Operation "Blue Flag" - 24/7 PvP Campaign - ROUND 2

[Esac_mirmidon]

Also Blue side guys are playing very well and cooperative.

 

They are doing a very good job.

 

I hate those amraams XDDD Maybe someone could hack they payloads to reduce it to 4.....

[Teknetinium]

Always a pleasure to fly whit you Falcon and Esac_mirmidon.

Blue Flag 24/7 is a great event and is a very big addition to DCS community.

 

In future I wish 373/IAF to arrange same type of event aimed for only squads that could run once a week.

This could solve the pilots issues and at the same time give a bigger immersion for all involved. I really like the idea you are running now and would like it to continue as it is. What Im suggesting is to do same thing only once a week aimed for squads. Im sure you are overwhelmed whit workload and adding another campaign to that is very hard. But we should work together and divide the workload if possible.

 

Keep up the good work, I wish you all the best!!!

Edited September 14, 2015 by Teknetinium

[Shadow_1stVFW]

Lone wolf perspective:

 

A buddy and me registered for this after finding it this weekend. He flies the A-10A I fly the A-10C. We both fly in a Virtual Wing in a different sim and we just like DCS.

 

We'd like a little more A-10As, just because is hard to get them and an A-10C at the same time. They are only in two bases, but it's not that bad. The real issue is when it's busy and we can't leave from the same base because kutaisi only has 4 LW A-10Cs.

 

We would like to see some more flight channels on the TS, we can't use yours because we communicate a lot when we fly and we need to in order to be effective. We fly on or wings' TS so we can do that. We do our best to both put out what we're doing on team chat, and ask what other people are doing and try and coordinate. But people just chatting in game makes that hard.

 

We really like this and I think it should stay. We haven't had too many problems. I see a lot of talk about too many lone wolf spots. But I think there are just enough.

 

Our suggestions:

-A little more A-10A availability

-Maybe on lone wolf bases 6 instead of 4 A-10Cs (helps us when I can't get a C spot at the same base as an A)

-flight channels in TS so guys flying together can communicate and not clog it for everyone else

-some weather would be nice, just wind and some clouds. Top level realism there.

-Last, I don't know what's up. But maybe 4 hours instead of 3 hour game time? We usually run out of time if we don't start as soon as the mission starts.

Edited September 15, 2015 by Shadow_1stVFW

[HiJack]

And maybe respect the fact that the more organized squadrons have rules that don’t apply to lone wolfs and other squadrons.

[QuiGon]

I would also like to have 4 (or maybe 5) hours instead of 3. Especially for chopper pilots 3h are pretty short since it takes a lot of time to get somewhere. Because of that it's often not worth it to set up EWR stations and stuff liek that, because they'll disappear on restart.

 

I also like the idea of campaign commanders that are more than just AWACS controllers, which have a plan in mind and request assets and direct players as needed to accomplish a task. I think that would really improve the overall teamplay.

[Ashilta]

I agree, either more time for choppers work to pay off, or the location of deployed units needs to be maintained between restarts. A chopper might fly two hours to put EWR in a good place only for it to disappear an hour later...

[xcom]

Thanks guys, we will consider adding time.

 

This was initially a way to avoid some lag issues that we saw occur after 3 hours, now that the server has been upgraded and that we have mitigated most of the lag issues we saw, we might to a test to increase restart time.

[gregzagk]

I also like the idea of campaign commanders that are more than just AWACS controllers, which have a plan in mind and request assets and direct players as needed to accomplish a task. I think that would really improve the overall teamplay.

 

:thumbup:

 

Now that the server crashed only once after 3 days we can move forward on adding more stuff. Improving also things that the guys mentioned above combined with the 1.5 that should be on the way we believe we will have some good results.

 

Greg

[RightStuff]

Operation "Blue Flag" - 24/7 PvP Campaign - ROUND 2

 

Was a great day (night) yesteday. Keep on!

 

ACK to the request to shorten the restart-frequency (if possible).

 

Furthermore (if I have not overseen it) a countdown timer on the website will help to judge, if it's worth to start a trip with a chopper before a restart occurs.

 

Thanks again to Greg & team for this great event!

[gregzagk]

Furthermore (if I have not overseen it) a countdown timer on the website will help to judge, if it's worth to start a trip with a chopper before a restart occurs.

 

Yes it's there but not as a countdown. It counts forward the time since each mission restart.

So you need to check how many minutes it needs to get to 03:00 hours.

 

http://opblueflag-buddyspike.rhcloud.com/

 

"session elapsed time: 1 hrs 5 mins"

 

If we increase the time of each mission session this will also change.

 

Greg

[QuiGon]

Was a great day (night) yesteday. Keep on!

 

ACK to the request to shorten the restart-frequency (if possible).

 

Furthermore (if I have not overseen it) a countdown timer on the website will help to judge, if it's worth to start a trip with a chopper before a restart occurs.

