MiG-19P Navigation: The ARK-5 ADF

[Maico249th]

So I'm not really sure how the presets work in the sim.

I want to know Only in the sim how to set the presets.

I dont own a real Farmer. Here is my understanding,

Set LH panel Range selector, Tune in a freq.

Change the Homing selector, Tune in a new freq.

Now you can alternate between them using the Homing Sw.

 

The ME let's you put in 2 Frequencies.

One will be a Preset on the ARK-5P right panel.

 

What's is the other one?

[Zeus67]

So I'm not really sure how the presets work in the sim.

I want to know Only in the sim how to set the presets.

I dont own a real Farmer. Here is my understanding,

Set LH panel Range selector, Tune in a freq.

Change the Homing selector, Tune in a new freq.

Now you can alternate between them using the Homing Sw.

 

The ME let's you put in 2 Frequencies.

One will be a Preset on the ARK-5P right panel.

 

What's is the other one?

 

The ARK-5 does not have presets. The frequencies values in the ME are used to pre-tune the ARK-5 to those values. If you move the tuning handle, those frequencies are lost.

 

I set that option as a help for quickly using the ARK-5, specially when a mission starts in the air and you have to land on an airport. So instead of looking for the airport's beacons frequencies, the ARK-5 is already tuned to them. But, if you tune to another frequency, those ME frequencies are lost.

[Maico249th]

Thank You Zeus. And congratulations to the team on this excellent addition to DCS.

You dispelled a lot of misconceptions I had. Cool.

So now that we are clear on that, one last question.

In ME I set two frequencies one to NEAR one to FAR.

Does moving the switch in the pit from far to near toggle between them?

If I had only one request, it would be the ability to rotate that tuning crank using a key bind.

 

Thanks for your continued support.

[Zeus67]

Yes, clicking the switch from FAR to NEAR and vice versa toggles between those two frequencies.

[Airsoftronald]

Hi all!

My ARK-5 works kinda strange. When I start on Sukhumi-Babushara, it doesn't see Sukhumi's inner and outer and sees only Kobuleti (489 outer in Sukhumi and 490 inner in Kobuleti).

And if I start mission on Kobuleti, it doesn't see its inner and outer

:unsure:

[unlikely_spider]

Hi all!

My ARK-5 works kinda strange. When I start on Sukhumi-Babushara, it doesn't see Sukhumi's inner and outer and sees only Kobuleti (489 outer in Sukhumi and 490 inner in Kobuleti).

And if I start mission on Kobuleti, it doesn't see its inner and outer

:unsure:

I've found I have to take off sometimes before it will see them. Which is a huge pain considering how the dial works currently.

[Airsoftronald]

I've found I have to take off sometimes before it will see them. Which is a huge pain considering how the dial works currently.

 

Doesn't help anyway. IDK what's wrong with that module, cause in MiG-15 ARK works perfectly. And like a lot of people says, why handles don't switch in different operating modes. The Farmer is awesome, but odd-working, better to say no-working ARK makes it quite non-playable :joystick:

[Airsoftronald]

The frequencies on the FAR and NEAR must be different, but from one aero, so when you set FAR, NEAR must automatically adjust how it must be. There is an option that FAR updates NEAR, but it doesn't work nice. For example on Krasnodar Center outer is 625, inner is 303. Bot when I set FAR to 625 (and I hear the correct morse code), NEAR is about 307-308 and of course I hear morse code from another beacon

[Wikkus]

Is it broken? Or is my understanding flawed?

 

Farmer noob here! Took advantage of the recent sales just so I could complete my collection.

 

But the ARK-5 is driving me nuts...

 

So, first thing I notice is that there's a discrepancy between the two English cockpits -- the "clean" one has the "near" position on the left and the "far" on the right, however, the weathered version is reversed:huh:

 

 

Putting this aside (and using the "clean" English cockpit), the Navigation tutorial mission doesn't work; I simply cannot get any sort of signal on the set:

Click to "radio compass" (static audible)

Select "near"

Select "TLF" setting

Use r/h dial selector on ARK-5 to select 640-1300 setting

Select "ANT"

Wiggle the tuning wheel back and forth either side of 1000kHz point (for Gelendzhik)

 

I get zero deflection on the signal strength meter and no morse.

