Mig21 Vs F5E Tactics

[TheFace]

Thanks a but-ton for the track+video!

So if TheFace had had his radar on stby, he'd pretty much have had a good jump on you?

Radar was on.

 

Hehe I can tell you what happened there. I actually had good tone when he lost me around the EDIT:3:30 mark, missile didn't fire. I was mostly trying to figure out why on my dash. Drop tank release was on lol.

 

He killed me at least 2 times in that match, maybe 3. Great piloting Hadwell :thumbup: Have a ton to learn, but 3 or 4 gun kills and several missile kills later (and a bunch of deaths) it's getting a little more natural.

 

I do run with radar on ready instead of open after that particular confrontation:doh:

 

Edit: When I looped around behind him on the tacview footage at round 3:30 to 4:12 (when I lost my energy and had to dive and curse at the sidewinders not firing as everything was on and they were visible on the pylons) I had tone and several good chances for sidewinder shots.

本帖最后于2016年8月2日，由TheFace编辑

[golani79]

Radar was on.

 

Hehe I can tell you what happened there. I actually had good tone when he lost me around the 2:50 mark, missile didn't fire. I was mostly trying to figure out why on my dash. Drop tank release was on lol.

 

Hehe .. I feel with you.

 

Drop tank release got me 2 times already.

Was flying behind a 21 for at least 30 seconds cause it wasn´t aware of me - could have launched multiple good missiles and in another situation I also had a very good oportunity :doh::megalol:

 

Oh well ... at least now I always check if it´s off after dropping the tank :D

[TheFace]

Hehe .. I feel with you.

 

Drop tank release got me 2 times already.

Was flying behind a 21 for at least 30 seconds cause it wasn´t aware of me - could have launched multiple good missiles and in another situation I also had a very good oportunity :doh::megalol:

 

Oh well ... at least now I always check if it´s off after dropping the tank :D

 

Me too :thumbup:

 

I think I am going to setup a Roccat Power-grid profile on my tablet to handle the hardpoint / drop tank release to make it easier to deal with.

[Frostie]

 

Edit: When I looped around behind him on the tacview footage at round 3:30 to 4:12 (when I lost my energy and had to dive and curse at the sidewinders not firing as everything was on and they were visible on the pylons) I had tone and several good chances for sidewinder shots.

 

Why did you stop your right turn in the end there, you presented yourself nicely by flying straight, basically giving up. Even if you lost visual you should always continue the turn, this gives you the best chance of acquiring him again while also defending.

[TheFace]

Why did you stop your right turn in the end there, you presented yourself nicely by flying straight, basically giving up. Even if you lost visual you should always continue the turn, this gives you the best chance of acquiring him again while also defending.

My setup is sidestick so using the mouse to manipulate the dash switches is tough in a turn. I tried a left hand trackball, it didn't work form me :(.

 

So I was really focused on the dash trying to find out why the missile wasn't shooting since both wing mounts were armed and had growl.

 

It was only my third mp flight with it, and I am used to props where you usually have a few seconds if you gain a little space out of gun range. If I remember right I think I also lost visual on him and thought he peeled off towards my buddy, and also he had fired at most of his missiles, I think I had him at 4 shots when in reality it was 3. So I thought I had enough breathing room to find out why the sidewinders weren't firing.

 

I thought about just going guns, but I was really practicing with the sidewinders and wanted a sidewinder shot.

 

Didn't realize that having the drop tank switch on would stop the missiles from firing :doh:

[Hadwell]

in the climb I was holding 3Gs, will the aim-9P be able to track in a 3G spiral climb, even if you maintain tone before launch? I was fighting based on what I know of the F-5 as it currently is... maybe when the aim-9 gets fixed i'll have to re-think...

 

Thanks a but-ton for the track+video!

So if TheFace had had his radar on stby, he'd pretty much have had a good jump on you?

 

watch the awacs message right before he lights me up too... tells me there's a target at 171 6km away, i'm heading roughly north, so I look back, at the same time, he lights me up with his radar....

本帖最后于2016年8月2日，由Hadwell编辑

[TheFace]

in the climb I was holding 3Gs, will the aim-9P be able to track in a 3G spiral climb, even if you maintain tone before launch? I was fighting based on what I know of the F-5 as it currently is... maybe when the aim-9 gets fixed i'll have to re-think...

 

 

 

watch the awacs message right before he lights me up too... tells me there's a target at 171 6km away, i'm heading roughly north, so I look back, at the same time, he lights me up with his radar....

Maybe, maybe not. Did get a kill in a similar occasion in a match earlier that day, not sure if he was pulling 3g, though. Wish I wouldn't have had the drop ordinance switch on :). I did lose enough energy to get near stall toward the end of the chase up, and had I switched to guns I could have possibly landed a hit. I had a few deflection shot opportunities. I was trying to focus on missile deployment, though.

 

Good fight all around.

 

Still getting used to the systems, radar being one of them. Learned a good deal from that fight and the next one I think you killed me again :). Ended up getting a gun kill in the flight after after nearly getting a kill with sidewinders on possibly you again. The target was vigorously rolling and ended up pulling away.

[Svend_Dellepude]

...will the aim-9P be able to track in a 3G spiral climb, even if you maintain tone before launch?

 

If launched in the right parameters, you should be dead.

 

If I was in a MiG-21 I would only extend in a climb if I knew the F-5 was out of heaters.

[Bullitthead]

Radar was on.

 

Hehe I can tell you what happened there. I actually had good tone when he lost me around the EDIT:3:30 mark, missile didn't fire. I was mostly trying to figure out why on my dash. Drop tank release was on lol.

 

He killed me at least 2 times in that match, maybe 3. Great piloting Hadwell :thumbup: Have a ton to learn, but 3 or 4 gun kills and several missile kills later (and a bunch of deaths) it's getting a little more natural.

