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MISTRAL suspected bug


Dino Might

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Can't find any special subforum for MISTRAL variant, so hopefully this can be moved to appropriate location:

 

 

 

 

Appears that Mistral missile accelerates for a long time and burns much longer than comparative video. Not sure if these are special variants of the missile, but recommend a check on the missile data vs flight performance in game. Video shows acceleration for extended time and then deceleration while still burning, so maybe part flight model and part graphics bug?

 

 

 

Please advise.

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the mistral missile is coded in the game to touch up to 7km (against 6.3 to 6.7 depending on the version and shooting platform IRL) thrust, memory occurs on a third of the max distance. which is the case in your video (approximately). you see that the slowed missile has about 6 seconds (thrust, then inertia, then slowdown). the smoke of the thrust is present all the way, but not the thrust. it is therefore a problem of display of the thrust and not of its effect. this was not the case during the mistral tests, and this seems to have happened following updates on support (dcs). I doubt that the correction of this slight problem is the responsibility of polychop.

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The missile stays at over 1000knts all the way and while thrust decreases the missile is definitely still burning. Whatever the target is doing, if it's in range (the advertised 7 kms) the missile will hit. This is a bug, a missile that still has 1000knts of energy at the "max" range means it's far from maximum range.

 

EDIT : And in the OG post's video you can clearly see the missile burns for a very short time, like all missiles, max range is a value achieved under very good conditions.


Edited by Rex854Warrior

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ED is right now focused in F18 and its armament. I don't think they worry much about an 3rd party missile.

 

While ED is a small team, not every single one of their programmers is working on the F/A-18 since we are getting updates for the game itself and not even trying to contact ED is surely not going to help. If Polychop has already done so then waiting is the only thing we can do.


Edited by Rex854Warrior

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I was able to shot down a plane at an altitude of 7km flying at the deck with the mistral helo, and the missile flew over Mach 2 all the way up if I recall this correctly. Many SAM systems would be envious of such performance. So the missile appears fairly unrealistic to me.


Edited by -Martin-
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I might be able to answer that part, but I think Borchi will do it better than me who does not work at polychop. i can just tell you that the max was done from polychop about it. ED has a lot of subject to deal with third party developers and their own modules (as well as the platform), so wait and see.

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it's not a bug, it's a development choice dictated by the limits of the game's environment.

 

I don't understand this, can you explain further?

 

By the look of it, shouldn't it behave similar to a stinger? Those have finite burn times and don't stay over 1000 kts the whole travel.

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So, why doesn't it match? I don't understand. Existing missiles incorporate fixed duration of thrust, and cutoff of booster animation. Why was Polychop prevented from incorporating these things appropriately? (i.e., what limits of the game environment are the cause of the aforementioned design decision?)

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  • 4 weeks later...

Well, I agree that something is wrong with the Mistral since it's more feard on the Blue Flag servers then the Eagle. I don't want to repeat the names players use for them since of the decency rules.


Edited by FoxAlfa

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All the people keep asking for capabilities to be modelled.... I want the limitations to be modelled.... limitations make for realistic simulation.

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Well, I agree that something is wrong with the Mistral since it's it more feard on the Blue Flag servers then the Eagle. I don't want to repeat the names players use for them since of the decency rules.

 

The main problem could be that it's very easy to get on target. Instant lock and fast flight which makes it very effective in helicopter only environments. It was removed from the last round of the Helicopter Tournament.

 

I've seen mistrals miss at least due to flares and also seemingly direct hits might result in very little damage quite often. But overall it's quite effective against the right target.

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And I don't see anyone talking about the uncanny ability of the IR seeker to detect targets even through solid objects.

 

I've used the Mistral on PvP servers (no shame tbh) and I can track enemy helos behind hills and just ambush them at the moment they enter the valley.

 

That being said, I have also being locked and shot down by a Mig 29 using a R27 semiactive radar while being stationary in front of a hill side at 5 ft over the ground. Super duper pulse radar! And yeah, I know it was a radar missile because the Gazelle has RWR. It was not an ET fired with the EOS.

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And I don't see anyone talking about the uncanny ability of the IR seeker to detect targets even through solid objects.

 

I've used the Mistral on PvP servers (no shame tbh) and I can track enemy helos behind hills and just ambush them at the moment they enter the valley.

 

That being said, I have also being locked and shot down by a Mig 29 using a R27 semiactive radar while being stationary in front of a hill side at 5 ft over the ground. Super duper pulse radar! And yeah, I know it was a radar missile because the Gazelle has RWR. It was not an ET fired with the EOS.

 

Spinning rotor blades tend to create quite a good doppler return IRL, dunno if that is an effect here?

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

:Sarcasm On: Can I replace my R-27r with Mistrals.... since they outperform it? :Sarcasm Off:

-------

All the people keep asking for capabilities to be modelled.... I want the limitations to be modelled.... limitations make for realistic simulation.

Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a bit you realize the pig likes it.

 

Long time ago in galaxy far far away:

https://www.deviantart.com/alfafox/gallery

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I hope this missile issue can be fixed soon. DCS is a game that prides itself on realism! Mistrals providing cap on Blue Flag firing super missiles designed in the year 2090 are spoiling the experience for many and does not do justice to a top quality simulator like DCS.

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Ok, so lets clearify here something.

First of all, the RL performance of these weaponsystems, like Mistral, Stingers, Aim9, any ARH or SARH are classified. Therefore, if you like to judge the ingame performance and like to compare the ingame missile with a video of a very early stage prototype missile that is fine o me and the team, but this will not help you or the community at all. I have stated before that we have no info about the videos that you guys use for judgements. Other then that, I can tell you, that Wikipedia is no relevant resource itself in terms of weapon performances.

If you think the Mistral is to powerful, ok, that is your opinion, but believe it or not, we have spoken to the people that use it for living and we have recieved rough numbers and still we have not made it 1 to 1 with the numbers for multiple reasons.

 

So the option for the player is, to like the mistral or hate the mistral. I probabaly come down to the fact on which side of the mistral you are standing, behind, or infront.

 

That said, seekerlogic and balistic performances will not change, cause they are also, very close to the real stinger, just saying :joystick::pilotfly::lol::music_whistling:

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We do, cause we have people that know how it works :smilewink:

 

did you know that the stinger has a 17 seconds self destruct timer ?

I am not going into further discussion about the mistral or the stinger, cause this makes no sense on the long term.

If people think that they know more then the people that have the classification rating or not, makes no difference on the informations we recieved. Therefore I think the only positiv value of this topic is the questions about the animations.

 

Seekerlogic, flare resitance programs, burntime of the engines of the missiles, ranges and lock ranges are not a topic for an every day forum anyways.

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Sorry but since when does a stinger or Igla happily fly up to 17500ft still going 1200knots it's literally unbelievable - fix your broken missile it's BS

 

As for burn times you can quite literally count the burn time in the video as well as in all these

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