ILS landing

[Vinny002]

Hi, guys!

 

I looked at the manual but I still don't understand how to land the A-10C using the ILS. Please give me the detailed step-by-step instructions on how to land the A-10C using the ILS. I know how to the ILS radio to 110.30,110.50, ect. Thanks!

 

Cheers,

Vincent

[Mike Busutil]

[Vinny002]

Hi, Mike Busutil!

 

Great! Thanks!

 

Cheers,

Vincent

[PFunk1606688187]

I'm no sure if that vid was made before or after the patch that fixed the command steering bars. Its more than a year old so I'm gonna guess it was before.

 

Look up the command steering bars in the A-10C manual. They make flying the ILS a lot easier.

[kontiuka]

Good video. The one thing I'm not sure about though is the vertical yellow steering bar. I don't think it's tied to the ILS. I think it's only tied to the course setting on the HSI. Could be wrong though.

[PFunk1606688187]

Command Steering bars should steer you onto a maximum 30 degree bank to intercept the radial dialed into the CDI Course Knob from the nav source that you've activated on the Navigation Mode Select Panel.

 

The only thing the vertical bar is supposed to do is guide you to intercept whatever raw data you're receiving from your instruments. If the ILS is active the vertical bar should steer you to the CDI course to intercept that ILS localiser signal. The CDI is called a Deviation Indicator because it references deviations from a nav source, ergo it cannot operate without one, be it ILS, TACAN, or GPS.

 

This is true to real life on any aircraft. You always have to dial in the final course for every ILS approach, even on a 787 Dreamliner (though the computer does it automatically for you these days).

Edited August 29, 2014 by P*Funk

[effte]

No, an ILS does not require you to enter the final approach course. If you, as in the A-10, have a HSI rather than a pure CDI, setting the course roughly right will make your life easier, but it doesn't change the CDI indication or affect the ILS receiver. The command steering does require a more or less correct course though.

[PFunk1606688187]

No, an ILS does not require you to enter the final approach course. If you, as in the A-10, have a HSI rather than a pure CDI, setting the course roughly right will make your life easier, but it doesn't change the CDI indication or affect the ILS receiver. The command steering does require a more or less correct course though.

 

Thats what I meant, the CDI link to the Command Steering bars. As a matter of procedure you always enter the course though. Aviation is generally a system of overcaution to make up for confusion during task saturation or the complacency of consistent success. I still wouldn't want to fly an ILS with the course wrong in zero visibility til minimums. I don't think most people's brains would do well under those conditions.

[sgstewart]

When you enter the runway heading use the heading that is on your kneeboard which is R Shift + K and [ ] to change pages. Runway headings are map reference headings on a flat map and are not the true magnetic headings for a round earth.

 

Example:

 

Batumi airport the landing heading is 126 and they always round it up so it will say land on runway 13. The magnetic heading if you look at the kneeboard map is 119.

 

The A-10 uses a magnetic compass so you must use the magnetic heading. On the HSI enter 119 and all of your ILS lines will line up perfect.

 

Here is a track with me landing on 10m vis fog. Click on the download arrow at the top of this page.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bye5pO27OugNTXZNMm1HN2hGc1k/edit?usp=sharing

Edited August 29, 2014 by sgstewart

[effte]

Runway headings and final approach courses are always given as magnetic. The real FAC for Batumi is 126°M, as per the official plates (UGSB-IAC-13-ILS 2011-07-28 ). 5°E variation, so 131°T.

 

If the magnetic heading was indeed 119°, it'd be runway 12 rather than 13. (BTW, runway headings are rounded to the nearest ten degrees, not up, to create runway numbers.)

 

IIRC, it was rwy 12/30 in DCS initially, so that may be what's lingering behind in your kneeboard information? Not sure if the variations are still screwed up in-game, perhaps making 119°M match what is in the simulation.

[txmtb]

In the sim Batumi is 119.5 and 299.5, according to HAR's in the A-10C CDU, regardless of what it is supposed to be.

I just went through and updated all the kneeboard plates since I've been into IFR navigation lately for some silly reason.

Edited August 30, 2014 by txmtb

[effte]

Amazing that they can't throw a few hours at getting that fixed, over the course of however many years it's been.

 

IFR is heaps of fun. :)

[PFunk1606688187]

This is always one of the weakest aspects of DCS. I'd love a civilian aircraft project for DCS just so that someone would have to revise these parts of the game.

[txmtb]

Amazing that they can't throw a few hours at getting that fixed, over the course of however many years it's been.

 

IFR is heaps of fun. :)

 

 

I've really enjoyed it, DCS World could be used for so much more than it currently is.

Using offsets from the airports on multi leg trips is what really showed how wrong the charts can be compared to what's in the sim, or at least for what I wanted to do.

