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PG Performance Experiment


Headwarp

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I need two volunteers. One user with 16GB of DRAM and another user with 32 GB of DRAM.

 

Both not CPU limited (I.e. no single core of the CPU is hitting 99% while flying).

 

I'm using the Hornet at the moment, the instant action free flight over Persian Gulf.

 

Flying over the largest cities up the cost from Al Maktoum Intl through Dubai and Ajman at low altitude, how do your framerates behave as you navigate the cities and look around?

 

I'm not interested in actual framerate value, but curious about behavior.

I can fly around Caucasus @45fps in VR all day (Asynchronous reprojection), and it makes sense that my GPU isn't running at 99% with it on.

 

But flying low over the cities with the most and largest buildings in PG my frames randomly dip to 30 and my cpu/gpu still aren't maxed monitoring with a 100ms poll rate.

 

I'm wondering if this is related to ram or not, although after I save a little money up I'm going to buy a 32GB kit anyway (Just because DCS.. cuz DCS). For the time being if there's anybody willing to share with me if they're geting sudden frame drops when flying low..i.e down low get you normally get 50-60 fps but approaching large cities around Dubai you get random 15-20 fps drops.

 

With my settings I'm using anywhere between 13-14GB of ram and ending up with a 10-20GB swap file. So I'm wondering if someone with twice the amount of ram I have also experience framerate dips in those areas. Pixel Density changes pretty much showing the same behavior just with less gpu utilization using lower pixel density.


Edited by Headwarp
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Win 11 Pro, z790 i9 13900k, RTX 4090 , 64GB DDR 6400GB, OS and DCS are on separate pci-e 4.0 drives 

Sim hardware - VKB MCG Ultimate with 200mm extension, Virpil T-50CM3 Dual throttles.   Blackhog B-explorer (A), TM Cougar MFD's (two), MFG Crosswinds with dampener.   Obutto R3volution gaming pit.  

 

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Don't know how helpful i can be , but FYI i never drop below 53 under hard maneuvering T 300-500 ft over Dubai , range typically 55-60 , except when facing straits , when it jumps to 70 . 80-90 at 5- 10k over the city . This in Hornet .

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FWIW

 

The PG map is fairly GPU hungry in order of map efficiency.

 

NTTR by far the most efficient map very rare occasional stutter.

 

Caucasus not as efficient as NTTR occasional stutter.

 

PG hits 100% GPU usage at times just flying around. Stutters fairly regularly.

 

Normandy hits 100% GPU usage more often than PG in same circumstances. Stutters a lot.

 

Method set DCS settings to use average 70% GPU 3D usage which will vary up and sometimes down depending on situation, however the GPU average load is higher as per the above map order.

 

This is keeping settings the same in all tests, lowering the MSAA to 2 from 4 will improve the situation in the other maps but TBH they don't look so good when I do that.

 

System i7 5930 @ 4.7GHz

64GB DDR4 @ 2.4Ghz 8*8GB

1080Ti @ 1.97GHz

SSD for OS and DCS

Rift VR

 

Memory usage can hit 16 plus GB for me with DCS (overall system usage) but I can't say if there would be any difference going from 32GB to 64GB game wise but the X99 mother board can use dual channel with all slots loaded which speeds RAM operations up a bit.

Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment.

Gazelle Mini-gun version is endorphins with rotors. See above.

 

Currently rolling with a Asus Z390 Prime, 9600K, 32GB RAM, SSD, 2080Ti and Windows 10Pro, Rift CV1. bu0836x and Scratch Built Pedals, Collective and Cyclic.

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FWIW

 

The PG map is fairly GPU hungry in order of map efficiency.

 

NTTR by far the most efficient map very rare occasional stutter.

 

Caucasus not as efficient as NTTR occasional stutter.

 

PG hits 100% GPU usage at times just flying around. Stutters fairly regularly.

 

Normandy hits 100% GPU usage more often than PG in same circumstances. Stutters a lot.

 

Method set DCS settings to use average 70% GPU 3D usage which will vary up and sometimes down depending on situation, however the GPU average load is higher as per the above map order.

 

This is keeping settings the same in all tests, lowering the MSAA to 2 from 4 will improve the situation in the other maps but TBH they don't look so good when I do that.

 

System i7 5930 @ 4.7GHz

64GB DDR4 @ 2.4Ghz 8*8GB

1080Ti @ 1.97GHz

SSD for OS and DCS

Rift VR

 

Memory usage can hit 16 plus GB for me with DCS (overall system usage) but I can't say if there would be any difference going from 32GB to 64GB game wise but the X99 mother board can use dual channel with all slots loaded which speeds RAM operations up a bit.

 

I'm not getting stutters, just a somewhat random drop to 30fps while flying the areas surrounding Dubai with all the tall buildings. Pretty much anywhere else in the map I'm maintaining 45FPS (VR). Not using msaa but same behavior whether I'm at 1.5 pixel density or 2.0. Would suspect that if this were based on hardware that I'd see something different with lower pixel density but it's 30fps either way, not higher not lower, exactly 30fps and it's only while I'm flying towards certain areas of the cities. Otherwise 45fps. I'll have to play around with other settings to see if maybe it has something to do with tree distance or something else.

