DCSW AMD vs nVidia Exhaust View Distance.

[bkthunder]

Yes, I added ATI for those that missed the 7970 reference earlier. Again, what's the issue? Argument was that ATI has an advantage. I said there is none.

 

So you established there is no problem. Are you some kind of light bringer? Do you own the truth about Ati cards that allows you to single handedly establish that there is no problem?

 

'Cause I have an Ati and I have a problem with the smoke, so do other Ati users.

But I guess we don't count. We must be liars, photoshopping screenshots and wasting our time reporting non-existent issues.

 

Well, there isn't much of a point arguing with you. I'll just say that just because YOU have everything working so wonderfully, that doesn't mean everyone else does.

There are screenshots and posts from other simmers that prove otherwise.

 

I managed to tweak my smoke settings to a level that is somewhat more realistic on my PC (Ati HD6950), I just don't want ED to hardcode this effect and leave it editable, so ppl can tweak it (since obviously the effect isn't consistent on every system).

[SkateZilla]

If you guys are trying to Submit legit data for a bug report, you're doing it the wrong way...

 

1. Smoke Rendering has nothing to do with any ANTI-Cheat Systems of DCS for one.

 

2. The Thickness/Appearance of Smoke can Vary depending on:

-HDR Setting

-Resolution

-FoV

-Visibility Distance

-Brightness/Contrast

-SweetFX Settings

-Internal/External View

-Pretty much any GFX Setting Dealing with FSAA/AF/Rendering.

[159th_Viper]

So you established there is no problem. Are you some kind of light bringer? Do you own the truth about Ati cards that allows you to single handedly establish that there is no problem?

 

'Cause I have an Ati and I have a problem with the smoke, so do other Ati users.

But I guess we don't count. We must be liars, photoshopping screenshots and wasting our time reporting non-existent issues.

 

Well, there isn't much of a point arguing with you. I'll just say that just because YOU have everything working so wonderfully, that doesn't mean everyone else does.

There are screenshots and posts from other simmers that prove otherwise.

 

I managed to tweak my smoke settings to a level that is somewhat more realistic on my PC (Ati HD6950), I just don't want ED to hardcode this effect and leave it editable, so ppl can tweak it (since obviously the effect isn't consistent on every system).

 

Again, what's the problem?

[bkthunder]

Ask a doctor

[bkthunder]

If you guys are trying to Submit legit data for a bug report, you're doing it the wrong way...

 

1. Smoke Rendering has nothing to do with any ANTI-Cheat Systems of DCS for one.

 

2. The Thickness/Appearance of Smoke can Vary depending on:

-HDR Setting

-Resolution

-FoV

-Visibility Distance

-Brightness/Contrast

-SweetFX Settings

-Internal/External View

-Pretty much any GFX Setting Dealing with FSAA/AF/Rendering.

 

I reported the bug when 1.2.7 came out. The whole thread was moved to the wish list section. :doh:

[159th_Viper]

Ask a doctor

 

Time for you to keep quiet and quit posting in this here thread: Your contributions to date are stupendously and ridiculously useless as evidenced from the above quote and does absolutely buggerall to aid in the 1.2.8. potential issue investigative process.

 

To all others:

 

Apart from the one issue I am guessing at (head-on smoke visibility only of ATI cards), can anybody else please inform me if there are any other issues that need investigating regarding smoke rendering, ATI and NVidia?

 

I need specific specifics, not generalizations or general specifics, please.

[bkthunder]

Time for you to get a sense of humor.

 

To all others:

Have fun testing the "specific specifics" ;)

 

Laterz

[159th_Viper]

To clarify:

 

I do not need testing.

 

All I need is to be constructively informed of potential specific issues. I'll test and report if/as necessary.

[Sceptre]

If some form of anticheat is implemented that say, prevents modifying of the game files, will this effect mods like HD cockpits and some texture mods?

[xxJohnxx]

If some form of anticheat is implemented that say, prevents modifying of the game files, will this effect mods like HD cockpits and some texture mods?

 

I guess there probably won't be any anticheat anytime soon. So don't be worried about that.

