Easy refueling

[JUICE-AWG]

I have friends whom have felt the same way about hard refueling...and once they go up with an instructor to coach them, all is well...and they get it! I remember this from a post in Hoggit quite a few years back, "don't death-grip the flight control, but instead, fingertip pressure on the stick and no rudders!"

[=Panther=]

I have friends whom have felt the same way about hard refueling...and once they go up with an instructor to coach them, all is well...and they get it! I remember this from a post in Hoggit quite a few years back, "don't death-grip the flight control, but instead, fingertip pressure on the stick and no rudders!"

 

Wiggling your toes help get the death grip off the stick too.

[Deano87]

Wiggling your toes help get the death grip off the stick too.

 

Can confirm this works. :D

[MVS-Viper]

It's already easier than drogue. If anything, ED needs to rework AAR refueling as a whole, some items off the top of my head:

 

*Tanker stating speed at which it flies

*Tanker calling turns before executing them

*Possibility to control tanker flight path from f10 map (so you can keep it safe and move it closer to the Frontline as needed)

*Boom effect on refueled aircraft (ie moving it around

*Option for infinite tanker fuel (so it doesn't rtb after a few refuels)

*Create new "hybrid" class of tanker so that KC-135mprs can refuel planes with both drogue and boom

 

Regards

 

 

 

Yes!

[fudabidu]

DCS is a big work in progress. Some issues introduced with 2.5 still haven't been fixed but several new modules have already been announced (Hind, Ka-50 upgrade, carrier, dynamic campaign, ATC rework ...).

Do you really think ED is gonna work on a completely unrealistic convenience feature that practically nobody asks for when there is so much work to do that everybody would benefit from? I don't. "Easy refueling" isn't coming.

 

Gather some friends, form on a tanker and take turns for an hour. Repeat as necessary.

 

Don't forget to come back and tell everybody how amazing your first successful refuel felt. It might encourage people to practice more.

[MVS-Viper]

DCS is a big work in progress. Some issues introduced with 2.5 still haven't been fixed but several new modules have already been announced (Hind, Ka-50 upgrade, carrier, dynamic campaign, ATC rework ...).

Do you really think ED is gonna work on a completely unrealistic convenience feature that practically nobody asks for when there is so much work to do that everybody would benefit from? I don't. "Easy refueling" isn't coming.

 

Gather some friends, form on a tanker and take turns for an hour. Repeat as necessary.

 

Don't forget to come back and tell everybody how amazing your first successful refuel felt. It might encourage people to practice more.

 

 

No worries, this is the "wish list" thread. I think he was just posting about something he wished to see, and the rest of us chimed in. We realize that a lot of the items in this thread may never see the light of day :thumbup:

[drrowley]

since there are other 'cheats' in this 'simulation game'; why is adding another cheat to help 'some' people is such a big deal. it might help less talented people enjoy the game more.

[Xavven]

since there are other 'cheats' in this 'simulation game'; why is adding another cheat to help 'some' people is such a big deal. it might help less talented people enjoy the game more.

 

 

I agree with this. While I personally do find AAR really fun because it is challenging, it doesn't mean that it's fun for everybody. Also, IRL pilots have commented that having depth perception and being able to feel the acceleration of the aircraft helps a lot, and we don't get that in DCS (well VR users get the depth perception I guess).

 

 

Just like how some people like starting EVERY SINGLE MISSION from a ramp start. Is starting in the air cheating? Or is it just a time saver for people who have busy lives?

[jasonbirder]

I thought there already WAS an "Easy" AAR mode...

Wake Turbulance off!

[smire666]

Because you' re below the tanker' s middle, there aren' t any wake turbulences... So it has no sense to turn it off...

[fudabidu]

since there are other 'cheats' in this 'simulation game'; why is adding another cheat to help 'some' people is such a big deal. it might help less talented people enjoy the game more.

 

Invulnerability, infinite fuel/ammo and missile warning can be used for practicing purposes.

Making a mistake and getting hit in a practice dogfight doesn't force you to restart if you're invulnerable. If you want to practice for an extended period infinite fuel helps. Infinite ammo gives you an opportunity to get a feeling for different missiles and practice gunnery. Missile warning can help developing situational awareness.

