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[REPORTED]Conditions for Launch Authorization? (Su-25T KAB500kr)


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  • ED Team

Great I can see it in the track, I am going to wait until the morning and run this past an ED team member, as I am seeing different results when using a fresh mission.

 

Thanks for your time, I will let you know how I get on


Edited by BIGNEWY

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Had some free time and gave it a shot.

Video taken in the current 1.5.5 Update

 

Modules: Well... all of 'em

 

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BIGNEWY, I see you have the laser on always and are getting a LA using a 10m target box. This is a TV guided bomb isn't it?

 

Try leaving off the laser and adjusting the target box size upwards from 10m until it snaps to a ground lock on the target which is quite a bit bigger than 10m. The laser shouldn't be required for a TV guided weapon, maybe this will help you reproduce the terminal miss?

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  • ED Team

I have tested without laser ( just habit switching laser on ) and I was getting the same results. An ED team member will take a look for us today.

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Based on my testing, I would say it's the wind.

 

Drop at 10 m/s wind results with near miss on a tank, while at 15 m/s wind bomb misses large targets.

 

Wind at 500 meters is automatically calculated. And I have noted earlier it regularly has much higher velocity than winds at other altitudes.

 

 

The settings in the attached image result in near miss on a tank, but a hit on a command post/warehouse or any object large enough so that deviation from the center of the target produces a hit.

 

During testing, I noted several interesting things, or possible issues:

- Contour recognition is not implemented - you don't need it to get Launch Authorized and there are no misses without it;

- Launch window is not accurate - you can launch KAB-500Kr from maximum distance, but later release, at approximately half of a launch window or later, practically always produces a miss. Like a bomb's guidance has no view of the target. This, I presume, has to do with change, in my perception, of bomb's fall path; long time ago, it used to quickly turn to vertical fall, with some wild maneuvers to return back (that's how it looked) towards the target; now it glides. As I've said, this is my perception and I may be completely wrong;

- Occasionally, second bomb loses tracking and misses it's target; I'm not sure whether that is in the attached tracks or not, and I didn't have more time to test it further.

 

If I have forgotten to write some observations, I will add them later.

KAB-500Kr-WindsAndNoWind.zip

Winds.thumb.jpg.1092058c525319b4bdcdc32d36a0d4f1.jpg

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  • ED Team

It does seem to be wind related.

 

ED are looking into it, thanks for the data Rabb, it has been helpful

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  • 3 weeks later...
Based on my testing, I would say it's the wind.

 

The settings in the attached image result in near miss on a tank, but a hit on a command post/warehouse or any object large enough so that deviation from the center of the target produces a hit.

 

I've attached a screenshot of settings from the Command Post mission I've been using to consistently miss (assuming opening in the mission editor is accurate and it doesn't change over the mission). - the wind settings seem about half of you "hit" settings.

 

 

During testing, I noted several interesting things, or possible issues:

- Contour recognition is not implemented - you don't need it to get Launch Authorized and there are no misses without it;

[/Quote]

Contour recognition is definitely implemented - and I have seen it lock when out of dropping range, it's just really finicky and sometimes you have to wobble the TDC cursor about over it.

 

So, it's specifically tracks you need? I've been avoiding them in lieu of raw data/observations because I've consistently read that they are inaccurate (if the actual progress of a flown mission isn't kept accurately, can we trust the per-frame physics decisions?)

771632021_Screenshot2017-02-0623_31_28.png.a77c08158b4009f8482534f8d3cbf958.png

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It's not the wind.

 

Attached is a custom mission that starts you heading south towards Kutaisi (the smaller). The command post is placed in the middle of the main runway, and comes within bomb range within about a minute.

 

There is no wind.

 

I've also attached a track - and include a link to a video of the live run below. I've done it this way so there is absolutely no time warping involved (considering in the command post strike mission it's about 20 minutes in, extra frustrating.)

 

I release one bomb as soon as getting LA (1:40 on video), and the other about halfway down the "safe" area (1:56). The first bomb misses in the way that we've seen (and in the several times I have run the mission). The second actually does something different and goes way off-target - It could have been too late release, but still said it was in the LA safe zone. Neither hit. Also note that I get contour lock at some distance in this configuration - at 1:05.

 

I've repeated this mission several times and have not got a single hit.

 

Strike.miz

Strike_Misses.trk


Edited by NickD
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Tested on new OpenBeta 1.5.6.1938.247. Still misses.

 

However - discovered that when deliberately releasing weapons *without* contour lock, the bomb appears to hit the target properly.

 

Steps of test:

  1. Left target size minimum
  2. Waited until LA, released first weapon
  3. Increased target size until contour lock achieved
  4. Released second weapon

The contour lock is still properly over the exact same point of the target, but the second bomb misses, and the first hits. So for some reason the calculations with contour lock are different, even though the target hit point is the same.

 

This means that it's actually playable, as long as you ignore the contour lock capability.

 

 

As a small aside, additionally I was playing with weapon release modes/release timing (to make dropping several automatic), and these settings don't appear to work for the KAB500-Kr. The manual seems to name the controls for "Free-fall" ordinance in one place, and just "Air to ground weapons" in another, so this might be deliberate and just not well documented.

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