 

Is it broken, or am I missing something?

 

Cheers,

Rik.

[some1]

There are several bug reports on ADF, never fixed. It's Razbam after all.

 

I think the kneeboard will show you the exact tuned frequency, which is handy as we never got the indicator needle in the cockpit that should be there. Also ADF has some extra custom logic described in the manual, switching between near and far beacon has some 'gotchas'.

[slicker55]

So, a few months on since the last reply makes this an ideal place to ask my ADF related question...

 

I'm familiarising myself with this plane and believe I have a reasonable understanding of how the ADF / NDB system works.

 

Last night I checked the beacon freq's and morse identifier for each airport in the .lua to compile an easy-reference chart for myself.

 

I then ran some tests using the mission editor.

 

I went through all the airports one at a time, placing a MIG19 on the runway with the relevant freq's of the inner and outer beacons assigned as presets.

 

These tests produced some interesting results.

 

All airports where there is only one inner and outer beacon worked perfectly.

 

Airports which have two inner and two outer beacons (one set for each runway approach) only seem to work on one of the sets?

 

That is with the exception of Maykop, Minvody and Mozdok where both sets work!

 

Obviously, where there are two sets of inner and outer beacons, the corresponding freq's are the same but the morse defines which one the ADF receiver is tuned into.

 

Maybe someone with more experience can help to solve this one for me?

[Ramsay]

Airports which have two inner and two outer beacons (one set for each runway approach) only seem to work on one of the sets?

 

That is with the exception of Maykop, Minvody and Mozdok where both sets work!

 

Obviously, where there are two sets of inner and outer beacons, the corresponding freq's are the same but the morse defines which one the ADF receiver is tuned into.

 

Maybe someone with more experience can help to solve this one for me?

 

Only the inner and outer markers for the "active" runway are ON, if markers sharing a frequency conflicted, ADF would track the strongest/nearest signal.

 

Due to a 2.5.x bug that effects runways with moderate headwinds (1-7 knot/1-3.5 m/s) the correct markers for ATC's selected runway are not always active, however for 0 or +8 knot headwinds, they are.

 

Perhaps for Maykop, Minvody and Mozdok markers you've found a bug or you tested in differing wind conditions?

Edited December 20, 2019 by Ramsay
Checked in ME, Maykop, Minvody and Mozdok RWY directions share the same marker frequencies.

[slicker55]

@Ramsay

Interesting - thank you - more testing required :)

[golani79]

There are several bug reports on ADF, never fixed. It's Razbam after all.

 

I think the kneeboard will show you the exact tuned frequency, which is handy as we never got the indicator needle in the cockpit that should be there. Also ADF has some extra custom logic described in the manual, switching between near and far beacon has some 'gotchas'.

 

 

I know this works in the Mig-15 but in the 19 I wasn´t able to find the frequency in the kneeboard.

Do we need a mod for this or should it be there by default? (maybe I was just blind - need to look again)

[Cobrahjh]

RAZbugs

 

Spent the last thirty minutes trying to get the FAR to work in the tutorial mission and after reading your post I changed it to NEAR and now I can change to 640-1300. This is sad a known bug just sits around wasting everyone's time.

 

Thanks for the post.

[Ramsay]

Yeah, I find the ARK-5 in the MiG-19P really difficult/frustrating to use - so much so, I gave up using the module after a few flights.

 

Perhaps a kneeboard readout of the tuned frequency (like the F-86F/MiG-15) would help, but IIRC the tuning handle also suffers from the usual mouse scroll/click and drag difficulties that seems particular to Razbam.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Ramsay
Typo

[Rolds]

This implementation is very rough. If inputs to the fine tuning knob smoothly translated to changes in the selected frequency (for me they don't both with click and drag and especially with mouse wheel) that would help a lot.

