Pitch Carets.

[bart]

Are these implemented yet?

 

I read in the pocket guide that for EA they are fixed at 14 deg but they dont appear on the HUD in STOL mode. Anyone know if this is a bug or are they just not showing yet?

[fjacobsen]

Are these implemented yet?

 

I read in the pocket guide that for EA they are fixed at 14 deg but they dont appear on the HUD in STOL mode. Anyone know if this is a bug or are they just not showing yet?

 

They do show if You pitch up, then You will see them slightly below the 15° pitch ladder.

[bart]

Ahhh ok. I dont pitch up that much on T/O so I guess thats why I havent seen them. It says to line up the witches hat on the carets on T/O but 15 deg nose up.....isnt that a bit high?

[fjacobsen]

I rather think they indicate the maximum (It's told to be 15°) You should pitch up while in VTOL mode in order not to loose control.

 

I normally keep the "Witch Hat" on the zero pitch ladder.

 

If You then gradually points the Nozzles back and in the same tempo increase pitch towards the Pitch Carrets, then You can make a very steep climb out of hover towards normal flight (I guess like seen in some videos).

[bart]

Good tips thanks.

 

Ill try this out next time I fly it.

[Flamin_Squirrel]

From the (real) manual:

 

Pitch carets (PC) are set at 14 for all takeoffs. This places the pitch carets at 6°of elevation with respect to thehorizon bars in the V/STOL Master Mode. This position indicates the desired post--takeoff placement of the Depressed Attitude Symbol (or Witches Hat). This takeoff attitude is the level--flight equivalent of 14° AOA.

 

I've not figured out how to set the caret yet either.

[gabuzomeu]

Hello,

as I see the default pitch carets currentl stand at 14° on the HUD. This is not where they should be according to the quote above at 6° (nor according to the pocket guide)

NB: it is stated in pocket guide that PC setting is not done yet. You can have PC and NRAS appear on ODU by pressing twice TCN (or any other key)

[Eagle7907]

Hello,

as I see the default pitch carets currentl stand at 14° on the HUD. This is not where they should be according to the quote above at 6° (nor according to the pocket guide)

NB: it is stated in pocket guide that PC setting is not done yet. You can have PC and NRAS appear on ODU by pressing twice TCN (or any other key)

 

 

 

I’ve seen them appear when selecting VSTOL master mode button.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Nealius]

The manuals confuse me on this part. Some say to put the Witch's Hat on the pitch carets, others say to keep the Witch's hat between the pitch carets and the horizon (maybe?).

 

I just remember to smoothly nozzle out without the VV dipping below the Witch's Hat, pause at 25-degree nozzles to raise gear/flaps, then continue nozzling out to 0.

[WildBillKelsoe]

And here we are 2020, and this is basic functionality unresolved...

[=52d= Skip]

And here we are 2020, and this is basic functionality unresolved...

 

And what exactly would you say is it that is still unresolved?

[WildBillKelsoe]

And what exactly would you say is it that is still unresolved?

 

VREST calculation stuck at 60° nozzle regardless of weight, wind, conditions, and pressure. Inability to change NRAS because you dont know how to calculate NRAS because it is not written in the first place in the manual how to calculate it. Not even type it on ODU from scratchpad.

 

Basic, plane specific calculations...

 

Similarly, pictch carets could numerical value change on ODU but you dont know how to calculate it in the first place.

 

And to top it off, you are not sure about the flight model response to these numbers...:mad:

[lukeXIII]

Similarly, pictch carets could numerical value change on ODU but you dont know how to calculate it in the first place.

 

There is no calculation required for the pitch caret setting, it should always be set to 14 degrees for takeoff.

Edited July 14, 2020 by lukeXIII

[=52d= Skip]

VREST calculation stuck at 60° nozzle regardless of weight, wind, conditions, and pressure. Inability to change NRAS because you dont know how to calculate NRAS because it is not written in the first place in the manual how to calculate it. Not even type it on ODU from scratchpad.

 

Basic, plane specific calculations...

 

Similarly, pictch carets could numerical value change on ODU but you dont know how to calculate it in the first place.

 

And to top it off, you are not sure about the flight model response to these numbers...:mad:

 

The 60° default is a good middle ground for most DCS Type loadouts and the NRAS displayed in the VREST page does change according to your weight.

 

If you really want to go the extra mile you can use the RL documents to calculate the correct numbers (including PC values), and ofc you can input/ change them via the ODU.

It´s a mood point though as the correct numbers do not translate to a correct behavior in Sim. This however not because RAZBAM did a bad job, but due to limitations of the DCS core engine.

 

If you questioning the FM is more than "just a feeling" then I would encourage you to write it up, include some verifyable data on what is and what should be and pass them on to RAZBAM.

I`m sure they´ll not only listen, but also act upon if they can (see above).

 

A very good example of how such a write up could look like can be found here:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=262823

 

As you can see there not only did a user provide data on what is wrong, he also did provide the needed numbers as well as a (very simple to do) fix.

Unfortunately it is still not fixed :(

 

On top of that, even tho it is about the F-16, it does affect the Harrier as well. And - can you believe it - even the numbers you are talking about.

[WildBillKelsoe]

There is no calculation required for the pitch caret setting, it should always be set to 14 degrees for takeoff.

 

This is nonesense considering the change of CG and weight and loadouts change happening every second...

[WildBillKelsoe]

The 60° default is a good middle ground for most DCS Type loadouts and the NRAS displayed in the VREST page does change according to your weight.

 

If you really want to go the extra mile you can use the RL documents to calculate the correct numbers (including PC values), and ofc you can input/ change them via the ODU.

It´s a mood point though as the correct numbers do not translate to a correct behavior in Sim. This however not because RAZBAM did a bad job, but due to limitations of the DCS core engine.

 

If you questioning the FM is more than "just a feeling" then I would encourage you to write it up, include some verifyable data on what is and what should be and pass them on to RAZBAM.

I`m sure they´ll not only listen, but also act upon if they can (see above).

 

A very good example of how such a write up could look like can be found here:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=262823

 

As you can see there not only did a user provide data on what is wrong, he also did provide the needed numbers as well as a (very simple to do) fix.

Unfortunately it is still not fixed :(

 

On top of that, even tho it is about the F-16, it does affect the Harrier as well. And - can you believe it - even the numbers you are talking about.

 

 

that is tire grip - a ground behaviour feature, in a new module, not basic flight characteristic of a supposedly old module still getting its fixes since release... The worst part is I am saying calculating NRAS, not pitch carets. I am sure both are valuable, otherwise, it would have been etched on the HUD regardless of weight or be changeable in the ODU to begin with.

[kengou]

Pitch carots do appear in VSTOL master mode and the way to fly takeoffs is to place the witches hat on the pitch carrots and adjust nozzles and flaps continuously to keep the velocity vector on the witches hat. As speed picks up nozzle angle will reduce to zero and flaps will reduce to auto/cruise, and as speed picks up to 300 you can exit vstol mode into nav mode and begin climbing at 300.