Jump to content

"Cobra-Resistant" MiG-29?


Aluminum Donkey

Recommended Posts

Just a little observation... Even with the pitch damper turned off, the MiG-29 is really resistant to the Cobra maneuver... Anyone else noticing that?

I can get a good snappy pitch-up at around 400-450 km/h, but even yanking the stick back all the way, it 'quits' at about 45 degrees AoA or a bit more. There isn't a sharp snap to vertical (90 deg. AoA or more) like there is with the Flanker.

 

 

Is this right?

 

 

AD

Kit:

B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller.

--Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way!

If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

of course this is right. why do you think it would be wrong? why do you think the mig-29 should be able to fly like a flanker?

 

mig-29 does not have any fbw stability augmentation and is designed with limited instability. there is no cobra switch to disable, because there's no cobra maneuver to perform.

cobra is not a maneuver the vvs thought up and is like "okay this is kryptonite against amerika, tell tsagi to make sure every airplane can do this".

its a thing a sukhoi test pilot discovered he was able to do flying the flanker because of how the flanker works, and was not a consideration in either su-27 or mig-29 development.


Edited by probad
Link to comment
Share on other sites

of course this is right. why do you think it would be wrong? why do you think the mig-29 should be able to fly like a flanker?

 

mig-29 does not have any fbw stability augmentation and is designed with limited instability. there is no cobra switch to disable, because there's no cobra maneuver to perform.

R U sure that you know what you are talking about?

http://www.migflug.com/jetflights/the-incredible-pugachevs-cobra-maneuvre.html

i7-7700K 4.2GHz, 16GB, GTX 1070 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

are you sure you know what you're talking about?

those are newer mig-29 models with tvc they're promoting.

 

:lol::smartass: :thumbup:

I thought there is only one Mig-29 OVT. Not only does it have TVC, it has a full FBW.

BdVJPZAKAQE

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Back in 1988? Seriously?

 

No, the ovt was not active until circa 2000 AFAIK.

 

The cobra was done on a SU-27 in 1989

One of the First TVC aircraft was the X-31 on early 1990

https://www.nasa.gov/centers/armstrong/news/FactSheets/FS-009-DFRC.html

The only thing the Mig-29 did on 1989 Paris Airshow was crashing.


Edited by mvsgas

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

you got something to show me?

Why? google is your friend wink.gif

google is not anyone's friend when its filled with bogus reporting from people who cant tell the difference between the flanker and the fulcrum, nevermind all the people who think all mig-29 versions are the same aircraft.

 

farnborough 1988 had tailslide and high aoa pass, but no cobra.


Edited by probad
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5XrD9LA2iKw

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

of course this is right. why do you think it would be wrong? why do you think the mig-29 should be able to fly like a flanker?

 

 

mig-29 does not have any fbw stability augmentation and is designed with limited instability. there is no cobra switch to disable, because there's no cobra maneuver to perform.

cobra is not a maneuver the vvs thought up and is like "okay this is kryptonite against amerika, tell tsagi to make sure every airplane can do this".

its a thing a sukhoi test pilot discovered he was able to do flying the flanker because of how the flanker works, and was not a consideration in either su-27 or mig-29 development.

 

 

Wow, that sounded rather confrontational.

Anyway, both the Su-27 and MiG-29 have relaxed pitch stability, and the control systems both have pitch dampers. The MiG is more stable in pitch than the 27, but both require dampers for normal flight.

The reason I assume that the MiG is capable of the cobra maneuver is because I've seen it do so in real life, although admittedly it was nearly 30 years ago.

 

 

AD

Kit:

B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller.

--Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way!

If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

confrontational? that's right. i am absolutely going to confront the perpetuation of misinformation.

 

having dampers doesnt mean anything. lots of aircraft that arent relaxed stability have dampers. f-14 has dampers, f-5 has dampers.

mig-29 is not relaxed stability aircraft, it doesn't have any system that requires intervention between pilot and controls for the maintenance of stability. the su-27 does, it has asc.

the cobra-capable mig-29ovt has thrust vectoring, because that's the only way it can produce capability that the airframe does not inherently possess.

our mig-29a/s does not have tvc, and it doesnt have or need asc.

 

nobody credible remembers seeing a mig-29 performing a cobra in 1988. a lot of people remember seeing a flanker performing a cobra in 1989. one would think that if the mig-29 demonstrated a cobra a full year before the flanker did, that it would actually be more notable than the famous 1989 flanker routine.

 

backpedallers itt


Edited by probad
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Is that 506 blue? Wasn't that aircraft used for testing and promotional flights? I thought that was a Mig-29M?


Edited by mvsgas

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

even if our mig-29 was capable of pulling the instantaneous aoa, it would not be able to pitch back down like that given the deflection limits.

 

 

Sure it would, it doesn't use flight control input for pitching down after reaching the very high AoA. It's the aircraft's natural stability that causes it (center of lift is behind the center of gravity)

 

 

AD

Kit:

B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller.

--Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way!

If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah in our aircraft it's not a true high aoa excursion, since the stable aoa flight path follows up along with the pitchup attempt.

 

are there any more demonstrations of other mig-29a's executing a cobra? sifting through other airshow demos and i havent yet found any.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah in our aircraft it's not a true high aoa excursion, since the stable aoa flight path follows up along with the pitchup attempt.

 

are there any more demonstrations of other mig-29a's executing a cobra? sifting through other airshow demos and i havent yet found any.

 

 

None that I can cough up, but I saw the real deal at the Ottawa (Canada) Airshow back in 1989. Tail-slide as well as Cobra, same flight, MiG-29. I don't know what variant it was, but it was probably an A. Our A and S© versions in the sim are very similar.

 

 

It certainly can be done by the MiG-29, just not our simulated one :)

 

 

AD

Kit:

B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller.

--Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way!

If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you sure you're disabling the right stuff? I haven't tried it yet because I only recently read about it myself, but as well as the damper there is a stick deflection limiter. This isn't a toggle, you need to hold a button down (default Y) for as long as you want it disabled. That might let you do what you're trying to do.

VC

 

=X51= Squadron is recruiting!

X51 website: https://x51squadron.com/

Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/d9JtFY4

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you sure you're disabling the right stuff? I haven't tried it yet because I only recently read about it myself, but as well as the damper there is a stick deflection limiter. This isn't a toggle, you need to hold a button down (default Y) for as long as you want it disabled. That might let you do what you're trying to do.

 

 

Yep, tried all that. Damper disabled with L_Alt+9, stick deflection limiter overridden.

 

 

I almost got it to happen once :pilotfly::joystick:

 

 

 

AD

Kit:

B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller.

--Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way!

If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

None that I can cough up, but I saw the real deal at the Ottawa (Canada) Airshow back in 1989. Tail-slide as well as Cobra, same flight, MiG-29. I don't know what variant it was, but it was probably an A. Our A and S© versions in the sim are very similar.

 

 

It certainly can be done by the MiG-29, just not our simulated one :)

 

 

AD

 

It couldn't be the A, it lack the range. It had to be an S or newer. The only only A that I know where modified like the German G to carry wing tanks.

usaf-escort.jpg

Here it says they where S and you can see the wing tanks on the photo.

 

It looks like they where 315 and 304 blue. I am trying to figure out what version they are.

http://chamorrobible.org/gpw/gpw-200701.htm

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The back bone looks like an S, but some website mark as an A

40951_1043812182.jpg

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...