[wowbagger]

If this could be fixed it would be highly appreciated. I understand that the earlier modules take precedence, however this seems like it would not take much to fix, so we could use this module frustration free while the more involved work on the Mirage and Harrier continues.

 

As it stands none of the Razbam modules are enjoyable at the moment. The Mirage campaign and training is hampered by the changes of last year (welcome changes, I totally agree), the Harrier has no campaign (because it needs to be finished before the campaign can be made). I bought the Mig-19 specifically because it includes Baltic Dragon content (best thing about DCS) and because it was essentially finished. I actually had little interest in the 19 before, but I wanted to support BD and any company smart enough to employ him. At the moment however, it seems none of my Razbam modules can be enjoyed as they were meant to be - and this 'moment' is actually months and months long. Quite frustrating (and definitely affecting my future purchasing decisions).

[Thor_H]

Akk how welcome a couple cold war era 50's 60's 70's maps would be. I long for the day..........

[Rudel_chw]

... I bought the Mig-19 specifically because it includes Baltic Dragon content (best thing about DCS)

 

You probably meant, best thing about Razbam :)

 

At the moment however, it seems none of my Razbam modules can be enjoyed as they were meant to be - and this 'moment' is actually months and months long. Quite frustrating (and definitely affecting my future purchasing decisions).

 

I feel the same, tough fortunately I was able to enjoy the Mirage and its Campaigns before its mid-life update. I haven't yet touched the Harrier, tough I look forward to the moment it gets its Campaign.

 

Regarding the MiG-19, I actually feel sad for it .. when it had just arrived I was enthusiastic about it and looked forward to editing Missions for it and pit it against the F-5, but the annoying bugs about the gunsight and radio keybinds were troubling enough to force me to put her on the Hangar and wait for a fix ... never imagined that almost a year would went by and there is still no fix in sight :(

 

I was a sure purchaser for the MiG-23, but this lengthy situation has discouraged me, and I'm not so sure anymore about purchasing it blind .. I will wait until I've read other's experiences with it first.

 

Best regards,

 

 

Eduardo

[enigma6584]

Is this navigation system (ARK-5) working properly on the Mig-19P? It seems I cannot move some dials associated with the system.

[Zibell]

Known bug. I wish Razbam would fix it. But they're busy with something else I guess.

[Wizard_03]

I don’t understand people on this one. Ok yes they need to look at the dial rotation again, it Doesn’t work as it should yada yada however.

 

1st off your talking about an NDB navigational aid in a sim with 4 maps....most aircraft use NDBs as a back up and it’s got such little legs that you simply can’t get far enough away from your airbase for navigating beyond visual dead reckoning to matter...

 

2nd of all you can pre-set the NBD near and far beacons in the ME so it’s not completely useless. It’s changing them that’s broken.

 

 

So yes it’s a problem but HARDLY game breaking lol i didn’t buy the MiG-19P for the wonderful Soviet ARK-5 system...I bought it for the two thirty millimeter guns and its massive engines...but that’s me, they work fine.

 

P.S. Gunsight works perfect for me.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Wizard_03

[Rudel_chw]

I don’t understand people on this one. Ok yes they need to look at the dial rotation again, it Doesn’t work as it should yada yada

 

I understand that an aircraft can have bugs ... what I don't understand is a developer that can ignore the bugs for over 9 months ... specially easy bugs, how hard can it be to fix a knob and a dial?

 

1st off your talking about an NDB navigational aid in a sim with 4 maps....most aircraft use NDBs as a back up

 

On the MiG-19 it is the only navaid it has, so seeing what other aircrafts have is little consolation.

 

and it’s got such little legs that you simply can’t get far enough away from your airbase for navigating beyond visual dead reckoning to matter...

 

I bet you fly VFR missions only, no clouds or rain, and never go farther than 50 nm from your base ... sorry, but that makes for a fairly boring mission.

 

P.S. Gunsight works perfect for me.

 

Seems you don’t do bombing then either, just air-air gun fights.

[AeriaGloria]

What’s wrong with AG sights?