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Tips for using AIM-7's


SgtPappy

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Super Search is not a find all magic tool, it is used when in visual with a bandit, the pilot places the circle over the target and hits the AAQ button. Nothing special and not so much more super special than VS.

 

VS is most horrible radar mode ever. OK, a bit of an exaggeration, but I use boresight far more as I don't find myself staring at the bandit for 10 minutes before the radar locks with that mode. If SS is faster at locking because it's not scanning empty airspace above me, it will be 100% better. It might still be inferior to boresight if I know what I'm looking for though.

Awaiting: DCS F-15C

Win 10 i5-9600KF 4.6 GHz 64 GB RAM RTX2080Ti 11GB -- Win 7 64 i5-6600K 3.6 GHz 32 GB RAM GTX970 4GB -- A-10C, F-5E, Su-27, F-15C, F-14B, F-16C missions in User Files

 

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VS is most horrible radar mode ever. OK, a bit of an exaggeration, but I use boresight far more as I don't find myself staring at the bandit for 10 minutes before the radar locks with that mode. If SS is faster at locking because it's not scanning empty airspace above me, it will be 100% better. It might still be inferior to boresight if I know what I'm looking for though.

 

Yea, bs is quite superior to vs. Use it most of the time.

Do not expect fairness.

The times of chivalry and fair competition are long gone.

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Super Search is not a find all magic tool, it is used when in visual with a bandit, the pilot places the circle over the target and hits the AAQ button. Nothing special and not so much more super special than VS.

 

No not magical, but it is not just for use when in visual. If you know your bandit is out there but can not see him SS will get a lock on him if you have a rough idea where to point your nose. Bore Sight is WVR only as its like a soda straw and you have to Know almost exclusively where your target is.

 

It is insanely superior to VS where VS's narrow parameters are not required or satisfiable ... (see what I did there :) )

 

But no, it isn't magical.

 

Agreed..

 

I still think its gross oversight on the part of the developers to have not included these two functions.. Just to make things in perspective when my Cousin first flew the sim his first reaction was WHERE THe F is superseach.. To add he has over 2000hrs in the f15.


Edited by pr1malr8ge

For the WIN

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If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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VS is most horrible radar mode ever. OK, a bit of an exaggeration, but I use boresight far more as I don't find myself staring at the bandit for 10 minutes before the radar locks with that mode. If SS is faster at locking because it's not scanning empty airspace above me, it will be 100% better. It might still be inferior to boresight if I know what I'm looking for though.

 

 

if you're in a target rich environment then BS will be the better option as you need to choose what target your want otherwise SS is the best AACQ.

For the WIN

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If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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Expansion of the F-15's capabilities won't happen (IMHO) in the FC3 realm, and rightly so - that's their choice and it's understandable from the perspective of not wanting to deal with an old codebase.

 

Back when LOMAC came out (this is how far back this code dates), no one in public knew what SS was, and there was a limited number of modes common to all LOMAC aircraft that could be implemented. About the only special thing was HMS for the Russian birds, and that was a well known feature.

 

I suggest taking that first statement back, and quickly.

 

I still think its pathetic on the part of the developers to have not included these two functions.. Just to make things in perspective when my Cousin first flew the sim his first reaction was WHERE THe F is superseach.. To add he has over 2000hrs in the f15.

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D

I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda

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Expansion of the F-15's capabilities won't happen (IMHO) in the FC3 realm, and rightly so - that's their choice and it's understandable from the perspective of not wanting to deal with an old codebase.

 

Back when LOMAC came out (this is how far back this code dates), no one in public knew what SS was, and there was a limited number of modes common to all LOMAC aircraft that could be implemented. About the only special thing was HMS for the Russian birds, and that was a well known feature.

 

I suggest taking that first statement back, and quickly.

 

 

See that's the issue I have. I would not have a leg to stand on if we were discussing Lomac FC1 or possibly even FC2. How ever we are talking about FC3 that I purchased only in the last few years. But hey what ever.. That's life I guess.

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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It is insanely superior to VS where VS's narrow parameters are not required or satisfiable ... (see what I did there :) )

 

But no, it isn't magical.

 

 

Would I be right in saying that the VS mode is intended for locking on in turning fights? AFAIK the idea is that turning towards an enemy plane will naturally place them somewhere in the VS scan zone.

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Would I be right in saying that the VS mode is intended for locking on in turning fights? AFAIK the idea is that turning towards an enemy plane will naturally place them somewhere in the VS scan zone.

 

VS is for turning only imho.. I still would rather use SS then VS if I had it due to the wider search.

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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My tips for using AIM-7's:

 

- Shoot them at SU-27's when they are doing high alpha maneuvers to dodge AIM-120C's and are slow. They always hit SU-27's and MIG-29's that are trying to dodge AMRAAMS successfully from close range. Always if i see a flanker or Mig do a Cobra or another crazy maneuver to make me overshoot or dodge AIM1-20 i send a AIM-7 their way.

