The Mig21 cockpit looks too "dirty"

[uboats]

I love this 'dirty' cockpit

[lucien]

play the game in lowest settings and hope that you cannot see the details :megalol:

[-Rudel-]

Keep this up, I'll make sure we release with a pink cockpit and a bobbing flower instead.

[Kayos]

Keep this up, I'll make sure we release with a pink cockpit and a bobbing flower instead.

 

Lol, I dare you :huh:

[Amuro]

I'm wondering why make they made the Bis and not the Bison, the modernized version of MiG-21.

[Justin Case]

Maybe because the Bison is stil in use, making it more difficult to find good documentation.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Justin Case

[SkateZilla]

You both are not making much sense. The F-86 looks clean, and the last of these was probably produced 50+ years ago, yet we get a clean looking plane which is great. I dont want every soviet made aircraft to look like it came from a scrapyard just because most of the planes currently in DCS are from days long gone. The wear level of a plane or helicopter should represent the timeframe is was used and the wear should be minimal because I am sure soviet or states using soviet hardware had the technology to keep aircraft clean.

 

It is a good thing that BELSIMTEK does not enforce the cliche of every russian piece of hardware having to look like a 500 year old warhorse that was used in the siege of constaninople.

 

Funny how no one objects the A10C or or any western aircraft in DCS looking pristinely ultra clean while all russian things look like scrap metal (except for BELSIMTEKS, Mi-8) and that is because the company is from belarus (?) and they know that not everything east of the berlin wall is covered in a thick layer of rust and decay.

 

If all modules would realistically represent a currently existing aircraft that is fully operational in 2014 it would not be realistic. Because I am sure it would be hard to find an F-86 today where all spare parts are readily available. The DORA would probably not have any ammo, some of the F-86 ordnance was probably not produced for decades etc.

 

So about the Mig21 for example, if the model respresented would be from 1970, it should look like a plane that was used in 1970 with a few weeks of use, and not like a thing grabbed from a museum in 2014

 

I think the Mig21 interior cockpit looks a bit too "used". Especially the dirt in the lower area of cockpit and the wear on the exposed metal left and right of the pilot and the paper age.

The textures look absoutely convincing so the quality of the model and texture is great, I just think it should look a bit less used. For example I noticed there is a considerable differenence in wear level between the KA50 cockpit (made by ED?) and the cockpits made by BELSIMTEK. FOr example, their stuff has minimal wear, which shows the aircraft is not just off the assembly line instead only has a minimal amount of wear.

 

The Mig21 cockpit however looks like it was towed off a scrapyard.

Again, not critizizing the quality of the developer work, I just would have a preferred a less used, more "minimal wear look" like on the BELSIMTEK modules.

 

I feel this contrast every time after flying the f86 or Mi-8 when I take the KA50, feels like climbing into a dirty trashcan. With the pedals looking like they were pulled out of the tchernobyl reactor ruins and sold for profit for its magical properties.

 

Suggestions: Is it possible to offer 2 texture settings? One in the current worn state and one in a more pristine condition? I know modders will probably offer that, but I vaguely assume reducing the wear on the existing textures done by the actual texture artist would be of higher quality.

 

 

it's 58 Years old, let it be dirty.

 

Most of the F-86's Flying today are re-stored Airshow Pieces.

 

That being Said, someone else can / will more than likely re-paint the cockpit as they've done with all the others.

 

The cockpit being worn and dirty gives the aircraft and awesome feeling of ruggedness, I don't see why someone would complain about it.

Edited August 26, 2014 by SkateZilla

[Sceptre]

I love the weathered cockpit, it feels more immersive IMO

[mvsgas]

I personally don't care if the DCS cockpits are weathered or new. To each his own.

 

But, talking about RL, every cockpit I have see and been inside of, looks used and weathered. T-38, F-15, F-16, A-10, F-117, etc. They all looked used and weathered. Aircraft cockpits do not get painted, doing so would required to remove every component. Months of work. Paint on aircraft, in my limited 15 year experience, is mostly for corrosion control.

 

With all that said, we can't say one way or the other is "realistic" or "accurate". In my opinion, weathered cockpits are more immersive.

Edited August 26, 2014 by mvsgas

[uboats]

I love the weathered cockpit, it feels more immersive IMO

 

strongly agree

[Dudikoff]

As stated, google cockpits and look for yourself.. Whatever the reason, whatever maintenance is done or not done, there are TONS of planes out there that look like they went thru the apocalypse... Pretty much ANY state of wear is possible so no matter what is provided by the DEVS someone will be unhappy. (They simply made the cockpit according to the pics they had at the time..)

 

I'm not saying there are not or complaining about the chosen one. To be honest, I misread your post when I was replying - I thought you were saying that it would be inaccurate to have a relatively clean cockpit. Mea culpa.

[Sceptre]

no matter what is provided by the DEVS someone will be unhappy.

 

Yes exactly, just like no matter how funny or great you think a youtube video is, it will always have dislikes :)

[Rabbit_]

Keep this up, I'll make sure we release with a pink cockpit and a bobbing flower instead.

 

:-D

[159th_Viper]

I'm wondering why make they made the Bis and not the Bison, the modernized version of MiG-21.

