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Are these little stutters normal?


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I've been tearing my hair out trying to figure out the problem with DCS on my machine. It's a rather powerful PC, specs below. The issue is in VR or non-VR I get this small little stutters every 2-5 seconds or so. I'll be flying along, in solo, doing one of the "Instant Action" missions and freeze, then normal for 2-5 seconds, freeze, normal for 2-5 seconds, over and over.

 

I've tried a huge amount of things to try to fix this issue but still have not figured it out. I'm not necessarily looking for troubleshooting in this thread but rather I wanted to post video of what's happening to see if it's just a normal part of the game that others live with (and I'm just being too picky) or if others agree this isn't normal.

 

PC Specs are

- Core i7 4770k 3.5 Ghz

- 32GB DDR3 RAM

- 256GB Samsung EVO 850 SSD (DCS installed here)

- 1 TB 7200 rpm HDD (D drive, not used in this scenario)

- Zotac Extreme GTX 1080

- Oculus Rift

....or....

- 3 27" Samsung 1080p LCD

 

Note: When playing without VR I'm using a 720p window on my primary monitor (not on all 3). I've turned every single option to it's lowest setting with no results. I play *many* other very demanding titles on my machine with no issues. Here is a link to my troubleshooting thread, the first post lists everything I've checked and tested

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=176326

 

And here are the videos showing the issues. Again the question is do you get small stutters like this and I'm being too picky or would this be a problem for you too? Thanks for any input you have, I've never been able to play this and would really like to.

 

-Ross

 

VR Stutter test - starts at :26

 

Non-VR Stutter test - starts at :14

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I've read both threads. Thoroughly, sorry for the users who ask questions that you have already answered in those threads. Makes things a bit repetitive.

 

I don't think it is a "Hardware" issue. "Per Say". It is a CPU manufacturing issue. Intel doesn't support DX9 and "Sandboxing' the software isn't the best method of increasing speed or usage.

 

This DX upgrade we have is a temp. method and is I believe at the heart of your issue. The priority given to DX9 Commands isn't optimized on the CPU level. This also includes GPU DX

level commands.

 

I have read all you have tried as stated. Try installing a lower level GPU and see how it handles those commands. Those as you know aren't adjustable only the adjunct tech.

This was a Boutique Builder iBuypower rig. Until I got the tinker bug again i7 920 @3.6Mhz 12Gig Corsair XMS3 ram 1600 Nvidia 760 SLi w/4Gig DDR5 Ram Intel 310 SSD HDD 160 Gb + Western Digital 4Terabyte HDD Creative SB X-Fi HD Audio Logitech X-530 5.1 Surround Speaker System Dual Acer 32"Monitors. PSU 1200 w Thermaltake Win10 64Bit.

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Hi Exigeous

 

The thing that causes stutters is the game's main thread, or a thread that it relies on, not completing in the games intended draw time-frame. This usually happens in Windows when something starts going crazy on the IO front (i.e. disk or network reads/writes), or in games that don't load their assets from disk in a way that takes keeping frame rates going into consideration. Even games that do can fall foul of the Windows task scheduler's decisions.

 

I have noticed both cases in DCS. The latter can be seen when you're on the ground and have just started up. If you turn you head 360 degrees then the loading into the seen of the rather enormous number of geometry will cause stutters. Once that's loaded (two to three seconds on my machine) then those stutters go away and the frame rate smooths out.

 

I have also seen the former case which is usually due to other software on your machine deciding it's now a great time to do disk and/or network intensive work. That can cause the Windows task scheduler to take some time to put threats back on the execution queue and so for a fraction of a second (or longer in extreme cases) DCS may literally not be running on your machine because it's waiting for something to finish that Windows has decided is of sufficiently high priority. The culprit for this is often something like and anti-virus program deciding to perform a scan. Windows defender in particular has gone bat-crazy on my machine in the past. You can get cure the AV problem by getting one that allows you to temporarily disable it. It can also be any one of a number of bloatware or malware programs that you don't realise you have.

 

To see if it's this try disabling all background software (especially anti-virus) while running DCS and uninstalling all unnecessary software that some company has decided has to auto load at startup despite you only using it once a year. If you still have issues then try re-install the OS in case you have additional malware that you're unaware of. And I mean a CLEAN installation, not a repair that leaves all that cr** in place.

 

By running a fairly clean Windows machine with a slightly lower spec CPU than you and the same GPU I get almost no stutters at all. I say almost, because they do happen, but - except for the initial load that happens when you look around 360 degrees on startup - only very very seldom.