- They like MIG-21's as well.

- Don't fire them upwards. For some reason they are even more easy to spoof that way.

- Don't fire them at a fast moving target that is also doing high G turn's.

- Don't fire them at a running target that is more than 3 miles from you. And even at 3 miles it's difficult.

- Fire them when the bandit is moving towards you or if he turns for you.

- Fire them around 6/7 miles from the bandit.

- Fire them when friendly's are merged with enemy's instead of AIM-120C's for safety reasons

 

Yesterday i was flying a mission on the 104th with two AIM-120C's, 4 sparrows and two AIM-9M. From the 30 kills and 8 deaths 14 of them where Sparrow kills. So they are pretty good if you know how to and when to use them. And sometimes if i kill a 104th member it's mostly with a AIM-7 Sparrow. But killing a 104th member does not happen much anymore. They are like Borg. They adapted to my tactics :(


Edited by winchesterdelta1

Go in close, and when you think you are too close, go in closer.

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- They like MIG-21's as well.

- Don't fire them upwards. For some reason they are even more easy to spoof that way.

- Don't fire them at a fast moving target that is also doing high G turn's.

- Don't fire them at a running target that is more than 3 miles from you. And even at 3 miles it's difficult.

- Fire them when the bandit is moving towards you or if he turns for you.

- Fire them around 6/7 miles from the bandit.

- Fire them when friendly's are merged with enemy's instead of AIM-120C's for safety reasons

 

Yesterday i was flying a mission on the 104th with two AIM-120C's, 4 sparrows and two AIM-9M. From the 30 kills and 8 deaths 14 of them where Sparrow kills. So they are pretty good if you know how to and when to use them. And sometimes if i kill a 104th member it's mostly with a AIM-7 Sparrow. But killing a 104th member does not happen much anymore. They are like Borg. They adapted to my tactics :(

 

Surprisingly, I've had about 3 kills on bandits while climbing straight from under their bellies. Like the F-15, I think they don't get any warning if you're right under them.

 

VS is for turning only imho.. I still would rather use SS then VS if I had it due to the wider search.

 

So is SS like FLOOD but instead of sending out a warning, it locks what ever is in the circle? Like a giant boresight mode? I heard it looks at everything that can be seen on the VSD but I'm not sure the parameters it needs for lock.

 

On that note, often I will use FLOOD mode to trick the enemy into thinking I've fired. They go defensive, lose energy and try to dupe a non-existent missile. It almost always works but sometimes I try not to use it when I feel like I'll lose their position once they defend. If I were more confident about my SA, I'd use it more.

 

I often cannot fly with a wingman due to my schedule so it appears that I'll only ever win against enemies with less SA, which is one reason I fly with Sparrows - to improve SA and good strategy.

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Surprisingly, I've had about 3 kills on bandits while climbing straight from under their bellies. Like the F-15, I think they don't get any warning if you're right under them.

 

 

 

So is SS like FLOOD but instead of sending out a warning, it locks what ever is in the circle? Like a giant boresight mode? I heard it looks at everything that can be seen on the VSD but I'm not sure the parameters it needs for lock.

 

On that note, often I will use FLOOD mode to trick the enemy into thinking I've fired. They go defensive, lose energy and try to dupe a non-existent missile. It almost always works but sometimes I try not to use it when I feel like I'll lose their position once they defend. If I were more confident about my SA, I'd use it more.

 

I often cannot fly with a wingman due to my schedule so it appears that I'll only ever win against enemies with less SA, which is one reason I fly with Sparrows - to improve SA and good strategy.

 

What Winchester means in regards to not shooting up is rather trying to shoot at a target at further range that has a considerable height over you. I.e. you shoot at 6nm at where you're at 3,000ft and the bandit is at 13,000ft etc etc. If you're shooting up at close range at a only a thousand or so ft difference is a bit different.

 

Yes SS covers the same area on the hud as flood mode. It how ever auto locks into an STT track.

 

Just to further.. I would exclusively use SS over any other AAQC except when I have visual confirmation of my target in a turning fight then I would switch to VS. Other wise VS is too narrow and can easily miss a target.


Edited by pr1malr8ge

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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For the last month, I have been flying almost exclusively with AIM-7M's and AIM-9M's on servers like the 104th and 159th. I like flying around with a 1980's combat load, and since no one else does 1980's servers, I decided to just fly with the weapons I like. I also feel I'm more careful with Sparrows since I only have 4.

 

So far, I have had fairly good success. I fly around primarily near the mountains or hills and use them as cover. On good days, I'll have a K/D of 1:1, but sometimes I'm lucky enough get 7:2 or unlucky enough to get killed a few times with no kills.

 

Does anyone have any tips/advice on flying with this loadout?

 

I find that my primary problem is running out of fuel because I'm forced to fly low. As a result, I'm very hesitant to get rid of drop tanks because I want to keep as much fuel as possible. I get killed often while trying to drop them. Also, I end up having to merge a LOT, and if I lose the enemy for a second, I will have to run behind a hill or I'm dead. and that happens sometimes.

