For VR: aircraft 25% larger when 2-5 miles away

[D4n]

Currently it's super hard to see flying aircraft in Windows Mixed Reality resolution when they are between 2 and 5 miles away from pilot. (In non-VR they are black spots far away in the distance, in VR black dots only appears at 1.5 nm or so)

[Buckeye]

You should check your settings bc in my CV1 I see them a hell of a lot further away than 1.5 miles out.

 

 

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[Gladman]

Currently it's super hard to see flying aircraft in Windows Mixed Reality resolution when they are between 2 and 5 miles away from pilot. (In non-VR they are black spots far away in the distance, in VR black dots only appears at 1.5 nm or so)

 

Its a well documented issue. I hear your pain. All I and many others would like is the scaling option back so we can set it as we choose. My entire group wants it back.

There have been a number of threads, none answered.

We do have a .lua that places a dot on objects 3-7 Nm out so you can actually engage. Its not perfect but until ED hears our plea, its the best we have.

[Mr_sukebe]

I'd like the removal of the ridiculous level of zoom, particularly for monitor users. I get the use of binoculars for spotting ground targets whilst conducting light banking, but in combat? Naw, that just doesn't sound right.

[tintifaxl]

I'd like the removal of the ridiculous level of zoom, particularly for monitor users. I get the use of binoculars for spotting ground targets whilst conducting light banking, but in combat? Naw, that just doesn't sound right.

 

Just don‘t use the zoom, when your feel it‘s not appropriate.

[D4n]

Gladman the .lua is on the server? Or client, and what about integrity check?

[RePhil]

I agree there should be a way that VR users get normal human distance views and track IR user don't get Steve Austin bionic view levels and while I am at it way can they get the ability to view like there head can do a 180 swivel I just saying :)

[Torso]

Just don‘t use the zoom, when your feel it‘s not appropriate.

 

The implication is that it is an unfair/unrealistic advantage that monitor users can zoom crazy amounts and VR users have some crippled version of zoom for some reason(Why was that decision made? Who made it? It was a terrible decision ). It is not about self-control. Because who in their right mind would believe some dude isn't gonna be using it if it is available to them and it is gonna help them to win a fight. As it currently is used by all who have it. A simple viewing of some player vids, both single and mp, on YT shows it used all the time by monitor/trackIR users.

 

The solution is simple. Make the zoom the same for both user types. Either super or somewhat realistic. Either way, it should be the same for both.

Edited April 3, 2018 by Torso

[Mr_sukebe]

The implication is that it is an unfair/unrealistic advantage that monitor users can zoom crazy amounts and VR users have some crippled version of zoom for some reason(Why was that decision made? Who made it? It was a terrible decision ). It is not about self-control. Because who in their right mind would believe some dude isn't gonna be using it if it is available to them and it is gonna help them to win a fight. As it currently is used by all who have it. A simple viewing of some player vids, both single and mp, on YT shows it used all the time by monitor/trackIR users.

 

The solution is simple. Make the zoom the same for both user types. Either super or somewhat realistic. Either way, it should be the same for both.

 

Quite.

My comment wasn't aimed at asking for a zoom that is better for VR users than monitor, but at least give us a level of parity.

[Gladman]

Gladman the .lua is on the server? Or client, and what about integrity check?

 

 

 

We run primarily co-op missions so our server allows labels. The .lua is on the client only. Given we are a tight group we know that everyone is using labels appropriately. I doubt that would be a level of trust that could be established on other servers.

[muehlema]

You should check your settings bc in my CV1 I see them a hell of a lot further away than 1.5 miles out.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Me too, 5-6nm or so, but unable to say if it is Mig 29 or my Own F5 team. My rule here, Radar Lock, shoot a sidewinder and ask questions later ;)

[Jack McCoy]

The now-removed scaling option was badly implemented: in VR at least, a russian heavy bomber could be spotted 25 miles away, and when you came in closer (10 NM?) it would become completely invisible and washed out.

 

The current implementation is a bit better but spotting a low-flying Mig-21 is nearly impossible. I guess it's also difficult in real life.

 

Spotting technique is also of importance. I usually catch movement in peripheral vision: that one pixel that flickered for a microsecond...

 

Looking forward to next gen VR resolution so I can then complain about poor framerate! ;)

[captflyby]

Our squadron uses modified labels when in combat. Black dots appear for the VR users when aircraft are 10nm or so away. Distance realistically should be 5 nm, the dots a bit larger, and color coded red or blue so you can avoid shooting your own team mate down. The other night I took them all out - turns out one of those anonymous black dots was my team mate, but my RWR said 21. But, in RL flying they are specs on the horizon. No way to tell what it is or who it is without IFF properly implemented.

[SharpeXB]

I'd like the removal of the ridiculous level of zoom, particularly for monitor users. I get the use of binoculars for spotting ground targets whilst conducting light banking, but in combat? Naw, that just doesn't sound right.

A variable FOV or zoom view is a feature of all “simulator” style games, especially flight sims. It’s there to replicate 20/20 eyesight both in field of view and acuity. It’s not any sort of unfair advantage because it’s self regulating. You are just trading one advantage for the other, acuity vs field of view. A player needs to have the same real world ability to see and discern objects both far and near, even their own dashboard. Since you can’t increase the resolution of your display the only solution is to make it larger. Depending on your monitor size, full zoomed in is actually life size.

