buster_dee Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 I am late to the party :) It occurred to me today that I had not received a Kickstarter email update for a while, so I checked the forum to find I missed all the fun. To be honest I always expected the Kickstarter to fail, but I still donated $122. Just like I bought COD when it was released, and every other serious WW2 flight sim ever created. The fact is that if we don't even try to support these efforts then we can't blame developers for not making anything new. I did not back RRG, or Ilya, or even ED, I backed the idea that the community still wants software companies to continue to develop historical flight sims. If the Kickstarter had failed I wasn't sure we would see another decent WW2 flight sim for a decade. So personally I am glad to hear that ED have picked up the ball. At least the project may eventually see the light of day, and surely that is the most important thing. Thanks, Dean I suffer from the same affliction. :smilewink: I hope distributors, when involved, gain some patience for developers. You can't build these toys in 6 months anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siipperi Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Wondering if we get August update. Few screenshots won't hurt anyone. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Good post, Dean. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Wondering if we get August update. Few screenshots won't hurt anyone. ;) I would imagine that the release of the Dora is the August update. :) ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
con3para Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 (edited) Not happy Well i backed $40.00 in the kickstarter pack and people were very quick to take my money back then . i paid via paypal Now i see that i have lost my six aircraft ,and I now only have two to choose from. i backed this from the beginning as a supporter...!!!! i feel ive been ripped off . i am very disappointed . and please don't dress this up as its all ok , because it isnt . first Cliffs of Dover and now this bullsh** how can i get a full refund Edited August 10, 2014 by con3para HAF TOWER / MSI z77 G43 /-i5-3570k.@ 3.4mhz / GTX 780 / Patriot 8GB. DDR3 / TM-HOTAS-warthog 00228 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cykyrios Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 I suggest you read this: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=126824 It should contain the answer to your question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavagai Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Some of us are just happy to see the project continue. Take a breather and see if your perspective doesn't change. Between 2 DCS WW2 fighters or $40 in my pocket the choice is an easy one for me.:pilotfly: P-51D | Fw 190D-9 | Bf 109K-4 | Spitfire Mk IX | P-47D | WW2 assets pack | F-86 | Mig-15 | Mig-21 | Mirage 2000C | A-10C II | F-5E | F-16 | F/A-18 | Ka-50 | Combined Arms | FC3 | Nevada | Normandy | Straight of Hormuz | Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theOden Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 .. i feel ive been ripped off.. You have. On the other hand, ED stepped in and saved you from a total disaster allowing you to get at least something out of the situation created by Luthier. Two options, contact kickstarter admins or stay here with a smile for what ED's done for you at their own cost (think twice, $40 for six planes at one P-51D $40-level?). [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Well i backed $40.00 in the kickstarter pack and people were very quick to take my money back then . i paid via paypal Now i see that i have lost my six aircraft ,and I now only have two to choose from. i backed this from the beginning as a supporter...!!!! i feel ive been ripped off . i am very disappointed . and please don't dress this up as its all ok , because it isnt . first Cliffs of Dover and now this bullsh** how can i get a full refund Proplem???? "Blyat Naaaaa" - Izlom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ec-swr Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 http://www.fighterops.com/moving/ :thumbup: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC].youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubblebeam Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 http://www.fighterops.com/moving/ :thumbup: Very helpful post. The very worst of the internet right there. To the OP there is nothing you can do. It is what it is. Kickstarter won't do anything. They have their 20% of the funds they don't care and anyone telling you to take it up with kickstarter have no idea what they're talking about. Others have tried. There are many people who feel the same way you do. All you can do is chalk it up as a lesson learned and keep your money in your pocket next time a developer wants money for development. Good Grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
con3para Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Trust me i have learnt my lesson . i wont back another project . HAF TOWER / MSI z77 G43 /-i5-3570k.@ 3.4mhz / GTX 780 / Patriot 8GB. DDR3 / TM-HOTAS-warthog 00228 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaelu Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 (edited) Let me try to describe the situation for you. Company A made a deal with Company B to create a module licensed under company's B product. Company A would have made some money out of selling that licensed product and from that money pay company B a sum. Company A doesn't have money so ask for a "risky" backing from supporters that after reading the terms of the backing deal agree and pay company A some money. When backers pay money in suck backing scheme they risck losing the money if the product does not see the daylight. It is an accepted risk... like in lottery. Company A take the money Company A does not do anything and disappear. Backers lose money Company B does not get anything also. Company B tries to salvage the situation and take whatever assets Company A produced (little) and give backers of Company A something in return for their support of a doomed idea. So Company B loses on the deal but tries to reduce the PR damage by loosing a bit more... Example... I got the Dora that I should have got from Company A for whom I pledged, from Company B. Dora is a 100% Company B product and got 0 dollars from me for it because of this good did. Now you come in Company B forums and post that... Is it clear now how it is? Edited August 10, 2014 by zaelu [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] I5 4670k, 32GB, GTX 1070, Thrustmaster TFRP, G940 Throttle extremely modded with Bodnar 0836X and Bu0836A, Warthog Joystick with F-18 grip, Oculus Rift S - Almost all is made from gifts from friends, the most expensive parts at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubblebeam Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Dora is a 100% Company B product ... Not true RRG did the cockpit for the dora Good Grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotolom Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Some of us are just happy to see the project continue. Some of us are not and would rather have their money back. Between 2 DCS WW2 fighters or $40 in my pocket the choice is an easy one for me.:pilotfly: P51-D was on sale for as low as $10. $20 per plane is not what I would have agreed to on kickstarter. ED stepped in It was advertised as a joint venture between ED and RRG from the start. If ED hadn't put their name to it nobody would have given Luthier any money. I really wonder what the deal between ED and RRG is regarding RRG's assets. If ED paid for it, then Luthier should have some money to refund backers. If RRG gave what they had developed away for free then that's fraudulent in my book. Is RRG in receivership? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flagrum Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 oh god ... not AGAIN ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaelu Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Not true RRG did the cockpit for the dora The cockpit was textured last year by ED. I don't think RRG animated it nor made the systems. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] I5 4670k, 32GB, GTX 1070, Thrustmaster TFRP, G940 Throttle extremely modded with Bodnar 0836X and Bu0836A, Warthog Joystick with F-18 grip, Oculus Rift S - Almost all is made from gifts from friends, the most expensive parts at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubblebeam Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 I don't think... I'll agree with you there. Let's just say the Dora is 90%, at the most, a company B product. These threads go nowhere because folk post when not knowing all the facts. Good Grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotolom Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 I'll agree with you there. Let's just say the Dora is 90%, at the most, a company B product. These threads go nowhere because folk post when not knowing all the facts. The reason we do not know the facts is because neither ED or RRG disclose the nature of their joint venture or the nature of ED's acquisition of the project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubblebeam Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 The reason we do not know the facts is because neither ED or RRG disclose the nature of their joint venture or the nature of ED's acquisition of the project. And unfortunately we never will. So these threads will continue to come up. Good Grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 The reason we do not know the facts is because neither ED or RRG disclose the nature of their joint venture or the nature of ED's acquisition of the project. Which is rather normal for non-public companies and certainly is not going to change in this particular instance. ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dburne Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 The reason we do not know the facts is because neither ED or RRG disclose the nature of their joint venture or the nature of ED's acquisition of the project. And they will not disclose that information. Posted by Wags "8 June 2014 Update We have been reading the discussions here and we will try to answer your questions as soon as we have concrete answers for them. The exception will be the circumstances which led to this change in product management and development. Sorry, but that simply is not going to happen due to legal agreements." So all we will know is something happened, and resulted in the departing of Ilya and most of whatever team comprised RRG. I see nothing wrong with some folks not being happy with the end result, as long as they voice their opinion respectfully and not beat a dead horse over and over. Same as those that are happy with the end result and what they get. I am a 162 dollar backer, and am not happy with Ilya that is for sure. I am glad ED is carrying the venture on - as well they should, as it really was announced as a joint venture between RRG and ED, although the Kickstarter apparently was all RRG. And I am satisfied with the rewards I am getting. For the first time ever, I participated in two " Prebuy" ventures. One being BOS, and the other DCS WWII. Both really have left a bit of a bad taste in my mouth from doing so, so I will likely not do that again. But I am glad to see WWII combat flight sims getting some development still. Don B EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | Gigabyte 4090 OC | 64 GB Corsair Vengeance 3200 MHz CL16 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |Virpil CM3 Stick w/ Alpha Prime Grip 200mm ext| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 Some of us are not and would rather have their money back. You really should not be backing projects through Kickstarter if you at any time laboured under the impression/are still labouring under the impression that you are entitled to your money back/a refund. You are not entitled to said refund. Asking for it just highlights your lack of knowledge regarding the Kickstarter terms and conditions. In any event, in these particular circumstances where another Dev team has picked up the flaming turd and ran with it, then still demanding six planes for $40 where other mortals will have to pay $300 for the privilege is disingenuous at best. Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotolom Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 So all we will know is something happened, and resulted in the departing of Ilya and most of whatever team comprised RRG. That's the fishy part. Ilya didn't vanish. He's still contracted to work for ED. Same goes for the majority of RRG who now work for ED. They must have made some deal with Ilya to aquire the assets that RRG has developed. If Ilya gave them away for free while defaulting on his depts, then that's fraud. Asking for it just highlights your lack of knowledge regarding the Kickstarter terms and conditions. "Project Creators are required to fulfill all rewards of their successful fundraising campaigns or refund any Backer whose reward they do not or cannot fulfill." Straight from the kickstarter terms of use Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madog Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 "Project Creators are required to fulfill all rewards of their successful fundraising campaigns or refund any Backer whose reward they do not or cannot fulfill." Straight from the kickstarter terms of use Yea, well, then go ahead an ask the people you backed, and not a totaly different company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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