 

But, thank all of you for your insight, the information is helpful.


Edited by Headwarp
Spoiler

Win 11 Pro, z790 i9 13900k, RTX 4090 , 64GB DDR 6400GB, OS and DCS are on separate pci-e 4.0 drives 

Sim hardware - VKB MCG Ultimate with 200mm extension, Virpil T-50CM3 Dual throttles.   Blackhog B-explorer (A), TM Cougar MFD's (two), MFG Crosswinds with dampener.   Obutto R3volution gaming pit.  

 

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Yes sorry, corresponding drop in frame rate is what occurs.

Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment.

Gazelle Mini-gun version is endorphins with rotors. See above.

 

Currently rolling with a Asus Z390 Prime, 9600K, 32GB RAM, SSD, 2080Ti and Windows 10Pro, Rift CV1. bu0836x and Scratch Built Pedals, Collective and Cyclic.

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Was flying over/in dubai with the hornet for several minutes while running a quite light mission. Frame rates do occasionally drop down to 40-45, most easily happens when turning and flying towards a new set of skyscrapers. Looking around doesn't seem to affect my FPS that much.

 

Saw framerates between 36 and 96 while flying in dubai. Tends to cluster around 60-70fps. Have to agree with Helisimmer that the performance is good on this map.

 

Will double check for the Iran side / over the sea. Also didn't monitor cpu & gpu & memory load. DCS is installed on a regular SATA SSD, Samsung 860 EVO.

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It's GPU bottlenecked with spikes to around 96-97%. CPU seems to be around 50-60% - interestingly for all four cores! Bear in mind there could be shorter spikes than every 100 or even 10ms.

 

Physical RAM is not capped. And I don't run heavy browsers or such in addition to DCS while measuring, MSI Afterburner takes a few CPU cycles now and then.

 

Over the sea or a bit off the coastline, FPS is around 120

Over land, it seems to hover around 90-100 FPS

Approaching land was between the two above, I think

 

The figures are quite staggering with a mere GTX1070. ED have done a lot to optimize this game, much of which they neither take nor receive credit for.

SA-342 Ka-50 Mi-8 AJS-37 F-18 M2000C AV-8B-N/A Mig-15bis CA --- How to learn DCS

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I'm not getting stutters, just a somewhat random drop to 30fps while flying the areas surrounding Dubai with all the tall buildings. Pretty much anywhere else in the map I'm maintaining 45FPS (VR). Not using msaa but same behavior whether I'm at 1.5 pixel density or 2.0. Would suspect that if this were based on hardware that I'd see something different with lower pixel density but it's 30fps either way, not higher not lower, exactly 30fps and it's only while I'm flying towards certain areas of the cities. Otherwise 45fps. I'll have to play around with other settings to see if maybe it has something to do with tree distance or something else.

 

But, thank all of you for your insight, the information is helpful.

 

 

 

 

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Just glancing over your thread, I've been tinkering around over PG in the huey and the Dubai area seems to really be hungry for resources.

 

I was just using MSI Aftburner and lifting my headset to check, and at times I was running into CPU limitations, however my GPU was still bouncing between 97-99% and this doesn't seem to change if I'm using 1.5 pixel density or 2.0 pixel density, which you would think the added resolution would put the workload on the GPU and lessen the load on the CPU.

 

Today, I enabled WMR's new EMR (new motion reprojection) and the reprojection indicator which shows a different color square depending on the state of motion reprojection - green = able to play @ 90FPS, light blue = on due to cpu limitation, dark blue - on due to gpu limitation, red - off because can't maintain 45fps.

 

So after turning all of that on, I went and flew around caucasus with the dark blue square meaning on because gpu limited.

 

Then loaded up city tour instant action for the huey over Persian gulf which starts you in Dubai.. the entire time I was flying over the city I had both a light blue and a dark blue square, indicating I was maxing out my CPU and GPU.

 

SO I started flying towards the eastern coast away from the city and eventually had only the dark blue square, but when I turned my head and looked at the city both squares were popping up.

 

Ultimately it's like I'm at some kind of sweet spot specific to Dubai in the Persian Gulf map where my gpu is still being fully loaded by VR but running into CPU limitations which is what I suspect is causing the framedrops.

 

Fragbum's also getting fps drops, but has 64GB of ram, so now I'm wondering if you're seeing spikes to 99% on any of your cpu cores while flying over Dubai. It might be happening so briefly that you need to lower your hardware monitor's polling rate but I'm curious what's causing CPU usage over dubai to be so much higher than anywhere else on the map. If it's just the big buildings or if we're encountering some kind of shader issue that needs to be optimized. If fragbum isn't seeing any cpu limitations I could very well be choking on 16gb of ram.

 

In comparison - flying over caucasus it's always the dark blue square and no single core on the cpu ever reaches 100%.

 

But I mean.. I'm on an 8700k @ 4.9ghz, to run into cpu limitations with up to 2x supersampling in the odyssey just seems weird.


