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How to Land the Dora


wolle

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In case you haven't seen it elsewhere make sure you have takeoff assistance set to zero and auto rudder off. Seems to be on by default. Makes takeoffs easier I found.

 

Ahhhhh didn't know that. It's not something I checked as don't use them, so figured it would be off. I'll check that ASAP. Thanks mate

 

Cowboy10uk

 

 

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You sure your tailwheel is in line with the aircraft before locking it?>
Yup, 100% (outside view check before take-off)

 

BTW, if it's not, i'm going all over the place...

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Maybe try using brakes to keep it goin straight at first then use rudder when you feel its effective.

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What really changed T/O in DCS for me was pulling the stick fully back on T/O until reaching ~60 MPH / 100 km/h. You have to center it before the tail starts lifting off the ground.

 

The idea behind this is to have more control over your tail wheel since rudder isn't effective until you pick up some speed. If you leave it centered for the initial run the tail will be touching the ground but will not control the A/C.

 

Unlike Mustang, Dora is a bit specific here. You really need to tap those wheel brakes to keep her straight until the rudder becomes effective. Although most of the time I almost do not need any rudder input on the initial run.

 

I've also found that gradual power increase works best with both A/C. You do not need 100% throttle to lift off. T/O with no more than 60-70% until you get a feel for it.

 

Also - jab the rudder, do not hold it in one direction for long.

 

 

By using the same technique I showed in my Frankie video, I can easily do a two pointer in a Dora.

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Maybe try using brakes to keep it goin straight at first then use rudder when you feel its effective.

No joy man, tried that already.

 

After another 25 attempts in the last 35 mins with only 2 take-offs (the 2nd one and another lucky shot around attempt 11, don't know how i kept it up) i call it day today.

 

I must admit, in all my years of flightsimming (started out in everything i could lay my hands on on the C-64) this is the first aircraft where i do not have a single clue on how the aircaft behaves while i'm rolling down the runway. Not a single clue.

 

To stop i entered the P-51 (which i bought but really never flew) and made three 3 take-offs in a row without a single problem (take-off assist set to 0%) and it's months since i've flown this thing. But the Dora...??? Not a clue.

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Maybe a dumb question and I'm sorry if it has been posted before, but have you double checked there are not axis overlapping with your rudder control? DCS binds all sorts of stuff by default.

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WWII bomber formations | DCS P-51D: [TEST] TO distance / gross weight / temperature

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2nd flight:

Screwed up first take off and crashed same as last time by not correcting for engine yaw. Got airborne on a messy second attempt.

Did a bit of flying, then landed with ease.

 

I have one tip to share:

 

If you don't have pedals and are trying to use toe-brakes with the keyboard, remap them to be unmodified buttons. I've picked z and x. Much easier than trying to press control/alt + w.

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No joy man, tried that already.

 

After another 25 attempts in the last 35 mins with only 2 take-offs (the 2nd one and another lucky shot around attempt 11, don't know how i kept it up) i call it day today.

 

I must admit, in all my years of flightsimming (started out in everything i could lay my hands on on the C-64) this is the first aircraft where i do not have a single clue on how the aircaft behaves while i'm rolling down the runway. Not a single clue.

 

To stop i entered the P-51 (which i bought but really never flew) and made three 3 take-offs in a row without a single problem (take-off assist set to 0%) and it's months since i've flown this thing. But the Dora...??? Not a clue.

 

I'm same boat here, so I feel your pain. Only two successful takeoffs so far,and those were just luck.

Calling it a day for today. Tomorrow I'm going back to baby steps & try high speed taxis down runway at various power settings to see how I control the beast.

Don't ask me for advice on these Two Subjects:

 

1.. How to Take Off in the Dora!

2.. How to Land the Dora!

 

UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE!

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It's possible or even likely that it's user error, but it does seem hard to believe that the aircraft was accepted for service if this takeoff behavior is realistic. Predictable, stable and responsive in all flight regimes except for a fleeting interval during the takeoff run where absolutely no margin for error exists. Of course, these people also accepted for service a rocket interceptor with hypergolic propellants armed with cannon whose muzzle velocity was barely twice the aircraft's maximum speed. :D

 

For the record, I have auto-rudder and takeoff assist off, I use rudder pedals, I have confirmed that there are no axis conflicts, no funny curves or deadzones, I move all the controls before starting the takeoff run to clear out any positional memory from the previous attempt, and so forth. I have managed perhaps three successful takeoffs out of who knows how many attempts.