 

Stay within 38 NM of your target and you should have a pretty good chance of hitting your target with the AIM-7's obviously closer is better.

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Stay within 38 NM of your target and you should have a pretty good chance of hitting your target with the AIM-7's obviously closer is better.

 

Are you serious?

 

 

Well, might work out to 38nm if you're flying an YF-12a with Aim-[4]7a at 80,000ft & M3.2 in DCS

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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So I stand corrected, the **DCS** AIM-7M has a max effective range of 24 NM (45 km), not 38NM as the specs state for the RW AIM-7M.

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Its not what I consider. Thanks for your input, Nikola.

 

Maximum Effective Range: The maximum distance a weapon may be expected to be accurate and achieve the desired effects.

 

1. maximum effective range. (n.d.) Dictionary of Military and Associated Terms. (2005).

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Its not what I consider. Thanks for your input, Nikola.

 

Maximum Effective Range: The maximum distance a weapon may be expected to be accurate and achieve the desired effects.

 

1. maximum effective range. (n.d.) Dictionary of Military and Associated Terms. (2005).

 

Accurate and achieve the desired effects against what? At what altitude, at what delta altitude, at what speed, at what aspect, at, how capable of maneuvering, target?

 

At 37nm, AIM-7M can maybe hit a C-172, if radar can see it.


Edited by =4c=Nikola

Do not expect fairness.

The times of chivalry and fair competition are long gone.

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Maximum effective range is sort of a poor term for describing missile capabilities.

 

Most of the problems with missile modeling come from a lack knowledge of what the various range markers actually mean (And they may mean different things based on tactics, targets, platform capability, kinetic capability, electronics capability, available powered flight/steering time etc) and the attempt to define missile flight via these reported maximum ranges.

 

Its not what I consider. Thanks for your input, Nikola.

 

Maximum Effective Range: The maximum distance a weapon may be expected to be accurate and achieve the desired effects.

 

1. maximum effective range. (n.d.) Dictionary of Military and Associated Terms. (2005).

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D

I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda

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Well, might work out to 38nm if you're flying an YF-12a with Aim-[4]7a at 80,000ft & M3.2 in DCS

 

To be fair, I've hit things with the 120 at 60nm in DCS. If you can find a target and keep track of it while accelerating to insane speeds and altitudes, in can potentially be effective.

 

I'm kind of curious now as to what range the AIM-7 can reach under extreme conditions. 40 nm sounds plausible, though it will probably not work online unless the target is jamming.

Awaiting: DCS F-15C

Win 10 i5-9600KF 4.6 GHz 64 GB RAM RTX2080Ti 11GB -- Win 7 64 i5-6600K 3.6 GHz 32 GB RAM GTX970 4GB -- A-10C, F-5E, Su-27, F-15C, F-14B, F-16C missions in User Files

 

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To be fair, I've hit things with the 120 at 60nm in DCS. If you can find a target and keep track of it while accelerating to insane speeds and altitudes, in can potentially be effective.

 

I'm kind of curious now as to what range the AIM-7 can reach under extreme conditions. 40 nm sounds plausible, though it will probably not work online unless the target is jamming.

 

 

as I've stated I have hit f15/su27s launched at 16nm.. Which has gotten some back lash as if it didn't happen.. These launches were at close to M2 +50,000ft

 

I guess 38nm might be possible if launched at 60k m2.5 against a large target I.E. Awacs/tanker in the 36,000ft alt range.. But man I would think that's pushing it IMHO. Id also say it would take several tries to actualy get one to finaly connect.

 

To add in all the tacview reviews that I've watched I've never seen the aim7 go about M3.4ish..

 

Hit me up on PM we can set up a MP mission and give it a test?


Edited by pr1malr8ge

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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as I've stated I have hit f15/su27s launched at 16nm.. Which has gotten some back lash as if it didn't happen

 

It was that no one thought it was possible, but that you couldn't count on such a thing regularly happening.

 

Hit me up on PM we can set up a MP mission and give it a test?

 

Unfortunately my HOTAS is broken, so I'm pretty much off MP until DCS 2 comes out and I build a PC for it.

Awaiting: DCS F-15C

Win 10 i5-9600KF 4.6 GHz 64 GB RAM RTX2080Ti 11GB -- Win 7 64 i5-6600K 3.6 GHz 32 GB RAM GTX970 4GB -- A-10C, F-5E, Su-27, F-15C, F-14B, F-16C missions in User Files

 

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It was that no one thought it was possible, but that you couldn't count on such a thing regularly happening.

 

 

 

Unfortunately my HOTAS is broken, so I'm pretty much off MP until DCS 2 comes out and I build a PC for it.

 

 

Best of luck with your Hotas m8.. See ya in 1.5/2!

For the WIN

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

If your desired effect on the target is making the pilot defecate his pants laughing then you can definitely achieve it with a launch like that.
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