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Multiplayer missile performance still abysmal


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Multiplayer missiles, Client against AI airplanes, there seems to be an accuracy problem. Is this a product of the new netcode changes? Tonight our Squadron as a whole got less than 10% hits in F-15C's with AIM-120C's and AIM-9M's as client players against a variety of AI aircraft (MiG-23's, MiG-29A's and MiG-25's). We flew the same mission in our rotation that we previously always got 50% or higher hits.

 

Single player seems OK so is this now a netcode issue? All was OK in release 1.5.3, then the problem started in the first release of 1.5.4 and then now this one. There seems to be something terribly wrong in multiplayer now? What has changed here since 1.5.3?


Edited by Winston 60

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As has been said in other posts, it's likely a product of the clients and server not being synced up correctly. Which is also why you have to lead your targets more when gunning.

Thanks for the info. Has someone from ED commented on this yet? It would be nice to know that they acknowledge this problem.

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As has been said in other posts, it's likely a product of the clients and server not being synced up correctly. Which is also why you have to lead your targets more when gunning.

 

 

 

also.. there may an issue with the gunsight

 

the pipper may not be taking certain own-ship parameters in to account

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Tonight our Squadron as a whole got less than 10% hits in F-15C's with AIM-120C's

 

We've experienced a much lower hit percentage, the last session we scored one hit out of twenty missiles fired (5%). Even if we assume some of them were launched at less than ideal parameters, none were launched outside of 12 miles (and those were from around 30k feet) - it's a bit silly at the moment.

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We sure wish ED would comment on this. Their deafening silence leads us to believe that multiplayer is not high on the "To Do" list? :hmm:

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look at the guidance of this R-27T and R-73 doing lag pursuit of the enemy aircraft and not lead from the very begining, at the same time the Matra exploded my aircraft at +400 meters distance!

 

iZqtBfZ9a30


Edited by JunMcKill
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After suffering this from day 1 after the initial 1.5.4 patch, I'm leaning towards believing that it's a netcode issue with the "changes" ED recently made starting with the 1.5.4 beta and then the release 1.5.4

 

1. Multiplayer. New extrapolation algorithm

2. Multiplayer. Reworked aircraft motion algorithms to improve resistance to lags.

 

After missing so many gun attacks from offset angles where I can see the bullets pass directly through the target at very close range, I'd say the above two items need a lot of work!

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Is this performance expected ?

 

Look both from the SU27 and the sparrows when I engaged in close combat.

 

 

 

 

I hope it worked.. look at 10 minute mark.

 

I don't think in real life, an aircraft at this distance and no flaring can outmatch the speed of a R-27R missile well below in Rtr


Edited by JunMcKill
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Just a quick report:

 

MP on the blue flag server, chasing down a Mig-21. Me and another guy in an F-15, we both shot all of our AIM-9Ms (8 in total) and no hits.

 

All shots were in range, 5 out of 8 shots were in the rear quarter, especially I took a shot going vertical and directly pointing my nose at his glowing afterburner, straight line... the other shots were coming in from the top, always with the 21 on the nose (the 9M should be an all-aspect missile).

No kills, had to switch to guns.

 

The AIM-7s are also pretty useless.

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I've had a few multiplayer rounds in recently. What is the consensus? For me, the missiles seem to perform the same as always, which is awful. In my opinion there has been a slow but very steady degradation of missile performance over the last 7-8 months. The range of shots I take now are about 1/2 of what they were in 1.2.x. and the initial 1.5 beta.

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It's probably that the server is sending the position data too late, and the client/missile still thinking the enemy aircraft is in position A at millisecond xyz while it actually moved on to position B already (few meters ahead) ? Could be fixed by entering a (milliseconds) delay for the aircrafts position to the missile?

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  • ED Team

Clocks are synced for all players in the same server. With non-zero pings the server, indeed, can only send old position data, or better to say, it sends current positions, but when clients receive them, the data is a bit old. So, a special netFM extrapolates the positions of planes, effectively predicting where a craft should be, based on previous positions. When a craft flights straight the predicted position practically matches the real one. In turns - the sharper the turn, the bigger is the error between the predicted and 'real' position - and since it depends on ping, it is slightly different for all players.

 

What we are changing/tuning currently, is this extrapolation (prediction) algorithm, to make it more robust and, err, predictable (no pun intended) in the modern network conditions.

 

So, the missile accuracy should actually improve a bit, not to get worse. If it has really become worse, something is not right in the missile code, not in netFM. We'll take a look.

Dmitry S. Baikov @ Eagle Dynamics

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Clocks are synced for all players in the same server. With non-zero pings the server, indeed, can only send old position data, or better to say, it sends current positions, but when clients receive them, the data is a bit old. So, a special netFM extrapolates the positions of planes, effectively predicting where a craft should be, based on previous positions. When a craft flights straight the predicted position practically matches the real one. In turns - the sharper the turn, the bigger is the error between the predicted and 'real' position - and since it depends on ping, it is slightly different for all players.

