Realworld Air Defense thread?

[Rhinozherous]

Hello!

 

I often fly selfmade missions. I seldom use that much air defense on enemy side, mostly shilkas and other short range defense... Just because the hog is a slow mover.

 

What is/was the threat in reallife, like on missions of the gulf war, afghanistan, syria...

When is it too hot for the A10C?

 

Is there a source for mission reports open to the public?

 

Thank you!

[eaglecash867]

Here's a wikipedia article that will give you a pretty good idea of what threats were faced by coalition aircraft during Desert Storm. Most, if not all A-10s that were shot down or damaged were due to missiles other than the radar guided type, since the tactics at the time had them flying low, under radar coverage. That and other similar losses caused the US military to change its doctrine for dealing with air defenses. Where they had traditionally flown low, they now fly at higher altitudes where IR-guided SAMs are expected, which is pretty much everywhere the A-10 flies.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_combat_losses_of_United_States_military_aircraft_since_the_Vietnam_War

[delevero]

I dont think it was to hot for the a10c since it was not part of the first wave that soften up the defences by taking out known dangerous sam sites. For that job they used stealth bombers or cruise missiles.

In second wave it was CAP and sead planes and some bombing runs form up high that all soften up things.

And then in third wave it was the a10c and so on.

( take my info with a gram of salt )

 

What im saying is, the a10c can ofcourse operate low and fly in and shoot something.. But any army/airforce ect. work in such a way they have a tool for every job. meaning that they properbly would not send in the a10c alone without it having friends to protect it, and they use the best tool for the job.

The a10 have its strenght and other planes have theirs.

 

And also pilots know not to fight a battle they cannot win. Example

the a10 vs an advanced sam site that can track and shoot at low flying targets from far away is a treat you should stay away from.

The a10s longest range weapon is the maveric and it can maybe fly 6-8nm, but the enemy can fire 50nm well that is not a fun fight.

 

 

Also in reality a sam site is not "alone".. enemy air defence sites is like the layers of an onion... the long distance sam shoot first, then the medium range, and then finaly the AA guns and low range missiles.

So before the a10c can get to the big sam site it have to go though all the other defences first.. well that is really bad odds for the a10c even if it fly low ;-)

So the a10c first fly in once the large sam site is down, and maybe also the medium if they can find them.

But in the end there are no gurantee, in war enemy sometimes just popup without warning.. but then low flying might help you to get away... distance is safety.

 

 

 

Example if the a10c goes in on a mission to kill tank colum, then there would be CAP planes in the air to protect the airspace form enemy planes that the a10c really cant fight against.

And there would also be SEAD flight ready to kill new sam sites that turn on their radar or get spotted.

[Rhinozherous]

I dont think it was to hot for the a10c since it was not part of the first wave that soften up the defences by taking out known dangerous sam sites. For that job they used stealth bombers or cruise missiles.

In second wave it was CAP and sead planes and some bombing runs form up high that all soften up things.

And then in third wave it was the a10c and so on.

( take my info with a gram of salt )

 

What im saying is, the a10c can ofcourse operate low and fly in and shoot something.. But any army/airforce ect. work in such a way they have a tool for every job. meaning that they properbly would not send in the a10c alone without it having friends to protect it, and they use the best tool for the job.

The a10 have its strenght and other planes have theirs.

 

And also pilots know not to fight a battle they cannot win. Example

the a10 vs an advanced sam site that can track and shoot at low flying targets from far away is a treat you should stay away from.

The a10s longest range weapon is the maveric and it can maybe fly 6-8nm, but the enemy can fire 50nm well that is not a fun fight.

 

 

Also in reality a sam site is not "alone".. enemy air defence sites is like the layers of an onion... the long distance sam shoot first, then the medium range, and then finaly the AA guns and low range missiles.

So before the a10c can get to the big sam site it have to go though all the other defences first.. well that is really bad odds for the a10c even if it fly low ;-)

So the a10c first fly in once the large sam site is down, and maybe also the medium if they can find them.

But in the end there are no gurantee, in war enemy sometimes just popup without warning.. but then low flying might help you to get away... distance is safety.

 

 

 

Example if the a10c goes in on a mission to kill tank colum, then there would be CAP planes in the air to protect the airspace form enemy planes that the a10c really cant fight against.

And there would also be SEAD flight ready to kill new sam sites that turn on their radar or get spotted.

 

This is exactly what I imagine when I setup my missions. Wanted to know if anyone else is thinking the same of which mission has the A10. (in a more realworld setup of missions, because I think sometimes the more action type of mission is just fun to fly... On simulator)

[David OC]

The A-10 was designed in the 70's to fly low (Hide) and not to take on the long range threats and to concentrate on taking out tanks. Build with a titanium bathtub to get hit by AAA and manpads up close.

 

When planning a mission "Package" you would have TARCAP, SEAD, etc.

 

The 1st campaign is setup a little like this, in reality they wouldn't be able to see everything or detect everything or even disable every defensive layer.

Plus jammed GPS ;).

 

I like to fly the A-10 like it would have been used, nice and low hiding behind hills, pop out and take a quick look or to see if something will shoot. You also would still be working with a JTAC on the ground to hopefully spot these.

 

 

http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-9K35-Strela-10.html

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by David OC

[Sandman1330]

I like to fly the A-10 like it would have been used, nice and low hiding behind hills, pop out and take a quick look or to see if something will shoot. You also would still be working with a JTAC on the ground to hopefully spot these.

 

Me too. Although the contemporary use of the aircraft has been high altitude with PGMs, the true threat to the aircraft in Afghanistan and Iraq was low. In a near-peer environment, it’s unlikely blue side would be able to eliminate all airborne threats and radar SAMs, so going low might become the most survivable tactic again. Also recognize that these aircraft would still take significant losses from MANPADs and AAA, but in that kind of war this would be more acceptable...

 

Besides, it’s more fun and challenging to set up an SA6 or SA15 behind the enemy lines that forces you to stay low! Pop up and shoot your mavericks, or for more challenge try a low level ingress and pop up or CCRP delivery of CBUs with a HOF of 300. Super challenging!