R-77 on outer pylons on MiG-29 (for VVS504)

[Guest Cali]

Because a rule imposed by your squad dictated that only ED default loadout was to be used within the match.

 

Migs were not to use R-77's on outers and Su-27's were not to use Mers

 

I'll have to go back and check the rules in our forums on that, thanks for the quick response.

[504 Wolverine]

Allright, also so that everyone is clear on this, here is the Rules of the Match

 

Summary

=========

 

Game start(*1): July 1st 2006 (18.00 GMT, Come in earlier!)

 

Game type: Best of three rounds

 

Home bases: Sukhumi (=IA=) vs Majkop (<504th>)

 

Players: 10 vs 10

 

8 Fighters: Migs/ F-15s/ Su27s (Max 4 jets of 1 sort per team)

 

2 Attack aircraft: Su25Ts Targets: Primary- WatchTower / Secondary-Airstrip.

 

Game settings: Ace settings / No respawns / Medium scenes / 3 mile winds / Clouds medium

/ 12:00 ingame starting time /

 

NO refueling allowed.

NO rearming allowed.

NO recovery allowed.

 

If desired, 2 fighters can be exchanged for 2 Su-25s (NON-Su-25T)

 

Any mix of standard loadouts for Flaming Cliffs are allowed. No lope mod/alike.

 

Landing only allowed at home base.

 

 

 

 

Victory Conditions

====================

 

 

1. Most A2G objectives accomplished at game end(*2).

Primary A2G Target: WatchTower

Secondary A2G Target: Enemy runway.(Only dumb penetration- or general purpose bombs allowed vs runway)

(Destruction = 3 direct hits)

 

2. If game is tied at game end(*2), most lost aircraft(*3) will determine the losing team.

 

 

 

Definitions

=============

 

*1. Game start: Game start will be when both teams have their first wing on the active and call "Ready".

 

*2. Game end: When all remaining CAP, Attack aircraft and short range fighters have landed.

 

*3. Lost aircraft: Disconnect/computer crash, intensive warping, shot down, crash, eject.

 

 

 

Notes

=====

 

Remeber the Mig-29S Payload should be default LOMAC, which means we can only run with 2xET, 2xP77, 2xP73.

 

Also only standart LOMAC bomb loadouts are possible, so things like MERs on Flankers are a No-go.

 

Here's what Breakshot posted on 26-06-2006 12:54 AM

[SwingKid]

LO is simulating 9-13C ,which is capable of carrying 4 R-77 on the inner pylons. The reason is that the G's limits of the airframe are not perfoms R-77 on outer pylon and maybe some restrictions on WCMS (weapons control management systems).

 

Source?

 

-SK

[Scart]

rumors :)

Believe it: I wish MiG can do that, but it can't...

[GGTharos]

Eh, hold on. The middle pylons normally only took R-73's, so it's not the pylons.

 

Are you saying THE WING can't?

[SwingKid]

rumors :)

Believe it: I wish MiG can do that, but it can't...

 

It's hard to believe "rumors" when there are photos of the opposite looking right at us. That is NOT an airshow MiG. Red missiles are normally used for separation testing, not for static displays. They don't have warheads, but they must have the same weight as the real missile, otherwise they are wasting time and money flying with them. They are red because they need to be easily found on the ground after launch/jettison. They only appear at airshows when the missile is still in testing, and no white ones have been made yet. They are NOT made specially for airshows.

 

-SK

[Scart]

http://www.foxbat.ru/maks/maks2005/sukhoi/sukhoi041.jpg that's one of that "test missiles" :) in russian it called "masso-gabaritny maket"

[Alfa]

Maybe I'm wrong, but AFAIR, red missiles are scale models.

 

Like Swingkid said, they are test missiles - there would be no reason to fly around with test missiles on outer pylons if they weren't meant to be deployed from them.

 

Look through airshow pictures, and you will find that display rounds are painted in the same way as the live rounds - in the case of the R-77 that would be white - but often with black rings or/and the word "inert" painted on them.

 

Example:

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[STAR_80]

*THREADJACK* I always liked that car behind the Fulcrum. Damd, I'd take either.

 

anyway back to subject :)

[504MrWolf]

Is it a modded Volvo S60 ?

 

I love the dood clearly stood on top of the outter R73 to get a good shot ! :D

[Shaman]

BTW is it just my imagination or have these forums got really whinney lately

BINGO!

That's the only clear point of this thread.

 

I'm also the one who doesn't understand why these whines were not around when Shepski released his realistic payloads mod.

 

:Flush: Flush this thread

[SwingKid]

in russian it called "masso-gabaritny maket"

 

Exactly. "Masso-gabaritny" means that it weighs exactly the same as the real missile (unlike "white" models, that may be filled with air). So, the pylon can support its weight, the aircraft can fly with its drag, and the weapons system can control its seeker - what remains to doubt?

 

-SK

[Ice]

Interesting thread. Just for clarification on the 169th Dedicated. 6 x R77's on the MiG29 is not accepted for 2 reasons.

 

1. This is not a Mig-29K simulated in Lock On. As far as I know its the only model that supports 6

 

2. Its an unfair advantage to those who dont use mods or aren't aware of mods being available.

 

If players are found to be using load mods on dedoicated they will receive one warning only. If they offend again. Ip banning will be implimemted.

[504 Wolverine]

IIRC MiG-29K can support up to 8 R-77's with the inner 4 pylons able to carry the R-27 class missiles but as we all know Alfa just drools over this plane so he could confirm this.

