KC-130 Air Refuelling lineup tips

[T.Eason]

Hey guys -

 

Just wondering if anyone has any lineup tips for refuelling with the KC-120 in the new Harrier?

 

There's a video of a guy showing some pointers to get the plugin lined up correctly, but the aircraft he's refuelling with isn't a KC-130 that ships with the AV-8B. (as seen here) -

 

If there's any pictures or videos with visual tips or anything along those lines please post them here!

Edited December 4, 2017 by T.Eason

[fargo007]

What I've been doing with good success:

 

Approach the basket 1-2 kts faster than the kc.

 

Flaps == auto

 

Air brake == on

 

The fuel probe is about even with your head, so I've been just keeping it in my peripheral vision at that level and it's been working well.

 

I have a harder time staying with the plane after hooking up.

[OStateBandit]

AUTO Flaps is prohibited for initial drogue engagement, and there's no need for the speed brake. Here's how VMAT-203 teaches the real deal. The entire Flight Syllabus Guide is posted in this forum. https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=196896

 

Reading and then employing these techniques got me making contacts every time; pay close attention to establishing a good scan, trimming, and being patient. Here's the pertinent parts of the FSG.

 

Name: Aerial Refueling Checklist

 

Purpose: Define the aerial refueling checklist.

 

Description of Procedures:

1. The air refueling checklist must be completed prior to reaching the astern position, and should be completed while in the observation position.

 

2. This checklist includes:

a. Master Arm: OFF

b. A / R Switch: Place A/R switch to OUT and check for illumination of READY light.

c. Probe Light: As desired.

d. Airspeed: Maintain 190-300 KIAS.

e. AOA: Within safe operating limits. 13° maximum.

f. Flaps: CRUISE, (STOL flaps may be used to maintain AOA below 13°). The use of AUTO flaps is prohibited for initial drogue engagement; authorized once "in the basket." Note: Switching from CRUISE Flaps to AUTO Flaps must be done prior to AOA increasing above 5 units.

g. AFC: Engage if desired.

h. VISOR: Down.

i. RADAR: SIL

 

3. If waiting in the Observation position for your turn to refuel, consider completing the checklist with the exception of extending the probe and selecting CRUISE / STOL flaps, which increases your drag and fuel flow, until it is your turn to refuel. Be sure to complete these two steps prior to departing the observation position for the appropriate astern position.

 

4. One critical step that is not directly stated in the checklist but is implied is to trim the aircraft. Extending the probe significantly increases the drag on the left side of the aircraft. Use the VSTOL master mode sideslip indicator or the heads down sideslip indicator to trim the ball center. You may also need to re-trim the aileron after extending the probe. Do not forget to re-trim the aircraft after refueling is complete.

 

Common Errors:

1. Attempting contact in AUTO Flaps.

2. Leaving speed brake out from join up.

3. Forgetting to trim the aircraft.

 

Corrections for Errors:

1. Ensure aircraft is in the proper configuration and trimmed by completing the A/R checklist.

 

Name: Astern Position

 

Purpose: Describe the astern position and required communications.

 

Description of Procedures:

1. Now established in the observation position with the air refueling checklist completed, you are awaiting clearance from the tanker to proceed to the astern position.

 

2. Once cleared by the tanker, move from the observation position to the astern position. This is defined as a position 10-15 ft aft of the drogue, with the probe in line both horizontally and vertically with the drogue, the aircraft trimmed, and no closure rate. For a single hose aircraft such as a KC-10 or KC-130 with only one hose deployed, this will be unambiguous. For two hoses deployed, such as on a KC-130, you will move from left to right, to the far right hose if you are the first aircraft to proceed from the Observation position to the Astern position (Right Astern in this case). The second aircraft will move to the Left Astern position once the first aircraft is safely established in the Right Astern position. Ensure you pass below and behind the tanker and drogue to avoid wake turbulence. This is especially important behind the KC-10. Once established, report "MARS-XX, LEFT / RIGHT ASTERN." The tanker will then clear you for drogue engagement.

 

Common Errors:

1. Assuming an astern position too far aft of the tanker at a level altitude and encountering wake turbulence.

2. Developing a closure rate within 10 ft of the drogue prior to being cleared to contact.

 

Corrections for Errors:

1. When transitioning from the observation to the astern position, maintain sufficient vertical separation to avoid wake turbulence from the tanker and drogue.

2. Do not attempt to engage the drogue until cleared to do so.

 

 

Name: Drogue Engagement

 

Purpose: Describe procedures and techniques for drogue engagement.

 

Description of Procedures:

 

1. Once in the astern position and cleared for contact by the tanker, select the drogue as the primary reference point for alignment during the approach. A good visual reference point for initial positioning is the drogue placed above the angled portion of the HUD combining lens with 10 ft of separation. Ensure the tanker’s amber ready light is illuminated.

 

2. It is important to scan the KC-130 refueling pod as well as aircraft for proper closure and fine-tuned alignment corrections in close. Smoothly increase power to establish an optimum 3-5 knot closure rate on the drogue. Maintain a primary scan on the refueling pod and aircraft while keeping the hose / drogue in your peripheral vision as closure begins. This will prevent you from "chasing the basket" and reduces PIO.