[Mr_sukebe]

A variable FOV or zoom view is a feature of all “simulator” style games, especially flight sims. It’s there to replicate 20/20 eyesight both in field of view and acuity. It’s not any sort of unfair advantage because it’s self regulating. You are just trading one advantage for the other, acuity vs field of view. A player needs to have the same real world ability to see and discern objects both far and near, even their own dashboard. Since you can’t increase the resolution of your display the only solution is to make it larger. Depending on your monitor size, full zoomed in is actually life size.

 

Just to clarify. My point is that in a MP environment, monitor users have a SIGNIFICANT advantage over VR users when it comes to the ability to identify aircraft, as their zoom is MASSIVELY bigger. Nothing more to it than that.

 

In single player, I don't care what another player does with his own vision, that's his call.

[D4n]

until ED finally fixes DCS for WMR (specifically for GTX 1060 or RX 580, idc which one, they have both good prices) I don't even care about this thread anymore...

[SharpeXB]

Just to clarify. My point is that in a MP environment, monitor users have a SIGNIFICANT advantage over VR users when it comes to the ability to identify aircraft, as their zoom is MASSIVELY bigger. Nothing more to it than that.

 

In single player, I don't care what another player does with his own vision, that's his call.

Well the reality is that VR headsets are in their infancy. They really lack the resolution to be very effective in sims like this. The game can’t handicap other players down to that level out of “fairness”. The FOV limit maybe could be increased for VR but that might have the effect of making players sick. It would be up to them how much of it to use though, perhaps ED could just increase it.

Bottom line is ED can’t spoil the game for the majority of players just to accommodate the few VR users.

[blkspade]

I fly solely in VR, and don't feel even remotely disadvantaged. Heck I usually top the scoreboard. You simply need some clue as to where you need to be looking. If you don't go any higher that say 1.6 pixel density you can see a flankers dot out to around 16nm against the sky. I an even see my missiles either intercepting or missing. I actually feel OP with PD 1.5. The smaller fighter aircraft do get significantly harder to spot, but that is something that comes from having a smaller fighter. The Mig21, F-5, M2000 give the most difficulty, but the former 2 are most frequently flying so low I'd need to spot them against the terrain. Eveything is harder to see against the terrain, but the moment they fly over a light patch of terrain, I instantly see them. The Radar and RWR in the Eagle have matching markings for degrees off the nose where something which you can there reference as to which side of the hud/canopy rail to focus your vision. Radar will give you an elevation, the flanker/mig rwr will give you approximate elevation as well. AWACS also help hugely here as well, since you can use your compass as a point a reference.

[Prophet]

People with head tracking have an advantage over those without head tracking. People with a HOTAS have an advantage over those without a HOTAS. People with a better computer have an advantage over those with an Amiga.

[D4n]

People with head tracking have an advantage over those without head tracking. People with a HOTAS have an advantage over those without a HOTAS. People with a better computer have an advantage over those with an Amiga.

 

 

And the reason for this statement is?

[Mr_sukebe]

Well the reality is that VR headsets are in their infancy. They really lack the resolution to be very effective in sims like this. The game can’t handicap other players down to that level out of “fairness”. The FOV limit maybe could be increased for VR but that might have the effect of making players sick. It would be up to them how much of it to use though, perhaps ED could just increase it.

Bottom line is ED can’t spoil the game for the majority of players just to accommodate the few VR users.

 

Would I be correct in assuming that you don't go PvP in VR?

Edited May 9, 2018 by Mr_sukebe

[SharpeXB]

Would I be correct in assuming that you don't go PvP in VR?

No I don’t use VR. I’ve tried an OR CV1 headset but not for flight sims or gaming.

[Mr_sukebe]

No I don’t use VR. I’ve tried an OR CV1 headset but not for flight sims or gaming.

 

Please, do go try a comparison, such that you genuinely understand the difference in MP when one player has x16 zoom (or whatever the monitor user gets) on a pin sharp display, whilst the other player gets x2 zoom on something equivalent to an old CRT monitor for sharpness.

 

To repeat, I don't care in the slightest what a player does with his own settings in single player.

 

I do however get rather miffed that right now, mixed multi-player in DCS is utterly one sided from the perspective of aircraft identification.

[SharpeXB]

Please, do go try a comparison, such that you genuinely understand the difference in MP when one player has x16 zoom (or whatever the monitor user gets) on a pin sharp display, whilst the other player gets x2 zoom on something equivalent to an old CRT monitor for sharpness.

 

To repeat, I don't care in the slightest what a player does with his own settings in single player.

 

I do however get rather miffed that right now, mixed multi-player in DCS is utterly one sided from the perspective of aircraft identification.

The zoom level in DCS seems about right compared to other sims. Actually I find the zoom-out in DCS to be too wide, it can be limited in the response settings, actually both levels can if you desire.

ED is not going to bring monitors down to the level of VR sets. They could increase the zoom level for VR unless there’s some reason they can’t. I’ve tried an OR but I can’t imagine what zoom would look like in it. If I zoom viewed around as much in VR as I do on a monitor it would no doubt be stomach churning.

Edited May 9, 2018 by SharpeXB

[Torso]

If I zoom viewed around as much in VR as I do on a monitor it would no doubt be stomach churning.

 

This right here alone makes it clear it is something you use obviously a lot, and is basically removed for VR users. VR usage should not be penalized other than what the current level of tech limits you too. I have heard nothing from ED ever addressing this. Not even to say why it is different for VR users. I can already zoom a little, what harm is it gonna be to let me get the level a monitor users has. Let it be up to me if I cannot make use of it or if I can. Just give us the same ability at least.