 

Also alfa, does the 29K (9.31) and 29K (9.41) have a difference in armament capability?

[SwingKid]

1. This is not a Mig-29K simulated in Lock On. As far as I know its the only model that supports 6

 

MiG-29K is a MiG-29M derivative, it supports 8:

 

"8 х РВВ-АЕ

8 х РВВ-АЕ + ПБ (подвесной бак)"

http://aerodrom.altnet.ru/avia/fighters/russia/mig29.php

 

-SK

[Ice]

Well I wasnt sure. Thanks for the clarification. The 2nd reason still stands however.

[Alfa]

Interesting thread. Just for clarification on the 169th Dedicated. 6 x R77's on the MiG29 is not accepted for 2 reasons.

 

1. This is not a Mig-29K simulated in Lock On. As far as I know its the only model that supports 6.

 

1). The MiG-29K has 8 pylons and the R-77 can be deployed from all of them. The MiG-29S has 6 pylons and the R-77 can be deployed from all of them. Like Swingkid said there is neither a weight nor drag issue with R-77s on outer pylons - unlike the R-27 the R-77 was designed to be compatible with wing stations(positions) otherwise used for the R-73.

 

2). I posted the picture of the MiG-29K because it clearly shows:

 

a). white R-73 rounds with black rings indicating "dummy" display rounds - not red.

 

b). white R-77 rounds with the word "intert" painted on them to indicate that they aren't live rounds - again not red.

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[Alfa]

IIRC MiG-29K can support up to 8 R-77's with the inner 4 pylons able to carry the R-27 class missiles

 

Correct :) .

 

...but as we all know Alfa just drools over this plane so he could confirm this.

 

Hehe - yeah I do drool over the MiG-29K, but as mentioned above, I posted the picture link - not because of the MiG-29K - but to show that inert display missiles are painted to look like the real rounds, but with black rings or the word "inert" painted on them to indicate that they aren't "live" ones.

 

Swingkid is absolutely right that the red ones are test missiles built to simulate weight and drag characteristics of the real missiles in flight, while "dummy" display missiles, on the other hand, are made to look like the real ones(for obvious reasons) - hollow and made from light materials to make them more managable to handle at static airshow displays.

 

Also alfa, does the 29K (9.31) and 29K (9.41) have a difference in armament capability?

 

Not in terms of number of pylons or Russian made weapon types, but the 9-41 has an "open architecture" firecontrol system, which allows for non-Russian weapon types to be integrated on customer's request.

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[SwingKid]

http://www.ecf.utoronto.ca/~pavacic/lomac/proof_that_ed_hates_us.jpg

 

;)

[goro]

http://www.ecf.utoronto.ca/~pavacic/lomac/proof_that_ed_hates_us.jpg

 

;)

This is prototype Mig-29 model (9-14)

Tail N 407

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig29-14.html

[SwingKid]

This is prototype Mig-29 model (9-14)

Tail N 407

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig29-14.html

 

So what, it carries less maximum weight than 9-13S?

 

http://airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig29s.html

 

Weight doesn't seem to be a problem.

[Vekkinho]

Oh come on guys, in that link on 9-14 that goro posted R-77 is not even mentioned:

Вооружение: одноствольная 30-мм пушка ГШ-301

боевая нагрузка - 4500 кг на шести подкрыльевых узлах

две ракеты средней дальности Р-27Р и

до 6 ракет ближнего воздушного боя Р-73 или Р-60М

бомбы 250- или 500-кг, контейнер КМГУ

НАР 80 С-8 в блоках Б-8М1 и С-24Б

But in the pic that SK posted (Ed hates us all) it's clearly visible that R-77 can not only be carried on outer pylons but also launched meaning that it's working. Seeing is believeing unless there's someone who'd say it's not a real R-77 but a mock up S-24 that only looks like R-77.

 

Thing is MiG-29S is far from MiG-29C in weapon systems and radar so do not mistake these two even though both types are designated as Fulcrum C by NATO!

 

However there's not too many MiG-29S in service in armies of the world, I only know of

Instructor research Aviation Regiment 760 ISAP, Lipetsk AB and 19th IAP, Millerovo AB.

 

Most of the 9-13 airframes you'll see on Airliners.net and similar photo sites are MiG-29C not S although some of the 9-12 airframes also received an MiG-29C upgrade without enlarging it's spine and changing general shape.

[RedTiger]

What's with all the thread necromancy lately?

[FVMAD]

This is prototype Mig-29 model (9-14)

Tail N 407

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig29-14.html

 

Yes it was a 9-14, but when project closed it was remade back to 9-13

 

So what, it carries less maximum weight than 9-13S?

 

http://airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig29s.html

 

Weight doesn't seem to be a problem.

 

It's a "flying lab" and it doesn't mean that if it can fire R-77 from outer pylon that serial model also will, no. Not all researches goes into serial craft.

 

Thing is MiG-29S is far from MiG-29C in weapon systems and radar so do not mistake these two even though both types are designated as Fulcrum C by NATO!

 

+1

 

However there's not too many MiG-29S in service in armies of the world, I only know of [/font]

Instructor research Aviation Regiment 760 ISAP, Lipetsk AB and 19th IAP, Millerovo AB.

 

just 16 pieces were bought by RuAF in '91 that's all.

have no idea how many left in service from that number.

and none R-77/RVV-AE in AirForce :(

 

What's with all the thread necromancy lately?

 

:D

[GGTharos]

I figure we need to get a Mage, a Warrior, a Paladin and a thief together ...

 

What's with all the thread necromancy lately?