 

I got this frustrated with the Huey and Mi-8 at times, but all the while I knew what I was doing wrong and had a path forward to improve. With the FW-190, no matter what, drift off to one side, the left wing drops, and boom. I get the best results with the tailwheel locked by full rear stick deflection and centering the stick at 60-100 km/h, correcting direction with brakes and rudder, but it still seems either random or requiring an impossibly precise control input that I happened to drift through at exactly the right second by sheer luck whenever I manage to get airborne.

 

In any case, early days. It's a great module, I'm glad I bought it and both the software and user knowledge base will improve as time goes by.

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Don't get me wrong, i ain't complaining about the flightmodule/characteristics, i just don't understand the behaviour on take-off, that's all.

 

For those who asked: Yes, i checked my inputs for overlap (have to do it with every module/aircraft because there's always an overlap, the rudders are never on de right input by default) and yes, i do use rudder pedals (CH Pro).

 

I also had quite some problem mastering the Ka-52 when it first came out so i'm confident that i will master this little bastard too although i probably will not fly it much after i do (like the P-51). For me, both of these airplanes have nothing to search in this current environment DCS is working in.

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Personal Wish List: A6 Intruder, Vietnam theater, decent ATC module, better VR performance!

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There are several reasons why the takeoff run fails and you end up in a fireball...After you manage to smooth these out it's just another takeoff run you've done hundreds of times before with other aircraft...

 

 

1. Make sure you are aligned STRAIGHT down the runway, any deviation will give you alot of trouble trying to stay centered, sometimes over-correcting and drifting sideways at high speeds, ending up in a fireball

 

2. Don't release the tail wheel too early, if you do it before the suggested speed (170kmh), you will start dancing ALL over the runway and thus end up dead almost 100% of the time

 

3. Don't release the tail wheel too late, if you keep the lock after the suggested speed your nose will go up without sufficient takeoff speed and you will snap roll and crash

 

4. Apply full power as quickly as possible (I usually just slam the throttle forward), after set, don't touch it until clearing the runway.

 

5. You'll need to use rudder (usually right rudder) to compensate for the torque. When you do, keep it gentle and sensitive, but there is one caveat here. No matter WHAT you do, don't EVER apply opposite rudder of the direction you are correcting, this will make you drift like a Toyota.

 

Once you reach the speed to release the tail wheel lock, continue adjusting rudder slightly to keep you straight and voila, takeoff...

 

Hope this helps :)

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Keeping the RPM at 2500 as Matt suggested keeps the torque much more manageable as well - and is more than enough power on nice long concrete runways - good starting point for practise at least. It makes a big difference.

 

@ taps - thanks - couldn't remember the key strokes :)

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I dont know if it is just me but I have a hard time taking off in my own single player missions. When in muliplayer with a friend (he´s hosting) the take off goes smooth as silk. I never do those smooth take offs in "single player"

 

Anyone else experienceing this?

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You that do have problems taking off or landing, do you use rudder pedals?

 

I fly with no pedals; just Z and X. To top it off the stick base is on a stack of books so I have to reach down to move throttle.

 

What I do is lock the tail wheel. Advance the throttle as fast as I could to 2500 then I man the Z and X keys. Take off every time now. Landing on the other hand...

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Lange_666, please post 2-3 tracks of your takeoff attempts, I would like to study them. Use 100% fuel and 3250rpm. Please press rctrl+enter to display the controls indicator.

 

My experience – I crashed on the first 2 takeoff attempts, succeeded 3rd time (all at 3250rpm), of course the first takeoff without crashing wasn’t exactly a beautiful one. Succeeded on first landing attempt. Since then, I gradually got better and better, as one might expect. I am using an X52pro and no rudder pedals, just stick twist for rudder, and I’m pretty surprised you have such difficulties, especially that you said you have rudder pedals. I have wheel brakes assigned to throttle hat, but there is no need for differential wheel braking during takeoff run – rudder alone is sufficiently powerful to keep the plane straight.

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I dont know if it is just me but I have a hard time taking off in my own single player missions. When in muliplayer with a friend (he´s hosting) the take off goes smooth as silk. I never do those smooth take offs in "single player"

 

Anyone else experienceing this?

 

Different fuel levels?

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I dont know if it is just me but I have a hard time taking off in my own single player missions. When in muliplayer with a friend (he´s hosting) the take off goes smooth as silk. I never do those smooth take offs in "single player"

 

Anyone else experienceing this?

 

Different missions no doubt.

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I am the 'him' Kilrah is talking about -> :pilotfly:

 

Are there any 'multiplayer only' assists I am unaware of? I get exactly the same experience in both SP and MP (using the same mission) but for Kilrah it isn't. I don't use any assists in either SP or MP when flying by myself...