Edited by Headwarp
Spoiler

Win 11 Pro, z790 i9 13900k, RTX 4090 , 64GB DDR 6400GB, OS and DCS are on separate pci-e 4.0 drives 

Sim hardware - VKB MCG Ultimate with 200mm extension, Virpil T-50CM3 Dual throttles.   Blackhog B-explorer (A), TM Cougar MFD's (two), MFG Crosswinds with dampener.   Obutto R3volution gaming pit.  

 

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So apparently the power management option in nv control panel for my dcs profile was set to optimal power, which equates to me having a brainfart because I could've sworn it was on max performance.

 

So, not dropping below 45fps over PG map at least in single player with my current settings in VR even over Dubai..at least in my last two flights.

 

Still getting both icon's using wmr's new motion reprojection indicator that suggest being cpu and gpu limited. Flying over normandy was the same. Might have to go pancake mode to see what my cpu/gpu are really doing as there seems to be no real way to completely disable some form of reprojection, although as FPS go up it does turn off using the older method.

 

I'm not overly hopeful a 32GB kit of ram is going to be helpful for much, but still plan to make that move asap.

 

Anyway - No need to follow up on this unncessary "experiment" but I might post one more time in the following months when I have a spare $300 to throw at memory.

Spoiler

Win 11 Pro, z790 i9 13900k, RTX 4090 , 64GB DDR 6400GB, OS and DCS are on separate pci-e 4.0 drives 

Sim hardware - VKB MCG Ultimate with 200mm extension, Virpil T-50CM3 Dual throttles.   Blackhog B-explorer (A), TM Cougar MFD's (two), MFG Crosswinds with dampener.   Obutto R3volution gaming pit.  

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

PG runs awful for me. I get 45 fps in VR on Caucusus but sit around 25-30 on PG (even out over the water away from everything). NTTR runs fine for me too.

 

I think its just horribly optimized (along with the rest of DCS but more so).

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Dubai is uniquely a fps-killer . I don't break Vsnc low over anywhere on Caucasus or NTTR (including Vegas) - that with 12-15% CPU/GPU headroom . Low over Dubai will drop me into the low 50s or less with the same settings . The only reason I'm keeping PG is the hope of further optimizations .

9700k @ stock , Aorus Pro Z390 wifi , 32gb 3200 mhz CL16 , 1tb EVO 970 , MSI RX 6800XT Gaming X TRIO , Seasonic Prime 850w Gold , Coolermaster H500m , Noctua NH-D15S , CH Pro throttle and T50CM2/WarBrD base on Foxxmounts , CH pedals , Reverb G2v2

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For the record, PG is a brilliant map that has clearly seen a lot of care and love by the developers. It is resource hungry. People wondering why more European maps aren't being developed: imagine the Persian Gulf map... with more buildings, cities, and TREES TREES TREES.

 

I'm still in awe of both Caucasas and PG every time I fly through them. So much detail and interest.

 

But Vulkan, come to us! :-)

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So apparently the power management option in nv control panel for my dcs profile was set to optimal power, which equates to me having a brainfart because I could've sworn it was on max performance.

 

So, not dropping below 45fps over PG map at least in single player with my current settings in VR even over Dubai..at least in my last two flights.

 

Still getting both icon's using wmr's new motion reprojection indicator that suggest being cpu and gpu limited. Flying over normandy was the same. Might have to go pancake mode to see what my cpu/gpu are really doing as there seems to be no real way to completely disable some form of reprojection, although as FPS go up it does turn off using the older method.

 

I'm not overly hopeful a 32GB kit of ram is going to be helpful for much, but still plan to make that move asap.

 

Anyway - No need to follow up on this unncessary "experiment" but I might post one more time in the following months when I have a spare $300 to throw at memory.

 

I just went to 32G from 16. No effect on framerate but it loads faster for sure.

 

For me to get straight 45's in the O+ I have to use the kegetys mod, and go 100% on the steamvr video slider, and not the recommended 200%. 1.4 PD.

 

I also use low terrain textures. In the PG map, I literally cannot tell the difference at all.

 

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I think you guys will find it's GPU that's holding you back on VR. :)

Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment.

Gazelle Mini-gun version is endorphins with rotors. See above.

 

Currently rolling with a Asus Z390 Prime, 9600K, 32GB RAM, SSD, 2080Ti and Windows 10Pro, Rift CV1. bu0836x and Scratch Built Pedals, Collective and Cyclic.

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Since increasing my Ram to 32gb I find I now use 20+ Gb whereas with 16Gb in it only used 10-12 GB. Stuff loads faster and my preload radius is maxxed now. More ram helps but not for fps:)

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  • 2 months later...

I have no problems with Nevada or Caucasus, but I'm having problems with FPS in PG, even in Iranian coast near Qeshm island and Bandar Abbas, can someone please help me to improve my config so I can reduce stutters and win some FPS, please?

 

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Glad that I found this thread, with my current setup I only get 40/45 FPS inside the cockpit on PG map missions like the Hormuz Rocket Run. So the only thing that we can expect right now is for a good optimization for this map. :noexpression:

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