 

The Bison is an export version.

 

Bisons that went to India are amongst other things upgraded with the Kopyo radar suite (potentially R-77's with a further software upgrade, 27's, HMS with 73's). At a guess I would say that modelling is definitely hindered by lack of adequate documentation.

[Rammit]

Why cockpit is dirty you ask?

 

It soviet cockpit! Only capitalist pigs clean cockpit! Soviet technology is superior! We do not need to clean cockpit, cockpit clean itself!

 

[Dudikoff]

The Bison is an export version.

 

Bisons that went to India are amongst other things upgraded with the Kopyo radar suite (potentially R-77's with a further software upgrade, 27's, HMS with 73's). At a guess I would say that modelling is definitely hindered by lack of adequate documentation.

 

I thought the R-77s are supported by Indian Bisons natively? At least as it was supported by the test aircraft.. Or it's a matter of full support and mid-course updates support not being added (e.g. as in upgraded German F-4F's)?

[159th_Viper]

I thought the R-77s are supported by Indian Bisons natively?

 

Yeah they are, was just referring to the Pahzotron Kopyo radar channel upgrades that were necessary for the 77's and probably of more interest, the ability to drop the KAB-500 TV Guided Bomb: Now that right there is a pretty neat fire-and-get-the-hell-out-of-there boomstick.

[SVKSniper]

For all....;)

[Cedaway]

Keep this up, I'll make sure we release with a pink cockpit and a bobbing flower instead.

:megalol:

Wanna bet? :D

[Justin Case]

For all....;)

 

Now where have in seen that other cockpit...

[NeilWillis]

I guess it is all down to whether you want to fly it, or look at it. It's an old, venerable, workhorse. Stuff that gets used, gets dirty. I hardly think it is something exclusively the domain of ex Soviet block aircraft. My own A-10C has a furry seat cover, and has definitely seen a lot of wear and tear.

 

Someone will no doubt mod the MiG-21Bis cockpit along the way. In the meantime, just concentrate on counting the rivets, watching the sun glint off the cockpit canopy at sunset, and think yourself lucky you're not going to get all that crud all over you when you fly inverted.

[Abburo]

And we are wondering why we don't receive to many updates from devs ... !!! ???? :D

[stray cat]

it's 58 Years old, let it be dirty.

 

Most of the F-86's Flying today are re-stored Airshow Pieces.

 

That being Said, someone else can / will more than likely re-paint the cockpit as they've done with all the others.

 

The cockpit being worn and dirty gives the aircraft and awesome feeling of ruggedness, I don't see why someone would complain about it.

 

This makes no sense. If DCS would follow the standard of every aircraft being available in 2014 and not "moving back in time" then you sure as hell would not find working ammo for certain planes or spare parts because they have not been produced for 60-30 years. You really think there is a fully working F-86 that is 100% working as it was in 1949? With original HVAR and GAR missiles? So by your age logic, we would have to deal with firing weapons that (if you could find them in some museum) have their internal parts rusted for 60 years? If the guns weapon,s spare parts and ammo are in working condition in the game it is reasonable to expect the plane to be in a similar pristine state.

 

Keep this up, I'll make sure we release with a pink cockpit and a bobbing flower instead.

 

Would it be possible to simply remove some wear layers on the original texture and release it on the forums so players can use it as a mod? The original artist simply removing the layers would be a much better mod than a modder could do by painting over the wear again.

 

 

Also about immersion. I think overly worn soviet made aircraft are less immersive because they just repeat the cliche of everything east of the berlin wall being rusted all over.

 

But I think it is a bit not smart to make a blanket statement by modeling every soviet aircraft like it was towed off a scrapyard because the countries using them were broke as hell during the 1980s-1990s.

 

BELSIMTEK showed that you can have a convincing looking Mi-8 that looks in near pristine condition and look soviet at the same time with red stars and cyrillics all over it.

 

The game should be consisten in wear (or offer 2 different options) and not base it on wether the country using that aircraft is broke or not.

[NeilWillis]

I am afraid your argument about age doesn't hold up at all. The MiG is still in service with a lot of nations. It has had a very long service life. The F-86F didn't. As for the fact that it is eastern block meaning it is rusty - where do you get that idea from? I don't for a moment think Leatherneck have produced a worn cockpit look because it was a Russian aircraft. Why would that have any bearing at all? Just your prejudice I feel.

 

There are precisely 2 Soviet block aircraft modelled to the high standards of DCS as opposed to the earlier stuff from FC3. One is worn, and the other, as you so rightly stated, isn't. Statistically, the Soviet block stuff is currently 50% worn, 50% unworn!!!!

 

If anything, I would suggest that a pristine MiG-21Bis would be very out of character all things considered.

 

Who says that the Mig won't have a spring clean at some point courtesy of a contributor here?

 

Mind you I do take some comfort in knowing you have nothing more to worry about than the state of cleanliness of the cockpit. It says a LOT about the quality of that particular module.

[Sceptre]

 

Mind you I do take some comfort in knowing you have nothing more to worry about than the state of cleanliness of the cockpit. It says a LOT about the quality of that particular module.

 

I know right? Just what I was thinking