F14 is old ... whats the big deal?

[3Sqn_Fudd]

F-14 too old? possibly....

 

But as Mustang once said when i was a uber noob.... "It's not you so much that I was worried about in the engadgement, its your missles"

[JonTex]

General rule of thumb with threads ...... if your not interested in the topic then dont post.:thumbup:

 

Otherwise your just fanning the flames and are off topic as usual. Nothing wrong with discussing why there is a real debate going on over "the cats" spare parts. At least I dont think so. And its what I prefer to talk about. Nobody twisted anyones arm to come in this thread and post your 2 cents worth. You gave it willingly so if this thread is old to you , Dead to you, or just plain too painful for you to read then simply click on one of the many other interesting threads at your disposal.

 

The funny thing is if this is the jerry springer show then why do you tune in everyday at the same time and same channel. And if this is a dead horse then put your stick away and go find a new one to beat. My thread topic may be a circus act to you but its what I would like to talk about. I could care less about discussing another F15 skin, or fighter ops game that features yet another aircraft we have seen simulated over and over in the flightsim community. So do you see me in the F15 discussion pushing my ideas on everyone, claiming that the F15 is over simulated and boring to me? Do you see me telling people in their threads that their thread is a dead horse? If I have it has been a very rare occasion. I know I probably shouldnt have posted this but hey you give your oppinion and I give mine no harm no foul. And no punches pulled these days I see.:thumbup:

[hitman]

now there is where everybody is wrong. its the 21st century, that means better weapons(cruise missles and rockets). With North Korea being really F*ed up, Iran being really weird lately, and the whole middle east now just getting out of control, its a much worse situation now then in 1980 when the cat and phoenix were needed. Right now the Army has a new cruise missle out, the THAAD (Terminal High Altitude Area Defense) but look at its specs and it can only travel up to only 125 miles, 200km and an altitude of 150km. Umm whats the range on the AIM-54? uhh 200-250 miles at an altitude of 100,000 feet at mach 5....the THAAD has only a kill ratio of 1:11/2:11 and that is PRETTY BAD!!!!!!! the THAAD's backup is the patriot missle and after that are normal SAMs. And personally, I dont like the Navy's version, "Aegis Ballistic Missile Defense System" either cause its stats and limited abilites suck also. So yea with cruise missles out with a distance of over 5000 miles, the Tomcat and Phoenix will be needed in the not so distant future.

 

 

More info-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_High_Altitude_Area_Defense

 

If you guys watched this special on "Future Weapons" it was pretty kool to see the thing launch and explode.:)

 

Ok. First off...how the hell can you lay claim the range of the Aim-54x is greater than 100km?

Raytheon Information.

Not to mention that the -54 is unreliable at best, considering its age. Your better off arguing that it was a good idea with the ABL system, which is far better than anything the -54 can pull off.

 

Tomcats retired. LET IT DIE IN PEACE!!!

[STRIKER]

General rule of thumb with threads ...... if your not interested in the topic then dont post.:thumbup:

.

 

lol, I was interested in this contentious thread, hence I posted. Ignorance is bliss....now back to my Jerry Springer show, lets hope its done with the commercials.

[hitman]

Because maybe my cousin used to fire them!!!!!! Whenever I would ask him when was the last time he launched a phoenix, he said when. I asked at what distance and one time a while back he said atleast 180 miles at a drone flying over the Pacific and killed it. Other times he usually shoots them at 75 miles (note. he used to fly the F-14B stationed at NAS Point Mugu).

 

P.S.- what is an AIM-54X? i know an A, B, and C but no X :P

 

Dont be dumb...seriously.

[Prophet]

now there is where everybody is wrong. its the 21st century, that means better weapons(cruise missles and rockets). With North Korea being really F*ed up, Iran being really weird lately, and the whole middle east now just getting out of control, its a much worse situation now then in 1980 when the cat and phoenix were needed. Right now the Army has a new cruise missle out, the THAAD (Terminal High Altitude Area Defense) but look at its specs and it can only travel up to only 125 miles, 200km and an altitude of 150km. Umm whats the range on the AIM-54? uhh 200-250 miles at an altitude of 100,000 feet at mach 5....the THAAD has only a kill ratio of 1:11/2:11 and that is PRETTY BAD!!!!!!! the THAAD's backup is the patriot missle and after that are normal SAMs. And personally, I dont like the Navy's version, "Aegis Ballistic Missile Defense System" either cause its stats and limited abilites suck also. So yea with cruise missles out with a distance of over 5000 miles, the Tomcat and Phoenix will be needed in the not so distant future.