[PFunk1606688187]

There's a reason virtual wings tend to make their own charts for DCS.

[Snoopy]

And FYI, ED did not develop the charts included in DCS World.

[cichlidfan]

Wee Update on this issue: Confirmed and verified that Batumi AB runway heading as per ME is the Magnetic heading and as a consequence accords with current RL charts of True Heading 13/31.

 

Error at Batumi as a result of an HSI-offset issue which is currently being addressed. Runway is aligned as it should be - HSI is not.

 

Unfortunately, that was posted in October, 2011.

[sgstewart]

Does not matter what it use to be I just know what it is now all ILS line up perfect with the headings on the kneeboard. If you want to use the ILS indicators then you have to use the kneeboard headings until they can fix it.

[Thick8]

The LOZ 2.1 profile has all of the charts included. You can print them out, laminate them and put them on a ring. very simple. This is an example of how I catch the glide slope. Vaziani runway 14 true heading is 135. Subtract the +5.6 and I get 129.5ish. I set the HSI pointer to this heading. At about 20 miles out from the airport I call in for landing . Turn to the heading and set the ALT baro as instructed. Slow to 200Kts and make altitude 3000Ft. enable the bars. Watch the HSI alignment bar. when It starts to move towards alignment follow it to the runway heading. Disengage the HSI and engage the ILS buttons. I'm now 10 miles out lined up on the runway. I set my heading carrot to 3 degrees down (300 ft drop for each mile traveled) and ride the bars in. Slow to 189 knots. Lower flaps. At 5 miles out I contact tower and lower gear. slow to 150 Knots. Flair and full airbrake to catch the ball right before touchdown. After a few times you can do it in full fog where you can't see the runway until your almost on it.

You probably know this but attitude= speed and throttle=altitude. So you never chase the horizontal bar with the stick but with the throttle.

Edited August 31, 2014 by Thick8

[Chief1942]

Something amiss?

 

Watched the video that Mike posted to help with ILS use. Fortunately, if I am using the A-10C standalone (CD version), it works as advertised. But when I fly the A-10C in DCS World I have yet been able to get the horozontal steering needle even to appear at all. With the standalone A-10C it is "parked" at the bottom as it should be until it gets a signal. But it simply is not there in the DCSW A-10C, the verticle needle is present. Anybody have any suggestions as to how I get it working correctly in the DCSW? Getting tired of bouncing back and forth between the two iterations just to practice ILS approaches.

[Flagrum]

Watched the video that Mike posted to help with ILS use. Fortunately, if I am using the A-10C standalone (CD version), it works as advertised. But when I fly the A-10C in DCS World I have yet been able to get the horozontal steering needle even to appear at all. With the standalone A-10C it is "parked" at the bottom as it should be until it gets a signal. But it simply is not there in the DCSW A-10C, the verticle needle is present. Anybody have any suggestions as to how I get it working correctly in the DCSW? Getting tired of bouncing back and forth between the two iterations just to practice ILS approaches.

Maybe this helps: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1898669&postcount=64 ?

[Chief1942]

Thanks Flagrum, I read about that doing a search of the forums previously and had tried to make sure I turned off the "steerpoint" button when pushing the ILS and/or the TACAN buttons on the Nav Panel. It still didn't appear to work so I thought it was something different between the DCSW A-10C and the CD version. Seems that there is a difference visually/functionally between the two iterations as the horozontal steering needle is always present at the bottom of the ADI in the CD version and not in the DCSW version. Probably due to updates and the pursuit of more realism and accuracy in the DCSW version since they no longer update the CD version. Long story short, I think I have it down now, so off to practice, practice, practice. Again, thanks for the feedback.

[Flagrum]

Thanks Flagrum, I read about that doing a search of the forums previously and had tried to make sure I turned off the "steerpoint" button when pushing the ILS and/or the TACAN buttons on the Nav Panel. It still didn't appear to work so I thought it was something different between the DCSW A-10C and the CD version. Seems that there is a difference visually/functionally between the two iterations as the horozontal steering needle is always present at the bottom of the ADI in the CD version and not in the DCSW version. Probably due to updates and the pursuit of more realism and accuracy in the DCSW version since they no longer update the CD version. Long story short, I think I have it down now, so off to practice, practice, practice. Again, thanks for the feedback.

The function of the steering bars of the ADI was wrong and was corrected with, I think, 1.2.6. So, yes, very likely there are differences now between the current version and the CD version. There was a lengthy discussion about it back then when the fix was incorporated: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=115053&page=10

[Chief1942]

Thanks again. That was a very informative thread. I don't know why I missed it when I did a forum search regarding ILS procedures. I think it's one of the "truisms" of flight simming, "We ALWAYS have more to learn!":smartass: