patriot site? Or, do you have to place 4 separate full sites in order to cover all 360 deg? Or, do you use an EWR in conjunction with the Patriot site, to perform the initial detection and pass it to the Patriot STR to take over? Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I don't know how it should be, and I want to learn to do it right. Thanks for any help.
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Hi I noticed that the ["detectionDistanceAir"] for the SA-6 is the same for Lower Hemisphere and Upper Hemisphere (46811.82421875). I`m assuming Lower Hemisphere is low altitude and Upper Hemisphere is High altitude, if that's the case, I would think that lower hemisphere would have a shorter detection distance than Upper hemisphere due to the curvature of the earth?
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Hi everyone. I've noticed some inaccuracies with the SA-2 site about 1.5nm to the north-west of Bassel Al-Assad Airport/Khmeimim/Latakia Air Base; N35°24.767', E035°55.321'. Here's a picture of what it looks like IRL: And here's the same location in DCS at roughly the same zoom level and positioning: Here I've placed the FCR and launchers at the exact same coordinates as they are in real life. Of particular note: The overall site layout seems fairly squished vertically/misshapen. The south-western launch position is absent. There are revetments where there should be dirt tracks. There are some inconsistencies with the revetments around the launchers, but this is minor. The central guidance area (where the FCR is) features no dirt tracks, revetments or details. There's a medium-sized grey building, where there should just be dirt/concrete pad. There aren't any small dirt tracks connecting the revetments. The elevation data for the site seems off, comparing against Google Earth and DCS. I might give annotating and superimposing the images over each other if I have more time.
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I'm pretty sure that this must have been asked and answered a zillion times, but I'm totally unable to find a word about it. If so, just please point me to the relevant answers. My question is... that: how far apart can the units of the same SAM group be and still operate coordinately? And, will they operate even if the LOS among them is obstructed? Thank you in advance.
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as per title, isn't that strange ? is it the correct behavior ?
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BLUF, I would like to see SAM’s better modeled within DCS. I’ll be speaking primarily about the SA-2 but the points I bring up apply to other SAM’s in the game. There are a few things on the in-game SA-2 that are modeled but not function such as the trough antennas on the Fan Song Target Engagement Radar (TER) that allow it to do its own limited search function. These antennas can scan a fixed area at a time or be combined with the rotation of the whole unit to provide 360 degrees of search. Another thing missing on the Fan Song is its optical tracker. This allowed crews to track targets without the use of the 2 parabolic dish antennas mounted on top. Since the missile guidance was accomplished using Command Guidance instead of Beam Riding the target aircraft wouldn’t get a missile launch warning until the beam from the missile uplink antenna also encompassed the aircraft. This is also true for when crews tracked targets using the Radars, the aircraft would be alerted via its RWR (Radar Warning Receiver) that it was being locked onto, but the missile launch alert would not be given until the aircraft was in the same beam as the missile. For a brief explanation of why this happens continue reading this paragraph, if you already have a grasp of it feel free to skip to the next one. On radar's like the Fan Song that use command guidance, there will usually be antennas dedicated to tracking a target and antennas dedicated to missile guidance or, "talking to the missile." Because the radar's goal is to get the missile out in front of the aircraft to pull lead and not waste its limited energy, it will be fired with lead and the narrow beam of energy pointed at it to give it commands during flight will likely not encompass the aircraft until the missile and aircraft are very close (this scenario assumes a side aspect shot). The aircraft will be kept in the beam of a tracking antenna that works with a computer or the operator to tell the uplink how to guide the missile. The optical tracker is seen on most "E" models of the Fan Song radar which is the variant modeled in game, this is evident by the placement of the 3 parabolic dishes as well as the trough antenna's. From what I have read the SA-3's Low Blow radar includes similar trough antennas however it does not utilize them in the same search function, instead they act as receivers. These Trough antennas are fixed in place so they are limited in azimuth and elevation in terms of search capability, however the inclusion of these antennas mean systems like the SA-2 are not completely useless if the search radar is offline. Something to note is the choice of search radar for the SA-2 and SA-3 being the P-15 Flat Face in game. In real life as far as I've read the P-18 Spoon Rest was the intended Search Radar for at least later model SA-2’s such as the “D” model we have in game. It was also used with the SA-3, however the SA-3 