[Breakshot]

Time for you to keep quiet and quit posting in this here thread: Your contributions to date are stupendously and ridiculously useless as evidenced from the above quote and does absolutely buggerall to aid in the 1.2.8. potential issue investigative process.

 

To all others:

 

Apart from the one issue I am guessing at (head-on smoke visibility only of ATI cards), can anybody else please inform me if there are any other issues that need investigating regarding smoke rendering, ATI and NVidia?

 

I need specific specifics, not generalizations or general specifics, please.

 

Simple, just ask ED to compare and normalise smoke rendering on ATI vs NVIDIA machines...

 

Consistency is whats needed.

[159th_Viper]

Simple, just ask ED to compare and normalise smoke rendering on ATI vs NVIDIA machines...

 

Consistency is whats needed.

 

To what standard?

 

I would argue ATI as per my provided screenshots.

 

Then again, this brings up the very issue I raised earlier as well: Smoke-effect is a specific line/s of code somewhere, yes? Said code therefore applies to all, irrespective of what particular vid card you have. If the specific code at present has two distinct results on two cards then how does one 'normalise' the effect?

 

One install coded for NVidia and another for ATI? Surely that's never gonna happen. Is it not a card-driver issue?

 

Or have I completely misunderstood the coding issue?

[blkspade]

Simple, just ask ED to compare and normalise smoke rendering on ATI vs NVIDIA machines...

 

Consistency is whats needed.

 

Considering that it seems like it could be a driver related issue, there may not even be a simple way of doing that.

[lunaticfringe]

One install coded for NVidia and another for ATI? Surely that's never gonna happen. Is it not a driver issue?

 

If it is, as we know ATI stopped performing real optimizations for DX9 years ago and carry no direction for DCS, the issue is on their side, not NVidia.

 

And that's if it is an issue at all.

[blkspade]

If it is, as we know ATI stopped performing real optimizations for DX9 years ago and carry no direction for DCS, the issue is on their side, not NVidia.

 

And that's if it is an issue at all.

 

I don't exactly follow that logic that would suggest it could be a ATI issue. Outside of producing artifacts, a graphics card is only going to render what its being told, or fail to render it at all. Its not logical to think that ATI is magically rendering a proper effect that the engine isn't telling it to. It vastly more likely that Nvidia cards are clipping the effect off.

[lunaticfringe]

There are screenshots and posts from other simmers that prove otherwise.

 

Revert to stock values in the files. Run the same profiles that Viper did and put them here. List your settings at time of capture in accordance with those Skate mentioned. And then see what happens.

 

"Oh, there's something wrong with smoke!" Useful. This is not "go fetch"; a simple scientific comparison is not difficult.

[Mustang]

ATI? ATI? you guys know that it's AMD now, the ATI name was killed off ages ago :)

Edited May 7, 2014 by Mustang

[lunaticfringe]

2. The Thickness/Appearance of Smoke can Vary depending on:

-HDR Setting

-Resolution

-FoV

-Visibility Distance

-Brightness/Contrast

-SweetFX Settings

-Internal/External View

-Pretty much any GFX Setting Dealing with FSAA/AF/Rendering.

 

And that is merely in game; because of the small amount of difference in hue and value of the smoke area versus the background sky, there is the distinct possibility that a portion of the issue may also fall under actual monitor settings, or even gamut for some specific hardware. What may show in a screenshot on one person's monitor may not actually show up on the original user's. Its also important all users performing these tests by screenshot raise the default quality value (since I recall it being 60 rather than 100), since its at a level the algorithm may squash.

 

Viper- if you made tracks of those, or a mission, put them here and let's see if those complaining will do what's required.

[Hellfire257]

I dunno about the rest of you, but I can see the smoke before I see the aircraft usually. I did have screenshots but I lost them when I did a clean 1.2.8 install. I'll try grab some when I see it happen next.

 

Running a 7950.

[SkateZilla]

If you guys are trying to Submit legit data for a bug report, you're doing it the wrong way...

