eekz 发布于2015年11月21日 发布于2015年11月21日 (已编辑) Plane get's AoA is locked to 36.0 degrees. Speed, AoA and G values have strange correlation Also video: [ame] [/ame] 本帖最后于2015年11月22日，由eekz编辑 VIRPIL Controls Servers
Brisse 发布于2015年11月21日 发布于2015年11月21日 What's the problem exactly? You do know how the MiG-21bis is supposed to stall, right? 28 degrees AoA is considered safe at any speed and altitude. 33 degrees is the critical AoA. If you go there you will stall, and might even go into a spin. It doesn't recover from the stall by itself. You have to actively use stick inputs to recover.
eekz 发布于2015年11月22日 楼主 发布于2015年11月22日 What's the problem exactly? Watch the video VIRPIL Controls Servers
eekz 发布于2015年11月22日 楼主 发布于2015年11月22日 (已编辑) That's how it's supposed to work. Not a bug. Lol. I'd rather hear from developers, but not a person who can't see that there is an obvious 36.0 AoA trap in dynamics where the plane gets with strange oscillation (0:05 - 0:11) and it's locked to 36.0 during all stall process, not mater the stick position. Also, how it can be that in the screenshot the plane has 500+ IAS, 36 deg AoA and only 1.3 G? If it's supposed to work like that any aerodynamically based explanation is welcome :) 本帖最后于2015年11月22日，由eekz编辑 VIRPIL Controls Servers
游客=YeS=CMF 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 What's the problem exactly? You do know how the MiG-21bis is supposed to stall, right? 28 degrees AoA is considered safe at any speed and altitude. 33 degrees is the critical AoA. If you go there you will stall, and might even go into a spin. It doesn't recover from the stall by itself. You have to actively use stick inputs to recover. Real plane dont lock AoA like this one in the video. MiG-21bis has another stall and spin behavior, read documents. That's how it's supposed to work. Not a bug. Yes, it is a bug. Or simply not advanced flight model.
RedShot 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 (已编辑) What's the problem exactly? You do know how the MiG-21bis is supposed to stall, right? 28 degrees AoA is considered safe at any speed and altitude. 33 degrees is the critical AoA. If you go there you will stall, and might even go into a spin. It doesn't recover from the stall by itself. You have to actively use stick inputs to recover. Yes it's suppose to stall, yes very high AoA is dangerous and will result in to very bad things. But the problem here with FM at least my opinion is that it should be may result and not like it's now, instantly hit that critical AoA and your in a crazy spin. From the manual quote: "Critical AoA is 33°, which - if exceeded - will cause a stall, possibly followed by spin." Keyword here is the "possibly" and not "instantly" like it's now. 本帖最后于2015年11月22日，由RedShot编辑 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] http://dcsfinland.fi Suomalainen DCS Yhteisö
ФрогФут 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 Anyone thought, that indicated AoA is not the same as the aircraft AoA it is local and is pretty much higher, than the aircraft general AoA? So it cannot be the same on F2 view (general AoA) and cockpit indicator. "Я ошеломлён, но думаю об этом другими словами", - некий гражданин Ноет котик, ноет кротик, Ноет в небе самолетик, Ноют клумбы и кусты - Ноют все. Поной и ты.
archer86 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 Plane get's AoA is locked to 36.0 degrees. Speed, AoA and G values have strange correlation it feels and looks like a kind of suspension effect. it happens with all directions at critical aoa degree.
King_Hrothgar 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 I've noticed it too and it is my only complaint about the FM. Overall it is a very good FM I think, but that AoA locking is clearly incorrect. I have a B.S. in Physics and though my knowledge of aeronautical engineering is limited, I can say with absolute certainty that that particular aspect of the flight model is wrong. How? It violates Newton's first, second and third laws of motion at the same time on a qualitative level, never mind quantitative. Hopefully it gets fixed. I have noticed smaller changes to the FM in the various updates along with 1.5. So they are working on it still.
theropod 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 (已编辑) yes, that behaviour has been noticable since Dcs 1.5 released. that feels like rebound but controllable with rudders. pushing hard the stick forward causes to exit from that situation but aircraft suddenly gains much more speed, is that normal? 本帖最后于2015年11月22日，由theropod编辑
Brisse 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 that feels like rebound but controllable with rudders. Real operational manual tells you not to apply rudder during stall, becouse that will put you into a spin. I believe this also happens in DCS if you apply enough rudder. pushing hard the stick forward causes to exit from that situation but aircraft suddenly gains much more speed, is that normal? Are you looking at the IAS gauge in the cockpit? I guess that might not show correct speed at high AoA because the airflow will hit the pitot tube at an angle.
theropod 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 Real operational manual tells you not to apply rudder during stall, becouse that will put you into a spin. I believe this also happens in DCS if you apply enough rudder. Are you looking at the IAS gauge in the cockpit? I guess that might not show correct speed at high AoA because the airflow will hit the pitot tube at an angle. brisse, thank for your reply! i can keep my position with opposite rudder and power, that can prevent entering spin but not always. thank for the information about pitot tube the main question is the critical aoa effect feels like rebounding on a surface. is that behaviour normal?