 

3. As the drogue passes the canopy bow, scan should be transitioned directly to the drogue, which should now be abeam your left shoulder aligned with the refueling probe. Fly the probe to the drogue until a successful "plug" is made. It is imperative to maintain the 3-5 knot closure at this point until contact and a successful "plug" is made. A reduction or termination in closure will result in "fencing" with the drogue as it oscillates in close proximity to the nose of the aircraft due to bow wave effect. An excessive closure rate can lead to violent hose whip following contact with the drogue, which will increase the likelihood of aircraft or probe structural damage. Once contact has occurred, report "contact" to the tanker.

 

4. Vertical alignment is maintained with the stick and horizontal alignment can be maintained with the rudder. Because the AV-8B probe is shoulder mounted, any alignment corrections made by rolling the aircraft with aileron input will cause probe movement in both the horizontal and vertical planes.

 

Common Errors:

1. Improper initial setup either too close or too wide abeam the drogue.

2. Improper closure on the drogue.

 

Corrections for Errors:

1. Set up in the proper position and maintain 3-5 knots closure.

2. Use small corrections in both attitude and power.

Edited December 4, 2017 by OStateBandit

[aileron]

Can someone tell me why I can't get the KC130 to acknowledge my "ready pre contact" call with them over the radio. I've tried turning the radio to channel 8 which I've made to freq 251.00mHz. But its on Comm2.

 

I've watched a video where a guy is just calling them up, but that doesn't seem to work for me. Even though each waypoint shows refuel as the action. I've got the KC130 at 15000 feet 270 kts in a race track over the ocean. No joy.

[nomdeplume]

Can someone tell me why I can't get the KC130 to acknowledge my "ready pre contact" call with them over the radio. I've tried turning the radio to channel 8 which I've made to freq 251.00mHz. But its on Comm2.

Only Easy Comms works for now. I think I also saw somewhere that Comm2 isn't working; but Easy Comms should tune Comm1 automatically for you.

 

You also need to be in the correct position for 'ready pre-contact' to respond with 'cleared contact'. Can't remember if you get some other response if you're not in the right position or if it just ignores you. If the initial join request got a response so you're confident the radio is working, then maybe try getting a bit closer before reporting pre-contact.

[IzoAzlion]

Can someone tell me why I can't get the KC130 to acknowledge my "ready pre contact" call with them over the radio. I've tried turning the radio to channel 8 which I've made to freq 251.00mHz. But its on Comm2.

 

I've watched a video where a guy is just calling them up, but that doesn't seem to work for me. Even though each waypoint shows refuel as the action. I've got the KC130 at 15000 feet 270 kts in a race track over the ocean. No joy.

 

I have read that Comm 2 doesn't work. not sure on that.

 

In the mission editor, set the freq to 127.5 which is the default comm 1 freq, or any freq on Comm 1 presets, that way you need only cycle through

[AG-51_Razor]

I have found that if you look at the pre-programed frequencies for comm 1 and 2, they are reversed in the cockpit. Channel 1 for comm 1 is what is channel 1 for comm 2.

[drPhibes]

(...) and there's no need for the speed brake.

 

Technically you are correct, but fine control of your speed is a lot easier when the brake is out. I prefer to nail the plugging the probe in the hose part before I make it harder by increasing the throttle sensitivity to normal levels.

[Angbor]

Thanks for the info OStateBandit. When reading those check lists, one thing really stuck out to me. And the answer to this will probably painfully obvious once it's stated. But, why is "Visor Down" one of the checklist items?

[chev255]

I think this is due to the risk that the drogue hits the canopy and fractures it??

[Marsvinet]

Can someone tell me why I can't get the KC130 to acknowledge my "ready pre contact" call with them over the radio. I've tried turning the radio to channel 8 which I've made to freq 251.00mHz. But its on Comm2.

 

I've watched a video where a guy is just calling them up, but that doesn't seem to work for me. Even though each waypoint shows refuel as the action. I've got the KC130 at 15000 feet 270 kts in a race track over the ocean. No joy.

 

Have you made sure that the volume on both radios are turned up high enough? I had that problem before. Took me way longer to find than I want to admit.

[Esac_mirmidon]

Just use the editor and change Comm 1 preset Channel 2 to 251.000 and use that Channel 2 to talk with the tanker.

[104th_Maverick]

I will make a KC-130 refuelling demo video with some tips at some point this week, watch this space!

[Esac_mirmidon]

Thanks Mav.

 

Give us some view tips on the KC-130 for a safe refuel.

[yogipol]

That is my tip for successful refueling in the air.

 

Lateral - Keep your current heading align with propeller tips of C-130 for correct distance from Harrier's fuselage.

Vertical - Keep the hose at the top part of the left mirror.

 

That works for me really well.

[todd022]

In said video....HOW in the hell is he flying in Nevada with that harrier?!

[Revelation]

In said video....HOW in the hell is he flying in Nevada with that harrier?!

 

Early testers had access to DCS 2.3 which is the test bed for 2.5.

[Para_Bellum]

Made a short video about AAR:

 

 

:)

[M1Combat]

"But, why is "Visor Down" one of the checklist items? " - Angbor

 

"I think this is due to the risk that the drogue hits the canopy and fractures it?"- chev255

 

 

Pfft... NO... It's in case anyone is taking pictures... ;)