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IFF question


Lordbaldur

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So I heard that with this update, the IFF on the aircraft has been implemented, but I am still confused. I tried to interrogate a target and nothing was shown on the radar to indicate friend or foe. Not only that but even if it was working, I have no idea what it looks like when I do identify. Do I need to do extra steps such as turning on a transponder?

 

TL;DR I'm lost with this.

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Yes you have to enable it with the IFF power switch (see pictures).

 

For more details on the symbology (on locked targets) you might want to look at the manual pg 96/97.

 

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Edited by spiddx

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Hmm i'm not on open Beta or 2.0 and it works for me !!!!!

 

Well he posted that the day before the update came to the Release version.

 

So when he posted it was true and IFF only existed on 2.0 or the Open beta.

 

but the day after he posted the update came to the "standard" client as well so now everyone has the iff.

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You do not set frequencies for the IFF, those are codes (and modes).

 

IFF being a system based on interrogation-answer, it it not possible for Razbam to implement it "all by himself".

Indeed it would need that all other aircraft type have the ability to answer based on mode & code (so they would need a way to set modes & codes, even the AI ones, even the human "FC3" ones without clickable cockpit.

And even if ED and all 3rd parties did that, we would then be "stuck" by real life incompatibilities: no more F-15 identifying Su-27 from the same coalition as "friendly" because those 2 aircraft do not share a compatible IFF system, due to west/east history (and it's a valid remark for every aircraft). This would restrain the mission makers imagination, not a cool thing to do.

 

My guess is it won't happen soon. ;)

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Does this mean if IFF is not ON, all contacts will appear as "enemies"?

 

When you activate the IFF it will interrogate the transponders of the airplanes in question.

 

If the IFF transponder is compatible and has the right codes it will come back as friendly.

 

If the IFF Transponder is either not compatible or does not have the right code the symbol will remain as unkown but can be presumed hostile depending on the circumstance.

 

 

For example if we are in an area were there should only be to nationalities of airplanes lets say American and Russian aircraft.

 

And the american aircraft have the right iff code (wich they should) then they will all show up as friendlies and you can assume that any target that does not show up as a friendly is thus hostile.

 

But in more cluttered situations its harder as Neutrals aswell as civilian aircraft will also not show up on iff so you cant tell them apart from the hostile just by iff alone and thats what the Awacs / Ground radar has to do.

 

But in the game its very simplistic.

 

Since if ur on the blue faction all aircraft of that faction will show up as friendly.

 

And all other aircraft can be classified as hostile.

 

But also remember when it comes to the M2000 that after you activate the IFF interrogator the symbols will only show up for a limited time before going way.

 

So you should keep pressing the IFF button to be sure who is who and especially always press it again before targeting someone.

 

And another point for the M-2000 is to remember to turn on the IFF control Panel.

 

Since if it is off (default position on startup) you cant interrogate and as such all contacts show up as unkown/hostile no matter if you press the button or not.

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Does this mean if IFF is not ON, all contacts will appear as "enemies"?

 

IFF never tells who is "bad guy".

It just tells you who is a friend, for the others you don't know...

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IFF never tells who is "bad guy".

It just tells you who is a friend, for the others you don't know...

 

But the way the game is built up there is only friend or enemy.

 

So if it does not say friend its an enemy.

 

You just have to be carefull to IFF before targeting somone

(and to turn on the IFF panel before trying)

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That is not necessarily true.

 

F-15C in RL has three AAI correlation symbols: unknown, friendly, enemy.

 

IFF never tells who is "bad guy".

It just tells you who is a friend, for the others you don't know...

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That is not necessarily true.

 

F-15C in RL has three AAI correlation symbols: unknown, friendly, enemy.

 

Enemy? Like in "I'm sure this is an enemy"?

Because all IFF interrogators are capable of 3 levels:

- "Friendly, I'm sure, all is matching"

- "Mhmmm... I got some data, but I'm unsure, it'a a bit garbled"

- "No data".

 

OTOH getting positive identification of an ennemy aircraft requires to know and replicates ennemy system, in order to be able to:

- trigger an answer from him yourself (complicated, you would probably need codes too, unlikely)

- of be able to "intercept" a interrogation/answer from another source, and classify/correlate it... ambitious to say the least!!

So sure, that's possible on paper (and I'm sure it was tried), but history has it that once compromized, such a system would be modified (a MiG-25 story comes to mind), so I doubt this is a real operational/working capability.

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It's further complicated by the fact we already have an IFF system in DCSW that isn't configurable based on coalition membership and to configure seperately into that would be challenging, EG, ED would have to ignore coalition, check if the module has a working IFF then either show as one of the IFF responses based on module and/or coalition if a simplified repsonse is needed.

 

It gets harder then also...mind IFF is more complex, for the above example we assumed IFF is only a boolean response...but its not, it can just be a "wrong" response. This represents its not about coalition at all but about IFF config...so the entire coalition thing is eroded. For example, you have a coalition of different nations IFF codes may be shared between them or not. Neutral and civilian parties come into it. It's a minefield of which I'm not so sure the right answer is more complexity, especially since its not only about IFF but how ED models a framework and whether 3rd parties use it. The lowest common denominator is the unconfigurable IFF in modules. I'm not sure it will be good for business as it will simply remove the ability to know if a targeted aircraft is friend or foe for most and force reliance on someone watching over radar and making decisions based on "guilty by association" or other factors.

 

Personally I wouldnt mind having the option of a real implementation but I'd say i was in the minority.

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Enemy? Like in "I'm sure this is an enemy"?

 

Yes.

 

OTOH getting positive identification of an ennemy aircraft requires to know and replicates ennemy system, in order to be able to:

 

Correct.

 

So sure, that's possible on paper (and I'm sure it was tried), but history has it that once compromized, such a system would be modified (a MiG-25 story comes to mind), so I doubt this is a real operational/working capability.

 

The symbols are there; as to what/who they work on, that's described in supplements we'll probably never see :)

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The symbols are there; as to what/who they work on, that's described in supplements we'll probably never see :)

 

Is this something in lines of a further development of the Combat Tree gear (i.e. interrogating familiar enemy IFF transponders)?

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Is this something in lines of a further development of the Combat Tree gear (i.e. interrogating familiar enemy IFF transponders)?

 

yes, that's what I'm thinking about.

 

But it's no relevant in the discussion.

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  • 2 weeks later...

IFF question

 

Hi folks.....my understanding was that the IFF is working after the last update.

Unfortunately i have no correct indication und mz radar screen.

 

Could anybody explain in detail how to setup the cockpit, Page 97 of the Manual does not help.:book:

 

Thanks

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