 

 

More info-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_High_Altitude_Area_Defense

 

If you guys watched this special on "Future Weapons" it was pretty kool to see the thing launch and explode.:)

 

Way to take in the histeria :cheer3nc: . The situation is no different that it was in the 80's.

 

Different people, same threats, and same excuse to spend money on arms and take your rights away.

 

The BS in Chicago is a classic example. OMG a bomb, I know it looks like a toy, but you just never know what are in them today! :doh:

 

 

Oh and the :gun_rifle:Tomcat sucks.

[Kuky]

F-14 is an aircraft with most number of moving parts... and logically the more points of failure, the more likely things will fail... moving parts mean friction, wear and tear... time does it thing... so rightly it would make more then good sense to have something better, what ever that "better" might represent... money, maintenance, weapons, systems, but don't forget.. there's more politics involved in these kinds of decisions than you and I would ever know.

 

F-14 was here and it's retired now... I don't know what's all the fuss about??? It's like the stupid ranting about Falcon4 and LockOn :rolleyes:

[Guest IguanaKing]

Because maybe my cousin used to fire them!!!!!! Whenever I would ask him when was the last time he launched a phoenix, he said when. I asked at what distance and one time a while back he said atleast 180 miles at a drone flying over the Pacific and killed it. Other times he usually shoots them at 75 miles (note. he used to fly the F-14B stationed at NAS Point Mugu).

 

P.S.- what is an AIM-54X? i know an A, B, and C but no X :P

 

Yes, and your cousin made it a habit of discussing real-world weapons capabilities with someone without a need to know. :lol: X is what is referred to as an "undefined", or "don't care" condition...maybe that's where the reference to an AIM-54"X" came from.

[Guest IguanaKing]

Friends...four letters...I T A R...end of story. :)

[JonTex]

.

 

lol, I was interested in this contentious thread, hence I posted. Ignorance is bliss....now back to my Jerry Springer show, lets hope its done with the commercials.

 

Ok, striker as much respect as I have for you and what you have to say about anything Id have to say the "friends hats" would come off with your calling me ignorant, and jerry springer comment. And as much as I would love to defend my ideas and topic of discussion here ..... I digress.

 

Have you seen anything in the news about Iran?

 

Quote taken from that article " The U.S. military retired its F-14s last fall. That leaves only Iran — which bought the fighter jet in the 1970s when it was a U.S. ally — flying the planes."

 

Ok I see what your saying now. Yea I have seen the reports. But like I said if the F14 is outdated why should we worry about it. This should be like selling a beat up pinto to a man who wants to win the indy 500 right?

[JonTex]

You would think that, but in the world of air combat sometimes it might not be the case......the pinto might win

 

 

And in case some of you are wondering what is I T A R

 

International Traffic in Arms Regulations

 

do a google seacrh for a better read

 

Thats true I just wanted to take a different approach to this topic. Instead of stating that the Tomcat is so dangerous, why not state that its old and out dated and see what people can come up with. You know get people thinking about how much of a weapon "The Cat" really was in our arsenal.

 

It has been discussed in these forums before "who would win the F18 versus the F14" but we all sort of brushed that topic off as non-realistic. Well open your eyes people its very realistic now. If we kick this thing off with the Iranians you dont have to guess what jet will be a threat to us. Its a different song to sing when ,the loaded gun we condemned as outdated and a relic of the past, is pointed in our direction. I just figured maybe some people would see things just a bit different after bringing this topic to the surface in a new light. And in this case yes, the pinto just might win.

something to think about:joystick:

[STRIKER]

Ok, striker as much respect as I have for you and what you have to say about anything Id have to say the "friends hats" would come off with your calling me ignorant, and jerry springer comment.

 

You arent ignorant and in no way did I use that word...I hate forums when it comes to interpretation my friend and I respect your comments very much too along with your position in the formation community. I just was stating that I posted because I took this topic of interest . Mainly cause its been discussed so many times it felt like we were going around in circles with the f14. Nothing personal, just my two cents bud...and now back on topic...I think the better pilot will win in the F14 vs F18 engagement.

[Guest IguanaKing]

Well...the ITAR was brought up in light of the article you linked in your first post in this thread. That's why there is actually no debate on that subject...it simply will not happen. Now, although I acknowledge that Iran is a nation of intelligent people, living in a society which is MUCH more progressive than many of us westerners are led to believe...but...I'm not sure their F-14 fleet poses that much of a threat. Afterall, the Iranians were recently busted using recycled video footage of Chinese SSM tests as proof of their own "successful" SSM program.