 

For context I am a games programmer.

 

 

Hope that helps

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Along with the above recommendations...why dont you OC that K?

 

I have no issues like you are seeing with my system.

 

Cooler Master HAF XB EVO , ASUS P8Z77-V, i7-3770K @ 4.6GHz, Noctua AC, 32GB Corsair Vengeance Pro, EVGA 1080TI 11GB, 2 Samsung 840 Pro 540GB SSDs Raid 0, 1TB HDD, EVGA SuperNOVA 1300W PS, G930 Wireless SS Headset, TrackIR5/Wireless Proclip, TM Warthog, Saitek Pro Combat Pedals, 75" Samsung 4K QLED, HP Reverb G2, Win 10

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It begs the question, but can a reinstallation of the drivers (clean install) possibly have an effect also on cleaning the stuttering issue? I am having stuttering problems also again, but have not tried this. I do wonder if it's worth a try.

Intel i5-9600K @ 3.7GHz

Gigabyte Z370XP SLI Mobo

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4

GIGABYTE GeForce RTX 2070 8GB 256-Bit GDDR6(Assume the latest driver version)

Thermaltake Water 3.0 Certified Liquid Cooling System

Windows 10 Professional

Oculus Rift-S /TrackIR 5 in case VR dies

Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog w/ Thrustmaster T-Flight Rudder Pedals

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...This usually happens in Windows when something starts going crazy on the IO front (i.e. disk or network reads/writes)

 

You are right, atsmith6.

 

I had exactly the same stutters as he posted in his video. I moved the Windows TEMP-folders from my ssd to the hdd (yes.. to hdd!!) by changing a environment variable, see here. After that, the game runs smooth as butter...

 

While in flight, DCS writes the trackfiles into those TEMP-folders, causing the game to stutter on some systems. Switching these to another disk, preferably on another SATA-Controller (most mobos have 2 of them) helped alot in my case.

--------------------------------------------

i7 12700F | 64GB | RTX 4090 | Asus Z690-P WIFI D4 | 2TB SSD

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Every single one of the posts after mine has been tried guys.

 

Please read both threads it will save time. In our effort to assist users.

This was a Boutique Builder iBuypower rig. Until I got the tinker bug again i7 920 @3.6Mhz 12Gig Corsair XMS3 ram 1600 Nvidia 760 SLi w/4Gig DDR5 Ram Intel 310 SSD HDD 160 Gb + Western Digital 4Terabyte HDD Creative SB X-Fi HD Audio Logitech X-530 5.1 Surround Speaker System Dual Acer 32"Monitors. PSU 1200 w Thermaltake Win10 64Bit.

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You are right, atsmith6.

 

I had exactly the same stutters as he posted in his video. I moved the Windows TEMP-folders from my ssd to the hdd (yes.. to hdd!!) by changing a environment variable, see here. After that, the game runs smooth as butter...

 

While in flight, DCS writes the trackfiles into those TEMP-folders, causing the game to stutter on some systems. Switching these to another disk, preferably on another SATA-Controller (most mobos have 2 of them) helped alot in my case.

 

Now that is a damn good idea. I think I am going to do precisely that. Much appreciated :)

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  • 2 weeks later...
Every single one of the posts after mine has been tried guys.

 

Please read both threads it will save time. In our effort to assist users.

 

AtaliaA1 - thank you so much for your replies and attempts to help. You're exactly right that at this point everything suggested has been tried. I'm not surprised others haven't read the other thread, while I have done a great job of keeping everything I've tried, and failed, in the original post so it's easy to read people just don't click on such things. As such they'll try to help with somewhat simple suggestions that have been tried LONG ago.

 

I've now asked for a refund for a second time as support dismissed that and then asked if I could make videos showing the issue, again something I did a good while back and had already shared with them. In 2 weeks they've not made a single suggestion of something to try and have only asked me 2 questions, both of things that are in the thread that I've already tried. In short support is an absolute joke.

 

I do realize this isn't a simple issue, if it was I would have figured it out a long while back. Clearly there is something in the DCS code that is incompatible or not working properly with my PC but at this point I, nor anyone else, has an idea about what it could be.

 

Thanks again,

 

~X

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That SATA Controller issue sounds interesting, It adds to my initial post in that the CPU manufactures are not supporting our DX9 Sandboxed Software.

 

The Controller Idea is in line with that Hypothesis If the commands executed on the CPU level were added to the chip it could relieve the lag in executing said commands. Changing to another

controller on the MB would go far in proving the likelihood of this guess.

