TurboHog Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) Before rearming I was able to climb according to the climb-out charts. (Staying below 7000m ofc, because above 7000m performance differs significantly from reality, see: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=130722) After rearming I took the same loadout and things were different. I could not climb at 2000m on full power. In fact, I could barely keep the speed constant while flying level. So I decided to do a repair, ask for a clean configuration and then ask for the usual loadout again. But it was not a fresh start and performance was still seriously degraded. I have included the SARPP file. This flight was on a multiplayer server. I will try to replicate the situation in single player. Climb-out 1: between 512 sec and 650 sec to an altitude of 2500m. Perfect result and very realistic climb performance Climb-out 2 (after rearm/refuel): between 4564 sec and 5000 sec to an altitude of 4000m. Notice speed, rpm and altitude between 5075 sec and 5142 sec. Full power, climbed only 200m but speed went down rapidly. Climb-out 3 (after repair, rearm, refuel): Between 6562 sec and 6991 sec to and altitude of 2200m. See the difference with climb-out 1? Both on the same power setting! Notice speed, rpm and altitude between 6800 sec and 6989 sec. Speed is constant and power is full military. It was good for only 200m of climbing while altitude was around only 2000m(!!!) In a Graph (Thank you xxJohnxx): Both images show the same scale and can thus be laid on top of eachother. Engine power, loadout, atmosphere all identical. The relation speed/altitude clearly isn't. Blue = altitude Yellow = speed Dark blue = RPM Good climb: Bad climb: >NOT A BUG/PROBLEM< Solution: I noticed that after Rearm and Refuel the Nose cone Switch goes off. Check this. And so youve less power. Sorry for wasting your time and thanks for the quick reply Philip...SARPP_DATA_2014_08_21_15_40.rar Edited September 21, 2014 by TurboHog 'Frett' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I guess this was behind Tango's anomalous 12 min climb earlier then. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboHog Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 I guess this was behind Tango's anomalous 12 min climb earlier then. I will discuss that with him. I thought exactly the same thing! 'Frett' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philipp2 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I noticed that after Rearm and Refuel the Nose cone Switch goes off. Check this. And so youve less power. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Interesting! Let's hope that's it. Can't check atm, not at home. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey45 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 The degrading of severl things are modeled.. The only way to make sense out of change is to plunge into it, move with it, and join the dance. "Me, the 13th Duke of Wybourne, here on the ED forums at 3 'o' clock in the morning, with my reputation. Are they mad.." https://ko-fi.com/joey45 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboHog Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 I noticed that after Rearm and Refuel the Nose cone Switch goes off. Check this. And so youve less power. Haha you're right! :lol: Disregard first post! 'Frett' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 The degrading of severl things are modeled.. Engine stress should reset upon engine shut-down (manual p. 21), and if not then, certainly when the aircraft is repaired by the groud crew. If it is engine wear, it's not realistic (effectively broken aircraft after one climb following SOP?) and subject to a bug in it not being repairable. EDIT: see above. Philipp2, you lovely man. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboHog Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) I was flying the single player test, looked at my nose cone switch. And it was off while I certainly turned it on (but before rearm refuel) Turned it on mid-flight and had good climb performance Thanks for the stupidly simple solution. By the way: My generators stopped working from time to time. It shows how well made this sim is. Edited September 21, 2014 by TurboHog 'Frett' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 So there's still a (much more benign) bug here, then; or should the switch come off during the work for some reason? Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philipp2 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 No if you're make the cone switch on its on. But after rearm, refuel, the canopy will open as a sign that all liquids etc. have been refilled. Then you will check the cone switch. Otherwise the engine will not produce enough power. So please make new test :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Right, but why should switches change positions in the cockpit after repair? Sounds like a bug to me. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dejjvid Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 It's a bug, and LN know it, so it will get fixed asap. i7 8700K | GTX 1080 Ti | 32GB RAM | 500GB M.2 SSD | TIR5 w/ Trackclip Pro | TM Hotas Warthog | Saitek Pro Flight Rudder [sigpic]http://www.132virtualwing.org[/sigpic] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyb0rg Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Right, but why should switches change positions in the cockpit after repair? Sounds like a bug to me. Not a bug, a feature. In the manual : " You might notice this when your canopy opens (if it was closed), some switches flipping back into the OFF position and aircraft fluids recovering to normal values. Watch the compressed air manometer (RH61), pilot’s oxygen (LV39) and engine oxygen (LV2) indicators to assess whether your systems are repaired. " :thumbup: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Asteroids ____________________________________________ Update this :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ff4life4 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Are there any other switches that go back to off, after a refuel/rearm. i have only notices the nose cone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Oh, cool. I still wonder why though. But I guess there are more pressing issues for the devs to address, and I can certainly live with this quirk. Glad to get this sorted out! Now we only need to get the cruising performance up to scratch too. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!! This is why restarting the mission made a difference!! I was changing the load-out in real-time (to add pods etc..)!!! Let me test!!! Does this explain the whole 6000 m/7000 m finding we made last night as well? Related: If the nose cone was NOT moving position, then going supersonic should cause serious engine problems due to the shockwave? I've just become slightly skeptical. Best regards, Tango. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTFDarkEagle Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Aaaah! Now THAT is interesting to know!! Lukas - "TIN TIN" - 9th Shrek Air Strike Squadron TIN TIN's Cockpit thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ff4life4 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!! This is why restarting the mission made a difference!! I was changing the load-out in real-time (to add pods etc..)!!! Let me test!!! Not to go too off-topic, but seeing tangos avatar while reading that made me spit my beer out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Does this explain the whole 6000 m/7000 m finding we made last night as well? Related: If the nose cone was NOT moving position, then going supersonic should cause serious engine problems due to the shockwave? I've just become slightly skeptical. Best regards, Tango. Which finding? I think we all concluded that performance below 7000 m was fine during the climbs as regards fuel consumption and power, but the high alt. cruising problem can't be related to this (since I've started all my small tests, which corroborate yours, with a fresh aircraft at altitude). It is perhaps wise to carefully consider the configuration of the aircraft before we do more tests. Even starting the mission hot at altitude might need further configuration of systems to get the full performance. Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) Hmm... as I thought. Regarding the 6000 m/7000 m observation - above this altitude, performance drops off significantly, and rapidly, above this altitude. Even after triple-checking all switches before departure, passing ~6500 m, the aircraft performance reduced, and I was unable to climb above 7800 m with 2x R-3R and center line 490 L tank. It appears the problem persists. :( Best regards, Tango. Edited September 21, 2014 by Tango 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ff4life4 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Thanks Tango for your testing. Before reading this, I noticed that at high altitude, I coudn't maintain airspeed without A/B. For a high performace jet, I just felt this wasn't right. The Sabre, with a less T/W ratio, has much better performance at higher altitudes. Hopefully the Leatherneck team, can fix the FM, so we can keep enjoying our 21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I'm sure they will! I know they're working like crazy. Best regards, Tango. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrigan Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) Right, but the problem this thread was about has been resolved. I suggest we keep discussing in the other one! I'm sure they will! I know they're working like crazy. Best regards, Tango. Yep! I have Cobra on skype and he's staying up to crazy hours working on stuff, and I'm sure the rest of the team have similar workloads. Edited September 21, 2014 by Corrigan Win10 x64 | SSDs | i5 2500K @ 4.4 GHz | 16 GB RAM | GTX 970 | TM Warthog HOTAS | Saitek pedals | TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldur Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I noticed that after Rearm and Refuel the Nose cone Switch goes off. Check this. And so youve less power. Noticed exactly this, too. Thought I accidently switched it off, but after seeing this thread, I highly doubt I did something wrong. Good to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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