 

I do run with radar on ready instead of open after that particular confrontation:doh:

 

Edit: When I looped around behind him on the tacview footage at round 3:30 to 4:12 (when I lost my energy and had to dive and curse at the sidewinders not firing as everything was on and they were visible on the pylons) I had tone and several good chances for sidewinder shots.

 

I have 2 HOTAS buttons mapped to Emergency all jettison button cover OPEN and Emergency all jettison. This way I can drop all my tanks with 2 HOTAS inputs, works great for surprise dogfights. Got caught one too many times with that darned jettison switch on. I considered just using 1 button for emergency jettison and just popping the emergency jettison cover off manually during startup so it's ready to go lol.

[leadlag]

I am still having mixed results but my biggest problem is still eyeballing the opposition.

 

I get eyes on and loose them.

 

 

Any tips for picking them up and keeping eyes on?

[Hadwell]

I am still having mixed results but my biggest problem is still eyeballing the opposition.

 

I get eyes on and loose them.

 

 

Any tips for picking them up and keeping eyes on?

 

Zoom in and out a lot, the LOD depends a lot on zoom levels, also look for smoke and shadows on the ground or water, signs of planes, not just the plane itself.

 

Also if you see a friendly he might be chasing or being chased...

本帖最后于2016年8月8日，由Hadwell编辑

[leadlag]

Zoom in and out a lot, the LOD depends a lot on zoom levels, also look for smoke and shadows on the ground or water, signs of planes, not just the plane itself.

 

Also if you see a friendly he might be chasing or being chased...

 

Cheers,

 

Yep, pretty much what I do. Found that low altitude looking up tends to be easier to pick up.

 

Happy with a 5 to 1 kill ratio today. 3 missile shots and two I tempted straight into the SAM battery's so I'm taking them.

[urpark]

scored my first 5 kills in online in the Mig today. this is amazing ... after such a long time of flying around as an easy target, I finally brought them something back to catch today :D

 

still struggling with open fights against the F5 and SARs though or keeping track of a target.

4 out of 5 hits were made with r60s (one R-3R) and with mountains close by to sneak away. Several times I locked a target, but had no chance to keep it on them if they break away. :joystick:

 

And the videos helped a lot Hadwell, thanks! That was exactly what I needed :)

本帖最后于2016年12月1日，由urpark编辑

[Brigg]

Bought this wonderful icon a couple of days ago, and she is awesome so well done Belsimtek :thumbup: Also what a great thread with loads of valuable info for a noob like me. thanks guys :)

[urpark]

Bought this wonderful icon a couple of days ago, and she is awesome so well done Belsimtek :thumbup: Also what a great thread with loads of valuable info for a noob like me. thanks guys :)

 

yes, it just feels badass to take off and it is very rewarding when you start to learn how to handle it and score the first kills. What I like most, is that you only work with those rudimentary systems. even just navigating in bad weather from A to B at night is fun and a challenge.

 

The flight instructor of my brother did flew the mig21 as a military pilot and he told us that you, even if you are already fast, get kicked into the seat when you activate the afterburner. It felt basically like a rocket with a seat attached on it :D

本帖最后于2016年12月2日，由urpark编辑

[Brigg]

yes, it just feels badass to take off and it is very rewarding when you start to learn how to handle it and score the first kills. What I like most, is that you only work with those rudimentary systems. even just navigating in bad weather from A to B at night is fun and a challenge.

 

The flight instructor of my brother did flew the mig21 as a military pilot and he told us that you, even if you are already fast, get kicked into the seat when you activate the afterburner. It felt basically like a rocket with a seat attached on it :D

 

Cool :thumbup:

[KilledAlive]

Is it a viable strategy to set your Radar to standby to reduce your footprint? Sure, you won't be able to use Radar Missiles, but would enemies not be able to spot you on Radar?

[BeastyBaiter]

For multiplayer, I recommend leaving it in standby all the time and using IR missiles + gun exclusively.

[AlienAlien]

Wrong. The MiG-21 is only faster on afterburner. and that afterburner overheats in what..2 mins.. lol

 

 

Wrong. Unlimited in afterburner and 3mn in full reheat afterburner (emergency AFB).

 

 

Until you get some surge problem at the nose cone or your fuel tanks are empty. :music_whistling:

[Auditor]

Is it a viable strategy to set your Radar to standby to reduce your footprint? Sure, you won't be able to use Radar Missiles, but would enemies not be able to spot you on Radar?

Couple things, and I'm not sure if this is an error in terminology or not.

 

Turning off your radar has no bearing whatsoever on the enemies ability to see you on radar. It only prevents them from seeing your radar on their Radar Warning Receiver. So turning off your radar doesn't help if their radar is already looking for you.

 

In terms of turning it off to prevent enemy RWRs from seeing you: absolutely. Especially against the F-5E which gets a really modern RWR that tells them exactly what the threat is that is painting them. Allowing them to discern from friendly radars and your radar.

Unlike you, whose RWR consists of four lights that blink :lol:

 

in its current state, I wouldn't even use radar guided missiles against F-5Es. It would probably be a bad idea even if the missiles were working correctly only because the R-3Rs are not great against maneuvering targets. R-60's are better for that.

[erniedaoage]

Yeah you set your radar to stby so that you will not be visible at your enemies rwr. RWR sees threats 360 degrees around your aircraft while radar just sees in front of you.

Which will allow you to sneak up on any enemy aicraft from behind or an angle his radar won't see you. You can still use r3 missles that way, but u have to turn on your radar when you are already in firing range and you have to guide the missile to the target.

[pepin1234]

Head on and kill him with radar missile while you keep a slight bank with flare, In dogfight keep vertical and save R-60 for his 6. F-5E have little options with Mig