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Tips and help needed on low speed fighting and flying


Little_D
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Hi gents,

 

I need help and tips for low speed fighting in the K-4. Here is our problem:

At speeds between 250Km/H - 350 Km/H the K-4 feels verry unstable and wobbeling like there are some Rubber bands control the plane. Controlls are fittet with curves to fly the plane smooth and nice, also the engin power and rpm doesent matter, at this speeds she handles like shit. Not realy possible to make at this speeds clean manover in a dogfight. Yes i know K-4 is no dogfighter its an energy fighter, but she should handle at this speeds like a nice plane and not like this and i am not speaking from stupit close hard turnfights against a spit, i dont do this, not in 1946, not in Cliffs of Dover and not in DCS. What i mean is something like: climbing up again after an atack and at 300 Km/H you are coming out of a high yo-yo with an half rolle and nose down to go on the enemy again, and she is flying like she is in a verry hard stall, no nice clean combat moves possible.

 

Also i find it strange, that at ATA 1.2 and 2200 rpm and 450 Km/H even with nose trim down to 2, she starts to fly a looping, dont get it done till the end, but still ...??? I know it was build nose up, but this? Even at ATA 1.05 and 2000 rpm at the same speed and trim she trys to fly into the sky. Building a plane nose up to avoid not coming out of a dive is ok, but i dont think they build a plane, that is not able to be trimmed for level flight with light nose up, so you need to push the stick a little bit forward, but not that the plane is able with neutral stick to fly a looping is a bit to mutch. Doesent matter if on autoprop or manual.

 

All my teammates have the same poblem, some with cheep controls (cheep stick and CH rudders), some with mixed controlls (X52 and thrustmaster rudder) and some with expansive controlls (Warthog and Crosswind rudder)

 

Also i have never flown a 109 in a sim, that handles like this and i fly flightsims since Red Baron, i know Red Baron was not a sim:megalol::music_whistling:, but you know what i mean. I also finde that DCS has by far the best flight moddle than the other sims out there, even when there are still some things not right on all planes. So no whining only whant to know it and learn :smartass:.

 

So please help what do we wrong.

 

regards

 

Little_D

1./JG2_Little_D

Staffelkapitän

1./Jagdgeschwader 2 "Richthofen"

 

"Go for the leader, if you can. The path is the goal, the kill the result."

"The one who has 12, leads. The one who has six, follows."

 

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The 109 is quite a handful at low speeds, especially when first using the K-4 which handles quite different to the early variants. Although with good curves suited to you it is quite manageable. The best way to train this for my self was to go into the dogfight quick mission and get put myself into a low energy state and let the mustang go on to my 6 then try and get him off whilst not exceeding 2500 RPM. It's crude but helped me a lot for stall fighting in the K-4 and getting the right curves. The 109 can still run rings around Mustangs (still getting used to spits) however at most speeds due to it's higher power to weight. A few little pointers are also be easy on the throttle in these engagement as the torque is quite excessive as i'm sure you know and will flip you to the left if you accelerate to quickly. Plus use your flaps if needed, put them down only a few degrees but this should help in stall fights. Finally utilise the MW50 if needed however keep an eye on our engine settings.

 

The main bug about the 109 is the compass and artificial horizon, the FM is A-ok from what I know.

 

For myself I have a T.16000m and cruse at 2500rpm on automatic prop pitch at about 5k alt which I find the optimum for engaging people as they are usually a bit lower and you can easily dictate what goes on.


Edited by Zesphr
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For myself I have a T.16000m and cruse at 2500rpm on automatic prop pitch at about 5k alt which I find the optimum for engaging people as they are usually a bit lower and you can easily dictate what goes on.

 

You're done! From now on I'll cruise at 6,000 feet ! :)

Flight Simulation is the Virtual Materialization of a Dream...

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Hi gents,

 

I need help and tips for low speed fighting in the K-4. Here is our problem:

At speeds between 250Km/H - 350 Km/H the K-4 feels verry unstable and wobbeling like there are some Rubber bands control the plane. Controlls are fittet with curves to fly the plane smooth and nice, also the engin power and rpm doesent matter, at this speeds she handles like shit. Not realy possible to make at this speeds clean manover in a dogfight. Yes i know K-4 is no dogfighter its an energy fighter, but she should handle at this speeds like a nice plane and not like this and i am not speaking from stupit close hard turnfights against a spit, i dont do this, not in 1946, not in Cliffs of Dover and not in DCS. What i mean is something like: climbing up again after an atack and at 300 Km/H you are coming out of a high yo-yo with an half rolle and nose down to go on the enemy again, and she is flying like she is in a verry hard stall, no nice clean combat moves possible.