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I did a quick takeoff and landing video so people can see what I am doing to get the thing off and on the ground now that I can do it mostly without leaving parts of my plane behind.

 

Still needs lots of work (and out of interest of being fast I was way to close to initiate my landing and floated down the runway way too far when landing, but I know that), but with wide views people can see where and what all my controls are doing.

 

My hope is that A) people still having a lot more trouble can learn something and

B) People doing a lot better can critique what I am doing and teach me a thing or two.

 

http://youtu.be/NUxJQAgsMkw


Edited by xaoslaad
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There are several reasons why the takeoff run fails and you end up in a fireball...After you manage to smooth these out it's just another takeoff run you've done hundreds of times before with other aircraft...

 

 

1. Make sure you are aligned STRAIGHT down the runway, any deviation will give you alot of trouble trying to stay centered, sometimes over-correcting and drifting sideways at high speeds, ending up in a fireball

 

2. Don't release the tail wheel too early, if you do it before the suggested speed (170kmh), you will start dancing ALL over the runway and thus end up dead almost 100% of the time

 

3. Don't release the tail wheel too late, if you keep the lock after the suggested speed your nose will go up without sufficient takeoff speed and you will snap roll and crash

 

4. Apply full power as quickly as possible (I usually just slam the throttle forward), after set, don't touch it until clearing the runway.

 

5. You'll need to use rudder (usually right rudder) to compensate for the torque. When you do, keep it gentle and sensitive, but there is one caveat here. No matter WHAT you do, don't EVER apply opposite rudder of the direction you are correcting, this will make you drift like a Toyota.

 

Once you reach the speed to release the tail wheel lock, continue adjusting rudder slightly to keep you straight and voila, takeoff...

 

Hope this helps :)

 

Up to this point in the thread I've been kind of circling in on what was

causing my problems but couldn't pinpoint where my error was.

My first dozen or so attempts were failed because of stupid mistakes, then I

was having intermittent success which felt random. Thanks for helping me

find what was happening. My problem was #3. Apparently sometimes I wouldn't

begin centering the stick until 170-190, which usually ending in the

result you describe.

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There are several reasons why the takeoff run fails and you end up in a fireball...After you manage to smooth these out it's just another takeoff run you've done hundreds of times before with other aircraft...

 

 

1. Make sure you are aligned STRAIGHT down the runway, any deviation will give you alot of trouble trying to stay centered, sometimes over-correcting and drifting sideways at high speeds, ending up in a fireball

 

2. Don't release the tail wheel too early, if you do it before the suggested speed (170kmh), you will start dancing ALL over the runway and thus end up dead almost 100% of the time

 

3. Don't release the tail wheel too late, if you keep the lock after the suggested speed your nose will go up without sufficient takeoff speed and you will snap roll and crash

 

4. Apply full power as quickly as possible (I usually just slam the throttle forward), after set, don't touch it until clearing the runway.

 

5. You'll need to use rudder (usually right rudder) to compensate for the torque. When you do, keep it gentle and sensitive, but there is one caveat here. No matter WHAT you do, don't EVER apply opposite rudder of the direction you are correcting, this will make you drift like a Toyota.

 

Once you reach the speed to release the tail wheel lock, continue adjusting rudder slightly to keep you straight and voila, takeoff...

 

Hope this helps :)

 

Quoting and highlighting for truth!

 

Point 5 really is the key to getting the Dora off the runway in a smooth manner (like the P51 when you don't set rudder trim).

 

If you mistakenly try and keep using toe brakes like you have to do for taxing, it'll end in tears.

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I did a quick takeoff and landing video so people can see what I am doing to get the thing off and on the ground now that I can do it mostly without leaving parts of my plane behind.

 

http://youtu.be/NUxJQAgsMkw

 

Would be nice to repost (or remake) the video with the controle console visible (RCTRL ENTER) so one could clearly see your control input.

Win11 Pro 64-bit, Ryzen 5800X3D, Corsair H115i, Gigabyte X570S UD, EVGA 3080Ti XC3 Ultra 12GB, 64 GB DDR4 G.Skill 3600. Monitors: LG 27GL850-B27 2560x1440 + Samsung SyncMaster 2443 1920x1200, HOTAS: Warthog with Virpil WarBRD base, MFG Crosswind combat pedals, TrackIR4, Rift-S.

Personal Wish List: A6 Intruder, Vietnam theater, decent ATC module, better VR performance!

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