also used a later version of the P-15 called the P-15M Squat Eye. Both the Spoon Rest and the Squat Eye include better performance over the Flat Face. Something that I cannot confirm (as I do not know how the guidance is modeled) but suspect to be inaccurate is the flight path taken by missiles using command guidance. Rather than being fired and leading the target they seem to lag behind it or travel directly to it as if they were beam riding. My final point on the SA-2 specifically is the maximum range of the system. The Target Tracking radar is the SNR-75M4 Fan Song E (it could also be the SNR-75M3 Fan Son E I have not been able to distinguish between the two systems based on our in-game model). The variant of SA-2 to use Fan Song E’s was the SA-2D which used the 5Ya23 missile. This missile has a maximum range of 76,000 m or 41.04 NM. The missile in game has a maximum range of 28 miles, which while being a more realistic firing range as it's much closer to the "no escape" range of the missile, is still short of the maximum range. It's important to note that the statistics for the type of missile used in game seem to be relatively accurate, I believe it is just the wrong missile being used for the variant of SA-2 we have. To conclude, I would like to see track radars have expanded functionality to match their real world counterparts, the variant of SAM specified (like SA-2B, SA-2C, SA-2D etc...) and the components and missiles of SAMs used in game synchronized and their specifications brought in line with the appropriate variant. Thank you and Happy Holidays Sources: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Engagement-Fire-Control.html http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-S-75-Volkhov.html Both sources include other links to information
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Why are the SA-10 search radars so underperforming compared to the Patriot search radar? According to the DCS encyclopedia, the SA-10 5N66M has a maximum detection range of 120/90 km... but in-game it's more like 60 km and the 64H6E Big Bird has a detection range of 300 km in the encyclopedia, again only 170 km like in-game Patriot AN/MPQ-53
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Threat Rings in Mission Editor seems to be way off (too big). I remember days clear as sky where you flew into the Threat Ring depicted on your MFDs in the F-16 and F-18 and it [the SAM site] would start tracking you immediately and you had to kinetically evade. Now it seems the Threat Rings on the HSD (F-16) and the SA Page (F-18) are completely wrong about the Maximum Required Interception Range (it starts way later! SA-10 has smaller range at which it fires, contrary to what the ME says). Bullseye and Seawise Tanker are placed in the mission exactly over the spot in which the ME thinks the MRIR is located at and the SA-10 is set to RED STATE, INTX Range 100% and Weapons Free. Trackfiles, Mission and Tacview are in attachment. Both the F-18 and F-16 are flyable to rule out airplane specific bug regarding inaccurate threat ring display. Thanks in advance. HORNET.acmi HORNET.trk VIPER.acmi VIPER.trk SA-10 Threat Rings Test.miz
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Need guidance on Lua code for custom US SAM mod
Acidpro08 posted a topic in How To Mod for DCS World
Howdy all, I have been currently working on making my own custom SAM mod for the US (Nike Hercules) to try out my hand at modding. So far I have got the 3d models made and working in game using other similar mods. I have also made a very simple 3d structure mod with code that works in game but now I'm having trouble getting my sam mod to work in game. I could find little to no guidance on the web into making a sam mod and have used lua scripts from other sam mods and game files. Looking to see if anyone here on the forums could take a look at the lua scripts and point out anything that needs to be fixed. Any help is appreciated, thanks! null entry.lua Nike_Launcher.lua MIM14.lua -
SA-5 Gammon (S-200 Angara/Vega/Dubna) is a very long-lange SAM system and can be considered as unique in DCS nowadays. Unfortunately, it can't use all of it's capabilities because of lnsufficient range of P-19 or 19J6 (ST-68U) search radars, which are part of it at the moment. According to it's manual handbook [общие сведения о с-200.djvu, page 7], SA-2 is capable of receiving information about target coordinates via K9V cabin, coonected to: 1. Automated control systems: 5S99 "Senezh" (5С99 "Сенеж"), "Vector-2M" ("Вектор-2М"), ASURK-1MA (АСУРК-1МА), ASURK-1P (АСУРК-1П), etc. 2. Radar altimeter PRV13 or PRV17 (ПРВ-13, ПРВ-17) 3. Radar station P-14F "Lena" (РЛС 5Н84 П-14Ф "Лена") also known as Tall King. 4. Radar complex P-80A "Altay" or K66 ("Cabin 66") (РЛК П-80А "Алтай" или К-66), which consists of two radar rangefinders and four radar altimeters Third option (using P-14 radar for circular target search) is, for my opinion, optimal because of it's significant range, which allows to detect tagets outside of 5V21A missile range and use all of it's capabilities, respectively. Futhermore, P-14 radar is already awailable to use in DCS (stationary version 4J66 (4Ж66) )as a third-party modification by @tripod3 It is only needed to add it to the DCS CoreMods and edit LUA code in order to make possible information exchange between P-14 and 5N62 Square Pair TR. Adding mobile version 5N84 is desirable too