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Takeoff and gear dynamic seem off.

Buznee

By Buznee
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26-J39

26-J39

Posted
Posted

I have to agree with the OP, it just doesn't look right at all.

 

Spring and dampening rates look too stiff and when the airframe gets light on her feet it's like the aircraft is dancing or bouncing from left to right on the main gear.

 

Just my opinion however. :)

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JaNk0

JaNk0

Posted
Posted
Most individuals will start to take off in an improper manner in the MiG-21. It is imperative that you pull back and lift the nose, otherwise the bouncing will be excessive.

 

Do note that the suspension system is being tweaked constantly.

 

The best take-off video made public so far is this one by UVP-CZ. AFAIK the MiG-21 is being flown by a former MiG-21 pilot. Starts at 2:52.

 

Out of curiosity, did the UVP pilot say anything about it?

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Grizzly1606688174

Grizzly1606688174

Posted
Posted (edited)

I still think it looks overdone. Like there is a bit too much mass moving too fast from one side to another. That vid when seen outside from the exterior, it looks like the Mig doesnt wheigh anything while doing it.

But I dont know really, I should trust you guys.. ^^

 

But nice video. Dude knows what he is doing!


Edited by <Grizzly>
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Mrgud

Mrgud

Posted
Posted

The best take-off video made public so far is this one by UVP-CZ. AFAIK the MiG-21 is being flown by a former MiG-21 pilot. Starts at 2:52.

 

 

Really nice handling. It's a shame that subtitles are not in English. I can understand just a little bit, but not much.

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Buznee

Buznee

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I have to agree with the OP, it just doesn't look right at all.

 

Spring and dampening rates look too stiff and when the airframe gets light on her feet it's like the aircraft is dancing or bouncing from left to right on the main gear.

 

Just my opinion however. :)

 

agreed., especially when the nose wheel comes off the ground. I wonder if the main wings are tip stalling causing the roll attitude to jitter back and forth onto each gear.. I guess we shall see

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Grizzly1606688174

Grizzly1606688174

Posted
Posted (edited)

Here's a bit of comparison from outside views..

 

Look here..

 

Now look here.. (4:05)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCZIdloZu8g&feature=player_detailpage#t=245

 

And finally and especially..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=TC6mE5bNwI8#t=47

 

 

I have not seen that extreme jitter like the DCS version, in any RL mig-21 movieclip.

It will be interesting to see what the final version will come up with. But they look very smooth on takeoff in real life.


Edited by <Grizzly>
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Dirty Rotten Flieger

Dirty Rotten Flieger

Posted
Posted (edited)

Here is inside the cockpit of real Mig21 on touch down... looks a bit lively.

 

 

 

The sketchy takeoff and landings are my favorite thing about this plane to tell the truth. The high landing speeds must be very intimidating when you first try it. If the instability is technically a little over done it may still convey the overall impression a real world pilot gets when he hits the runway at over 330km/h in this tiny jet. Maybe we just need some more practice.

 

Rebound damping on the main gear shock absorbers doesn't seem to be working as well as it does in some of the footage I have to admit.


Edited by Dirty Rotten Flieger
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Harle

Harle

Posted
Posted
In the game, runways are made of square concrete block things(not a native english speaker). In that video the runway is smooth, thats why the mig runs steady. On runways made of concrete, i bet the ride is bumpy as hell :)

 

I second that. Most runways here on Sakhalin are made of such slabs with grass growing in between the seams.

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Corrigan

Corrigan

Posted
Posted

I seriously doubt that's modelled in the sim. Besides, there are plenty of flat asphalt runways in the game, like at Batumi. I dare say the MiG bounces just as much there.

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Justin Case

Justin Case

Posted
Posted
Here is inside the cockpit of real Mig21 on touch down... looks a bit lively.

 

 

 

The sketchy takeoff and landings are my favorite thing about this plane to tell the truth. The high landing speeds must be very intimidating when you first try it. If the instability is technically a little over done it may still convey the overall impression a real world pilot gets when he hits the runway at over 330km/h in this tiny jet. Maybe we just need some more practice.

 

Rebound damping on the main gear shock absorbers doesn't seem to be working as well as it does in some of the footage I have to admit.

Yes but that video was shot with a small camera held up at half an arm lenght...

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Tetra

Tetra

Posted
Posted
Here's a bit of comparison from outside views..

 

Look here..

 

Now look here.. (4:05)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCZIdloZu8g&feature=player_detailpage#t=245

 

And finally and especially..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=TC6mE5bNwI8#t=47

 

 

I have not seen that extreme jitter like the DCS version, in any RL mig-21 movieclip.

It will be interesting to see what the final version will come up with. But they look very smooth on takeoff in real life.

 

Yeah there certainly seems to be considerably less jittering in the real aircraft on take-off. Am quite happy to accept it if the simulation is correct, but from all videos I have seen so far the real Mig seems to be much more stable. Would very much like to know if the way the sim behaves now is intended/correct or not?

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Dolphin887

Dolphin887

Posted
Posted
the more you murmur... the more our kids get a chance to fly this damn thing and we don't :(

 

Bill, you made me laugh :lol:

 

Anyway, suspension is among the highest priorities to me.

I was never completely satisfied how suspension behaves.

Power through superb knowledge, training and teamwork.

 

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159th_Viper

159th_Viper

Posted
Posted
The high landing speeds must be very intimidating when you first try it. If the instability is technically a little over done it may still convey the overall impression a real world pilot gets when he hits the runway at over 330km/h in this tiny jet.

 

That's the beauty of this Jet - you only need about 600m to bring her to a stop from a high-speed landing so don't be scared to bring her in fast.

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Kuky

Kuky

Posted
Posted

I think what is wrong with ground handling is that as the plane goes faster, same as with fast cars, the un-eveness of the road is less noticeable because at high speed the wheel's shock absorbers are absorbing most of the impact of the tire with bumbs on the road... so same should be with aircraft on take-off and landing. When slow the plane should be wobling noticably, but as speed increases (I think 100Km and more) the wobling should be reduced.

 

Most of you drive cars... pay attention as you drive really slow... you will fee every bump on the road, even if the road seems perfectly straight and even... but as soon as you pick up some speed, the car is driving much calmer.

 

So in short, very small bumps (like parts on runways where conrete blocks join) should hardly be felt at high speed, but large very gradual un-even surface is more felt at high speed (that's because the impact frequency of the bump is very high for small bumps and very high for large gradual "bumps" - think of the runway as very long wavelength looking surface)

 

I can't really put the right words how to describe this :(

No longer active in DCS...

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Grizzly1606688174

Grizzly1606688174

Posted
Posted

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hpInBIsNeuo#t=2179

 

Just a bit more evidence to the nay-sayers.

No rolly-rolly bumpy tipping plane on takeoff.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hpInBIsNeuo#t=1655

 

Or landing.. And notice how the nose stays up due to windspeeds. Not engine thrust.

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  • 2 months later...
CoBlue

CoBlue

Posted
Posted
Bill, you made me laugh :lol:

 

Anyway, suspension is among the highest priorities to me.

I was never completely satisfied how suspension behaves.

Hi,

Have the suspension issue been addressed or is it still the same?

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Art-J

Art-J

Posted
Posted (edited)

Golo, there were still some problems in 1.2.12.

 

Yesterday I did a flight with 4 UB pods and 80% of fuel (to check whether UB animation bug is still there - yep it is). Landed a bit overweight - with empty pods and 2200 l of fuel. Didn't notice the infamous pull to the left during the roll, nor the leaning to the sides when the airplane was standing still.

 

Today, however, did a flight with "light" config (~ 1000 l before takeoff, clean). No pulling, but the damn leaning was there - at least before takeoff, because after landing it disappeared too :D.

 

More testing will be necessary, but it's such a difficult issue to track down.


Edited by Art-J

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CoBlue

CoBlue

Posted
Posted
DCS World 1.2.11 Change Log

DCS MiG-21bis

Overhauled Gear & Suspension to yield more stable taxiing, landing and takeoff behaviour.

Thank you!

That convinced me.....Mig-21Bis bought :thumbup: :lol:

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