 

Thanks again to Greg & team for this great event!

 

It's already there on the live map ;)

Well, it's not a countdown, but the mission time is shown there and if it reaches 3h it's over.

 

Edit: sniped

[Pikey]

And maybe respect the fact that the more organized squadrons have rules that don’t apply to lone wolfs and other squadrons.

 

I'd respect that if you used the whisper channels and worked with others in the spirity of community and strategic play :)

 

The TAW policy of no swearing on TeamSpeak under the threat of internal disciplinary action isn't an act of being more organised, it's a reflection of the age group it caters for.

[Ashilta]

Ladies, please. Handbags down. This is about collaboration and having fun together.

[RuskyV]

Ladies, please. Handbags down. This is about collaboration and having fun together.

 

yes it is about having fun together, not passwording themselves behind their channel in TS when we need to be able to contact them for help if needed. why even bother joining a community server like blue flag if your not going to interact with anyone else apart form your own squad!

[xcom]

Hey guys,

 

This is all about community, but each squadron can maintain their channel and squadron procedures as they like.

We do encourage everyone to put on channel commander on TS, this way you can communicate between squadrons/channels for each side and still have the option to use squadron regulations, brevity, just a quieter channel etc..

 

How to setup the channel commander is explained on the last page of the SOP -

http://www.foinikas.org/ftp/public/DCS_World/Briefings/Buddy%20Spike/SOP%20OPERATION%20BLUE%20FLAG.pdf

[RuskyV]

That's all vary well but at the end of the day squadron slots that are taken up and closed off from everyone else is not really promoting teamwork and they may as well be just lone wolfs without their own fixed airbase....

[xcom]

Lone wolves can take slots from all airbases.

So if all slots at a certain airbase are taken just take from the nearby airbase.

[Ashilta]

That's all vary well but at the end of the day squadron slots that are taken up and closed off from everyone else is not really promoting teamwork and they may as well be just lone wolfs without their own fixed airbase....

 

What you perhaps don't realise is that I'm a member of TAW. I don't necessarily agree with passwording our TS channel on BlueFlag but that doesn't mean you'll find me squirreled away in there. Some of TAW do come out and about and collaborate; other have young children around and no headsets and so to avoid the swearing they've gone into their own channel.

 

As for your comment about people taking up slots for Squadrons and not using them; Sochi was getting battered last night, and so rather than take an F-15 from a nearby airfield, I took a TAW slot from VZ and flew it up. Over 200 miles, I spent more time in the cruise than I did fighting in order to allow more lonewolves to come and join the fight rather than take a slot they could've used.

 

This atmosphere is becoming toxic. Just turn up, fly, and have fun doing so; what other squadrons are doing is by the by, but certainly let's not tar everyone with the same brush.

 

In other news: Nice to see REDFOR striking back - Vody is becoming a point of contention again!

[gregzagk]

Sorry guys... couldn't resist :D

 

[Pikey]

This:

yes it is about having fun together, not passwording themselves behind their channel in TS when we need to be able to contact them for help if needed. why even bother joining a community server like blue flag if your not going to interact with anyone else apart form your own squad!

 

So the feedback from round one was fantastic and the community spirit was enjoyed and effective.

 

This time round we had two locked channels, one was providing AWACS to itself and not for others, the other, I don't know, honestly there's been minimal chat but they have used the commander whisper at least a little.

 

So Blue forces are down fighters because they put on extra tactical commanders. Those Taccoms are giving radar advice to only some players in their channel and not across channels. So we have flights that get one awacs next to flights that have another and neither talks. At one point I recall relaying BRA's via a bridged third party which I gave up on because it was too confusing.

 

The end result is that instead of using tactics and teamwork as a force multiplier, we are a force divider.

 

Stepping up to coordinate is hard enough as it is, please anyone that wants to do this, our group would be more than happy to follow.

 

In case you came into the thread late: Orange lights people, orange lights, setup your whisper channels, work together people, get people on teamspeak, share information, its just MORE fun, if its not more successful.

[Pikey]

Offer still stands Greg!

Sorry guys... couldn't resist :D

 

[Coxy_99]

Either way id like to add that i myself along with 4 others attacking maykop and helping capturing a near by farp with some great communication was a blast getting chased about by 4 or 5 29 spikes. I myself had alot of fun for a couple of hours :joystick::thumbup:

[104th_Maverick]

I'd respect that if you used the whisper channels and worked with others in the spirit of community and strategic play

 

Alright, back up a bit there sportsfan!

 

Our channel is passworded, not because we don't want to work together or we don't want to play strategically, our channel is locked so we can do our job!

 

First day a few of us joined the campaign together and joined our channel on teamspeak we had 10+ people join our channel, most of whom had no brevity discipline and constantly talked about things that were not relevant. We keep our comms in house or with people we know to be more productive, something which I don't think you have a leg to stand on to argue with.