[Hellcat61]

General rule of thumb with threads ...... if your not interested in the topic then dont post.:thumbup:

 

Otherwise your just fanning the flames and are off topic as usual. Nothing wrong with discussing why there is a real debate going on over "the cats" spare parts. At least I dont think so. And its what I prefer to talk about. Nobody twisted anyones arm to come in this thread and post your 2 cents worth. You gave it willingly so if this thread is old to you , Dead to you, or just plain too painful for you to read then simply click on one of the many other interesting threads at your disposal.

 

I happen to prefer to come into this thread and tell you that your topic has been beat to death. :chair: I agree, no one twisted my arm. I willingly felt like letting you know that there are a million other threads with the same theme. I call it like I see it. If it gets your undies in a bunch, I'm sorry. Nothing personal.

 

Have a nice day.

[JonTex]

You arent ignorant and in no way did I use that word...I hate forums when it comes to interpretation my friend and I respect your comments very much too along with your position in the formation community. I just was stating that I posted because I took this topic of interest . Mainly cause its been discussed so many times it felt like we were going around in circles with the f14. Nothing personal, just my two cents bud...and now back on topic...I think the better pilot will win in the F14 vs F18 engagement.

 

rgr, i hate forums too for that same reason. Sorry for the misunderstanding but some people post in a topic for no other reason but to pick a fight. I believe you called it "contentious" . I couldnt have found a better word for it. True that is what this thread has become but those who seriously come to add to the discussion would not say things like:

 

I happen to prefer to come into this thread and tell you that your topic has been beat to death. :chair: I agree, no one twisted my arm. I willingly felt like letting you know that there are a million other threads with the same theme. I call it like I see it. If it gets your undies in a bunch, I'm sorry. Nothing personal.

 

Have a nice day.

 

case and point for contention. I think his post speaks for itself. Is he really here to discuss the topic at hand? No , clearly not his motive is as clear as his statement. But in the mist of a myriad of post that all seem off topic , including yours (striker), its easy to take at least one the wrong way .... again apologies.

[nscode]

I think the better pilot will win in the F14 vs F18 engagement.

 

wrong. the better maintained and more updated plane does.

[Earthworm]

or why do you think US of A save the world from evil rogue states at least once in a decade ?

 

i laughed really hard at this one. when was the last time that the USA _saved_ the world from something?

[Vekkinho]

How 'bout "independence day" (the movie). And oh, they used F/A-18

[Kuky]

i laughed really hard at this one. when was the last time that the USA _saved_ the world from something?

 

damn right :music_whistling:

[nscode]

I think he was sarcastic :)

[STRIKER]

wrong. the better maintained and more updated plane does.

 

Was to ambiguous I think.

 

My point is its not just about the airplane. Sure the aircraft will give you up to some level of advantage with its great or small but never count out the pilots abilities in the equation either. Whats the use of a fantastic piece of machinery if the guy in the seat cant operate it effectively right?

[nscode]

If your airplane can barely get airborn, that variable goes into the equation with a very small coefficient. And that is the state of airplanes US faced or will face +/- 30 years from now.

[GGTharos]

Well, let's see.

 

BVR: F-18E, LO, AIM-120, AESA radar ... F-18 is like to get first look and first shot.

WVR: F-18E, JHCMS, AIM-9X ... F-18 is likely to get first shot, at any angle.

 

 

Looks like the F-18E wins.

[nscode]

How wonderfull it would be for Russia now if Iran wanted Flankers. They would get a bunch of money just to not sell them :)

[D-Scythe]

Well, let's see.

 

BVR: F-18E, LO, AIM-120, AESA radar ... F-18 is like to get first look and first shot.

WVR: F-18E, JHCMS, AIM-9X ... F-18 is likely to get first shot, at any angle.

 

 

Looks like the F-18E wins.

 

Obviously not GG. You forgot about the F-14's ion thrusters that give it fantastic energy in every concievable portion of ANY flight envelope (i.e. extends to missile and space envelopes). Factor in it's magnetic forcefield shielding that protects it from AMRAAMs and SA-10s as well as its AIM-54 proton missiles and the F/A-18 is no competition.

 

What was the USN thinking, giving up such cutting edge technology for such a conventional fighter like the Hornet.

 

Even the Chuck Norris of air supremacy fighters, the F-22 Raptor itself, would be hard-pressed to deal with the formidable Tomcat.