 

Also i find it strange, that at ATA 1.2 and 2200 rpm and 450 Km/H even with nose trim down to 2, she starts to fly a looping, dont get it done till the end, but still ...??? I know it was build nose up, but this? Even at ATA 1.05 and 2000 rpm at the same speed and trim she trys to fly into the sky. Building a plane nose up to avoid not coming out of a dive is ok, but i dont think they build a plane, that is not able to be trimmed for level flight with light nose up, so you need to push the stick a little bit forward, but not that the plane is able with neutral stick to fly a looping is a bit to mutch. Doesent matter if on autoprop or manual.

 

All my teammates have the same poblem, some with cheep controls (cheep stick and CH rudders), some with mixed controlls (X52 and thrustmaster rudder) and some with expansive controlls (Warthog and Crosswind rudder)

 

Also i have never flown a 109 in a sim, that handles like this and i fly flightsims since Red Baron, i know Red Baron was not a sim:megalol::music_whistling:, but you know what i mean. I also finde that DCS has by far the best flight moddle than the other sims out there, even when there are still some things not right on all planes. So no whining only whant to know it and learn :smartass:.

 

So please help what do we wrong.

 

regards

 

Little_D

 

I'm only talking for myself but i really like it now .For a K4 i tking it's accurate.I don't know if you tried it before 1.5.4 when the FM or controls sustained some changes but it wasn't pretty to fly before that.

And the really early version would climb like hell but horrible to control in a turn.Still you could so some fun things with every version of it ,even the eary versions so i always liked this plane.

 

About control curves : sometimes i use 0 mostly 7 or 9 ,sometimes i go as high as 17. The more you go up the worse the controls become when trying to do fast moves like in a scissor.

 

You could also try playing with a few values for the trim tabs in the options menu.


Edited by otto
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I changed my rudder curve to 25 and it really helped to keep ball centered and keep coordinated flight with minute rudder inputs. (same for Spit). I have TM Hotas X. let go of stick and see which way the A/c banks and climbs, if climbs and banks right, give slight left rudder, you will find the left wing will drop and most likely the plane will level out. could be just me because I'm no pilot but have been around planes my whole life slower rudder inputs also help with gunnery.

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Hi gents,

 

@otto,

Yes i know how the 109 was before the last patch and i know the vid from DavidRed, where he show the wrong stickforces. I also have set my curves new for the 109 and 190.

 

I fly now with 0 curves on elevator with a saturation for y from 70, ailerons

have now a curve of 5 and saturation for y from 100. Rudder is on a 30 curve and a saturation from y of 90.

 

This makes cointrolling both planes at all speeds mutch easyer. But it still feels that the 109 is mutch more unstable at speeds from 250 - 350 Km/H.

The 190 is at speeds from 250 - 300 Km/H mutch more stable than the 109

and easyer to control.

 

Also it looks like the stickforces are still not right for the 109, see here:

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=174867&page=10

 

maby this is the problem, whey the 109 is so unstable at low speeds between 250 and 300 Km/H. I also know that the G-6 had problems in low speed handling, but this was again solved with the later models.

 

regards

 

Little_D

1./JG2_Little_D

Staffelkapitän

1./Jagdgeschwader 2 "Richthofen"

 

"Go for the leader, if you can. The path is the goal, the kill the result."

"The one who has 12, leads. The one who has six, follows."

 

YouTube Channel: 1./JG2 Filmkanal

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Between 250-300 try working more with the rudder and leave the ailerons as close to neutral as possible. That was the key for flying low speed after the 'clamping' changes a few patches ago. Other than that a bit of flaps are always good.

 

AFA curves idk what stick you have but I still prefer the 109 with 0 curve and 0 saturation on all axes except rudder with a curve of 10 (since my pedals are pretty crappy around the middle)

 

250-300 Km/h is a bad speed to be against a Spitfire anyway (unless you are way above him). Works against Mustangs but also only if they are silly enough to get that slow with you.

9./JG27

 

"If you can't hit anything, it's because you suck. If you get shot down, it's because you suck. You and me, we know we suck, and that makes it ok." - Worst person in all of DCS

 

"In the end, which will never come, we will all be satisifed... we must fight them on forum, we will fight them on reddit..." - Dunravin

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