Brisse 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 the main question is the critical aoa effect feels like rebounding on a surface. is that behaviour normal? I thought it was normal, but others are saying it's not. I checked in operational manual and there it says to immediately move the stick to neutral to recover, but in the sim that doesn't seem to be enough. In DCS you actually have to push a little bit forward to get out of the stall.
theropod 发布于2015年11月22日 发布于2015年11月22日 I thought it was normal, but others are saying it's not. I checked in operational manual and there it says to immediately move the stick to neutral to recover, but in the sim that doesn't seem to be enough. In DCS you actually have to push a little bit forward to get out of the stall. thanks! all wip:) i hope devs can give the correct information about the rebound effect. it occurs on every position, no matter if you climb turn or dive, it happens same for all.
Dolphin887 发布于2015年11月23日 发布于2015年11月23日 Thank you for your report. AoA indicated at maximum 35 degrees. External view shows global AoA 36. Local AoA is around 45. Aircraft behavior near critical and on supercritical AoA will be improved and available in the next patch. Power through superb knowledge, training and teamwork. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
RedShot 发布于2015年11月24日 发布于2015年11月24日 Thanks for respond Dolphin. Just wanted to share this short video. feXa6SE8pPc [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] http://dcsfinland.fi Suomalainen DCS Yhteisö
theropod 发布于2015年11月24日 发布于2015年11月24日 Thank you for your report. AoA indicated at maximum 35 degrees. External view shows global AoA 36. Local AoA is around 45. Aircraft behavior near critical and on supercritical AoA will be improved and available in the next patch. thank you for reply dolphin, good to know that has reported Thanks for respond Dolphin. Just wanted to share this short video. feXa6SE8pPc i noticed the same and the same roll happened for me as free fall situation. i lost my engine while climbing and my aircraft begin fall from higher altitudes to the ground with that motion. no position has changed while falling
59th_Reaper 发布于2015年11月24日 发布于2015年11月24日 (已编辑) Thanks for respond Dolphin. Just wanted to share this short video. feXa6SE8pPc I think it's not bug. MiG-21's (and the F-104 too) problem at high speed, that's called "own spin". It's a very dangerous flight situation, when u make a very fast roll (more than 90 degrees in a moment). In real life, the only possible solution (if you have altitude) is the using of pedals... 本帖最后于2015年11月24日，由59th_Reaper编辑 Two tails, two engines! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Golo 发布于2015年11月24日 发布于2015年11月24日 (已编辑) Well, the bug is that you are getting G-loc within 0.5s of the onset of the inertial rotation. 本帖最后于2015年11月25日，由Golo编辑
59th_Reaper 发布于2015年11月25日 发布于2015年11月25日 Well, the bug is that you are getting G-loc within 0.5s of the onset of the inertial rotation. Yes, that's a bug! :) Two tails, two engines! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
OnlyforDCS 发布于2015年11月25日 发布于2015年11月25日 (已编辑) That's realistic???!! So starting a hard right roll will lead into an unrecoverable roll (look at the stick movement) despite the stick being returned to neutral, with no slowdown of momentum? What would happen if the pilot pushed the stick full left, it wouldn't slow down the roll? 本帖最后于2015年11月25日，由OnlyforDCS编辑 Current specs: Windows 10 Home 64bit, i5-9600K @ 3.7 Ghz, 32GB DDR4 RAM, 1TB Samsung EVO 860 M.2 SSD, GAINWARD RTX2060 6GB, Oculus Rift S, MS FFB2 Sidewinder + Warthog Throttle Quadrant, Saitek Pro rudder pedals.
eekz 发布于2015年11月25日 楼主 发布于2015年11月25日 Aircraft behavior near critical and on supercritical AoA will be improved and available in the next patch. Thanks for communication! It's much appreciated! Looking forward for improvements:thumbup: VIRPIL Controls Servers
domini99 发布于2015年11月25日 发布于2015年11月25日 Thanks for respond Dolphin. Just wanted to share this short video. feXa6SE8pPc The issue is, when you get G-locked the pilot keeps forcing the stick fully into the corner. I don't know, but in real life when you lose consciousness I think you will let go of the stick.
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