 

I am interested to know how that works for you.

 

I have an older system and have no lag. How this is achieved we have no idea. But it is very interesting that a lot of users have older chips with no issues of lag.

This was a Boutique Builder iBuypower rig. Until I got the tinker bug again i7 920 @3.6Mhz 12Gig Corsair XMS3 ram 1600 Nvidia 760 SLi w/4Gig DDR5 Ram Intel 310 SSD HDD 160 Gb + Western Digital 4Terabyte HDD Creative SB X-Fi HD Audio Logitech X-530 5.1 Surround Speaker System Dual Acer 32"Monitors. PSU 1200 w Thermaltake Win10 64Bit.

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And yet again failure. Tried moving the temp drive just to see and nada, same exact issue. I hate to keep saying it but I just have to give up at this point as I've spent at least 20 and likely far more hours trying to get DCS playable and can't make it work. While I have a good amount of time to play I don't have this much and would rather spend my time playing games instead of troubleshooting them.

 

I do appreciate all your help AtaliaA1, too bad we haven't been able to get this to work for me.

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I have been playing on the same CPU as AtaliaA1 has for a couple weeks now, non overclocked, and I have no stutter down to like 17fps, thats when things get hairy ;)

 

Disable all your onboard stuff you dont need, maybe change PCIe slot for a present add-on card and reread your mobo's layout were which PCIe lane is used with what restrictions !

 

I really hope my new system wont have that BS !!!!!!!!! hope it arrives today HOP HOP in circles

Gigabyte Aorus X570S Master - Ryzen 5900X - Gskill 64GB 3200/CL14@3600/CL14 - Asus 1080ti EK-waterblock - 4x Samsung 980Pro 1TB - 1x Samsung 870 Evo 1TB - 1x SanDisc 120GB SSD - Heatkiller IV - MoRa3-360LT@9x120mm Noctua F12 - Corsair AXi-1200 - TiR5-Pro - Warthog Hotas - Saitek Combat Pedals - Asus PG278Q 27" QHD Gsync 144Hz - Corsair K70 RGB Pro - Win11 Pro/Linux - Phanteks Evolv-X 

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Also, comes to my mind, Nvidia Forum is debatting a topic regarding stutters and hiccups on 1070 and 1080's at very high fps.

 

I have placed the link somewhere here in a recent post,...google it :)

 

Might well be your symptom as well. They have no fix as far as I know, layout issue.

Gigabyte Aorus X570S Master - Ryzen 5900X - Gskill 64GB 3200/CL14@3600/CL14 - Asus 1080ti EK-waterblock - 4x Samsung 980Pro 1TB - 1x Samsung 870 Evo 1TB - 1x SanDisc 120GB SSD - Heatkiller IV - MoRa3-360LT@9x120mm Noctua F12 - Corsair AXi-1200 - TiR5-Pro - Warthog Hotas - Saitek Combat Pedals - Asus PG278Q 27" QHD Gsync 144Hz - Corsair K70 RGB Pro - Win11 Pro/Linux - Phanteks Evolv-X 

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Not fixable stutter on the high end cards? :doh:

 

I have not read the article in detail as I am not affected but I found the link again for one of the topics for high latency and stutter on those high end cards, what a pitty.

 

The gear works seem to make a lot of trouble these days, time for better PCIe implementations, more lanes, better clock chips and better overall layout so this doesnt happen. I'd be freakin' outrageous if I paid 800€ for a High End 1080 and get stutter at 125 fps :( DONG

 

 

https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/941579/geforce-1000-series/gtx-1080-high-dpc-latency-and-stuttering/

 

 

*edit: there are LATENCY MEASUREMENT tools around for free, I think the article refers to one, downlaod, install and make the test, I will do the same with my new rig just out of curiosity.

Gigabyte Aorus X570S Master - Ryzen 5900X - Gskill 64GB 3200/CL14@3600/CL14 - Asus 1080ti EK-waterblock - 4x Samsung 980Pro 1TB - 1x Samsung 870 Evo 1TB - 1x SanDisc 120GB SSD - Heatkiller IV - MoRa3-360LT@9x120mm Noctua F12 - Corsair AXi-1200 - TiR5-Pro - Warthog Hotas - Saitek Combat Pedals - Asus PG278Q 27" QHD Gsync 144Hz - Corsair K70 RGB Pro - Win11 Pro/Linux - Phanteks Evolv-X 

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