 

One of the main reasons we as a Coalition side are in the position we are in is because there are people like the 104th (not exclusively us tho) who go up and CAP where they are needed. Watch a track replay and you'll see us circling over Beslan / Min Vody for hours on end... to keep you, the striker safe to do your job!

 

Our members do use the Channel Commander, I personally don't, but that doesn't mean I'm not a teamplayer, I / we have no agenda other than helping others to achieve the win.

 

 

yes it is about having fun together, not passwording themselves behind their channel in TS when we need to be able to contact them for help if needed. why even bother joining a community server like blue flag if your not going to interact with anyone else apart form your own squad!

 

 

We do not need to be in your teamspeak channel to help you, a simple request over TeamChat in game would make this possible.

 

We do interact with lots of people outside our Squadron, this is part of the reason why our Coalition is winning. We give our channel password to pilots we have flown with before who we know have the experience and skill set to be able to work with us effectively.

 

Very often we get asked to hold airspace by someone else and we do just that. If we say we'll CAP an area, that's exactly what we do, we don't wander off and let that area fall into enemy hands, we stay disciplined and stay in that area, even when nothing is happening and we're bored as hell.... something which you take for granted...

I fail to see how this is not Strategic, you don't need to check on us or get any updates... we will be there... waiting. If we leave the CAP station to refuel / rearm we will tell you.

 

Again.... watch a track replay and watch us spend hours protecting Beslan, while the other Fighters are off chasing bandits out of the area we are just orbiting in circles over where we need to be!

 

One of the biggest issues I've witnessed regarding poor team play has nothing to do with the fighters or teamspeak channels, but the strikers just setting off to the targets with no CAP then complaining that they got shot down by Red CAP..... or ..... Strikers being told where the CAP is then saying 'ok well we're going to go strike over here' and expecting us to just split the CAP up and cover them.

 

Saturday night was a great example, 3 hours protecting Beslan with 4 wingmen while it was a 0% while a group of 5+ Strikers all co-ordinated to take Nalchik....

 

 

Working together is about more than physically talking to each other, you guys actually don't appreciate at all just how lucky you are to have Fighter Pilots on Blue who want to CAP to help you and not just go chasing after every Red Aircraft in sight and get themselves shot down.

I'm not just talking about the 104th and TAW here either, the 99th, Scatforce, =H= and some key lone wolfs have all went the extra mile to CAP where they are needed in this Campaign. Some of which involve 150-200+nm transits just to fly in circles and wait for something to happen!

 

We can work together very well indeed without being in the same channel, there just needs to be communication back and forward regarding what can and can't be done by the Fighters, this can easily be achieved using the in game chat.

 

Obviously I'm Fast Jet biased but I'd love to see the Strikers holding in some sort of CAP until the Fighters arrive as standard procedure. We can't win without you guys... but you guys can't go anywhere without us.

 

So instead of charging in and blaming the CAP for getting shot down,

 

-Find out where the CAP is first

-Make a plan to strike that area

-Only enter the AO if the CAP is still on station

-Get out alive!

 

If there is no CAP in the area you want to Strike then you should ideally adjust your plan to where the CAP is operating, or alternatively, just wait it out until the CAP can head over. If you choose to go in without CAP then you are accountable for losing your aircraft without question.

 

I see way to many Striker pilots on both sides who just keep pressing to the target regardless of what lays ahead of them, in the vain hope that they will make it through. I go STT on them at 10nm and they still keep coming towards me! Just turn around ffs and get out of here!

 

What should be happening is Fighters flying past big stacks of holding Striker aircraft 40-50nm from the AO, strikers go on the Green light from the Fighters once we have the air and run back to the Hold on Red when the threat is close!

 

Strikers should follow Fighters, not the other way around!

 

If that means you have to orbit in a hold and wait for 30-40 mins bored out your face, paranoid your going to get a ghost ET in the face any second cursing us till we get there then so be it... welcome to my world ;)

Edited September 15, 2015 by [Maverick]

[Falcon_S]

;2474262']...

 

Strikers should follow Fighters, not the other way around!

 

...

 

Many Red strikers - You should read.

[Pikey]

Mav, you are suggesting that an offer of help is enough, i'd argue you can do a lot more. One example is in cycling the refueling in the available CAP provision, because now we have to keep all those fighters going back and forth to keep the station alive.

Another would be to share the radar information between channels to keep the amount of tactical commanders lower. Personally i've had to not take off just to supply threat info to the other fighters and strikers.

 

I'm sorry you are getting randoms in your channel that are pestering you, it might because we are operating a smaller channel that isn't as saturated 8:1 is working out as a maximum for us.

 

Please use the whisper commander channel for CAP status and location, we haven't heard anything as yet, chat cna be hard to monitor.