 

What we are changing/tuning currently, is this extrapolation (prediction) algorithm, to make it more robust and, err, predictable (no pun intended) in the modern network conditions.

 

So, the missile accuracy should actually improve a bit, not to get worse. If it has really become worse, something is not right in the missile code, not in netFM. We'll take a look.

We are experiencing these difficulties when Clients are shooting at AI airplanes..... not just Player vs. Player. Are you investigating this as well?

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Clocks are synced for all players in the same server. With non-zero pings the server, indeed, can only send old position data, or better to say, it sends current positions, but when clients receive them, the data is a bit old. So, a special netFM extrapolates the positions of planes, effectively predicting where a craft should be, based on previous positions. When a craft flights straight the predicted position practically matches the real one. In turns - the sharper the turn, the bigger is the error between the predicted and 'real' position - and since it depends on ping, it is slightly different for all players.

 

What we are changing/tuning currently, is this extrapolation (prediction) algorithm, to make it more robust and, err, predictable (no pun intended) in the modern network conditions.

 

So, the missile accuracy should actually improve a bit, not to get worse. If it has really become worse, something is not right in the missile code, not in netFM. We'll take a look.

 

:thumbup:

 

Thanks for looking into this (and explaining the code)!

Lord of Salt

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Thanks! And maybe there should be a server-client side check instead of "prediction", so the missile will actually explode on target registered on server if the shooting client missile actually hit the aircraft on the shooting client computer? (just my ideas :P )

 

Thx for explanation coff! Hope to see a patch soon!

DCS Wishlist: 2K11 Krug SA-4 Ganef SAM, VR-TrackIR icons next to player names in score-chart

PvP: 100+ manual player-kills with Stingers on a well known dynamic campaign server - 100+ VTOL FARP landings & 125+ hours AV-8B, F-14 crew, royal dutch airforce F-16C - PvP campaigns since 2013

DCS server-admins: please adhere to a common sense gaming industry policy as most server admins throughout the industry do. (After all there's enough hostility on the internet already which really doesn't help anyone. Thanks.)

Dell Visor VR headset, Ryzen 5 5600 (6C/12T), RTX 2060 - basic DCS-community rule-of-thumb: Don't believe bad things that a PvP pilot claims about another PvP pilot without having analyzed the existing evidence

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Clocks are synced for all players in the same server. With non-zero pings the server, indeed, can only send old position data, or better to say, it sends current positions, but when clients receive them, the data is a bit old. So, a special netFM extrapolates the positions of planes, effectively predicting where a craft should be, based on previous positions. When a craft flights straight the predicted position practically matches the real one. In turns - the sharper the turn, the bigger is the error between the predicted and 'real' position - and since it depends on ping, it is slightly different for all players.

 

What we are changing/tuning currently, is this extrapolation (prediction) algorithm, to make it more robust and, err, predictable (no pun intended) in the modern network conditions.

 

So, the missile accuracy should actually improve a bit, not to get worse. If it has really become worse, something is not right in the missile code, not in netFM. We'll take a look.

 

So, the lag for the shooter is fixed!!! Piper are working and missiles (though i'm not sure about the proximity fuze)

 

BUT for the guy defensive, you still have big sync problems (ie you get hit with guns even though you see the bullets are 30° off)

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Wait, there has been another patch Ktulu? :D (sry am on vacation)

DCS Wishlist: 2K11 Krug SA-4 Ganef SAM, VR-TrackIR icons next to player names in score-chart

PvP: 100+ manual player-kills with Stingers on a well known dynamic campaign server - 100+ VTOL FARP landings & 125+ hours AV-8B, F-14 crew, royal dutch airforce F-16C - PvP campaigns since 2013

DCS server-admins: please adhere to a common sense gaming industry policy as most server admins throughout the industry do. (After all there's enough hostility on the internet already which really doesn't help anyone. Thanks.)

Dell Visor VR headset, Ryzen 5 5600 (6C/12T), RTX 2060 - basic DCS-community rule-of-thumb: Don't believe bad things that a PvP pilot claims about another PvP pilot without having analyzed the existing evidence

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Wow! After a first multiplayer flight in this new patch, the IR missiles seem a bit more inclined to hit. More testing to follow, but confidence is high this may be a good fix. Thanks ED!

CPU: i7 980x @ 4.2GHz RAM: 24gb Corsair Vengeance

MB: Gigabyte Sniper X58 w/onboard Soundblaster X-Fi

HD: SanDisk 480gb SSD OS: Win7 Pro 64bit

VIDEO CARD: EVGA GTX 980ti FTW

MONITOR: LG 34" Ultrawide 2560x1080

MP SERVER: ibuypower i7-4810MQ w/Win7 Home 64bit

GEAR: Saitek X-52 Pro; Combat Rudder Pedals; Throttle Quadrants. Thrustmaster MFD's, TrackIR 5 w/Pro Clip, Turtle Beach X-12 Headset

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