 

1. Smoke Rendering has nothing to do with any ANTI-Cheat Systems of DCS for one.

 

2. The Thickness/Appearance of Smoke can Vary depending on:

-HDR Setting

-Resolution

-FoV

-Visibility Distance

-Brightness/Contrast

-SweetFX Settings

-Internal/External View

-Pretty much any GFX Setting Dealing with FSAA/AF/Rendering.

 

I'd Also add to this list:

-Display Panel Contrast/Brightness Settings

-Display Panel Color Settings. (Warm, User, Cool, etc)

-nVidia and AMD Use Different Color Profile Values...

-Aircraft Altitude/Environmental Factors

-Low, Med, High GFX Settings/Visibility Distance

 

The Text in Bold is prolly the most important,

as it's easier to spot an exhaust trail if the trail is above you;

Compared to having it at the same altitude or lower than you.

 

(easier to spot against the sky than it is to spot against terrain.)

 

There *Was* also some camera angles where the exhaust would pool behind an aircraft, allowing you to see a big poof instead of a trail. The last time I saw that was in the 1.2.6 Beta that was leaked on steam, I don't recall seeing it in later versions. But I also wasn't paying attention to it.

 

 

Both GPU's Render the Same thing,

There aren't AMD/nVidia Specific instructions in the engine, the engine Uses DIRECTX9, not AMD, Not nVidia Commands.

Edited May 7, 2014 by SkateZilla

[Wolf Rider]

Slightly OT but in line with the above -> http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/ monitor calibration

[Buzpilot]

I have not any track, but sometimes in MP I find some F-15 flying at 1900 km/h, with fuel tanks and some Missiles.

 

Also modifying the .lua they can see the Mig-29 smoke too far and they get a unrealistic advantage at close combat without EOS.

 

I think ED must add Anticheat for the .lua modify.

 

After reading through all the posts, it seem to be some misunderstanding here.

I think he meant sombody was able to fly that fast, with fuel tanks.

And he also complained it is possible to edit a .lua file somewhere, to make it possible to see smoke/exhaust, from greater distance.( Far beyond normal)

And he refered to this as a cheat that need to be included in server clients checkup, at least thats what I get out from it.

Not at all about normal behaviour on different cards.

[Breakshot]

I'd Also add to this list:

-Display Panel Contrast/Brightness Settings

-Display Panel Color Settings. (Warm, User, Cool, etc)

-nVidia and AMD Use Different Color Profile Values...

-Aircraft Altitude/Environmental Factors

-Low, Med, High GFX Settings/Visibility Distance

 

The Text in Bold is prolly the most important,

as it's easier to spot an exhaust trail if the trail is above you;

Compared to having it at the same altitude or lower than you.

 

(easier to spot against the sky than it is to spot against terrain.)

 

There *Was* also some camera angles where the exhaust would pool behind an aircraft, allowing you to see a big poof instead of a trail. The last time I saw that was in the 1.2.6 Beta that was leaked on steam, I don't recall seeing it in later versions. But I also wasn't paying attention to it.

 

 

Both GPU's Render the Same thing,

There aren't AMD/nVidia Specific instructions in the engine, the engine Uses DIRECTX9, not AMD, Not nVidia Commands.

 

Check

check

check

 

on all parameters.

 

Listen, there is no point beating around the bush. Im speaking from proven testing experience from 51st pilots. We have most of our guys on NVIDIA, apart from 2 pilots on AMD.

 

BOTH pilots on AMD cards report visuals on smoke trails from ridiculous distances, sometimes 40km if the profile is correct. All weather conditions (apart from night obviously). Side on "spread formation" the smoke is easily visible up to 15km as a clear distinct trail.

 

On the other hand all NVIDIA users in our squad lose any smoke visibility beyond 3km, with many tests with different settings.

 

How should one explain that?!

 

Obviously this has to be some sort of gfx rendering disparity when it comes to smoke.

 

PS: all drivers were latest for both gfx card types.

Edited May 10, 2014 by Breakshot

[SkateZilla]

AMD Color Profile.

[*Rage*]

AMD for the win:)

 

I really the way smoke is rendered now.