 

How does a refueling autopilot help you with learning how to refuel? It doesn't! That's my problem.

 

And AAR has absolutely nothing to do with talent.

17 years ago I started playing the guitar without any musical knowledge or talent but I learned through practice and it was fun learning. I didn't bolt a cheat device to my guitar that would play music on its own.

[Xavven]

Firstly, those are all valid points.

 

 

Some people have different goals in playing DCS that makes those points not applicable in their case, though.

 

 

 

Just like there's a "start up my jet for me" key combination. Some people do not care to learn the start up sequence. It's not possible to squish everyone into a single mold and force them to play DCS a certain way, and we shouldn't try.

[jasonbirder]

Because you' re below the tanker' s middle, there aren' t any wake turbulences... So it has no sense to turn it off...

 

 

I've heard this said before...and makes no sense to me...

 

 

I'm not a noob with AAR day or night (i've got literally hundreds under my belt and can almost without fail join up off the port wing, top off with a single connect and then shift to the starboard wing whilst waiting for wingmen...

BUT I find it a much, much more challenging and dynamic process with Wake turbulence on...particularly trimming for stable, level flight (which makes it a more relaxing experience) which requires constant trim changes as you move from pre-contact to contact

 

That and the cross-under to pre-contact being a much "larger" maneuver to avoid wake turbulence all combine to ramp up the difficulty level...

[Notso]

I'd bet if we get a contact that is more like the real thing, we would not need an easy refueling option. Now it is more than a "magic fuel box" (thx @ harlikwin) where we have to stay in to get fuel. That's not how it works with a boom IRL. The boom operator is a lot more of help IRL with contact and then he can move small planes like the Viper around so you don't have to be as exact as in DCS throttle and steering wise.

 

 

source: Sierra99, former boom operator

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3966927&postcount=7

 

Typically only the KC-10 can move around fighters. The -135 not so much. But agree, I find the AI boomer to be very tentative to plug even when I'm stabilized in the sweet spot.

[Notso]

I'm good with flying in formation its when I get near the drogue or under the tanker that I start to porpose up and down badly... I think I'm mostly fighting the spring in my stick....

 

The key to both the basket and the boom is: DON'T LOOK AT IT!!!! Fly formation on the tanker and the rest will take care of itself. I absolutely couldn't get plugged on the basket in the Hornet until I watched Grim Reaper's video where he says "Don't look at the basket, don't look at the basket......" THis same advice is 100% applicable to the boom as well. Line up on it at Pre-contact position and then drive forward by looking at the visual references on the KC-135. I find as soon as I even glance at the boom as I begin to get close to it, I PIO like a MF'er.

[Gnadentod]

... why is adding another cheat to help 'some' people is such a big deal. ...

It's very, very simple: it's a simulator, not a game. It's main purpose is not entertaining people but SIMULATING something which is there in real life and a lot of people couldn't enjoy due to circumstances/can't enjoy anymore because retired or similar. When it does entertain you like a normal "game" it doesn't automatically make it a game, it's still a simulator. That you have to explain this to some is sad in itself.

 

Even if it would be a "game", then implementing softcheats are still the most bulletproof way to destroy a product which has made its name by being NOT like the others, by not being like a "game".

Edited March 9, 2020 by Der Hirte

[=Panther=]

A simulator is a genre of a game. DCS is still a game...

[Tom Kazansky]

I'm not taking any side but Wags said in an interview 9/24/2019:

 

 

The subject of our biggest focus is to evolve DCS World to not just be the best simulator, but also the best game.[/Quote]

 

 

https://www.gamingnexus.com/Article/5797/A-interview-with-DCSs-Matt-Wagner-/

[LifeReapr]

*Tanker stating speed at which it flies

*Tanker calling turns before executing them

 

 

Haven't attempted refueling yet but if these 2 things aren't in please add a big +1 to the vote on implementing.

[Gnadentod]

I'm not taking any side but Wags said in an interview 9/24/2019:

 

https://www.gamingnexus.com/Article/5797/A-interview-with-DCSs-Matt-Wagner-/

It's not like that is a good selling point to increase potential customer base and thus increase income right? Good lord, why do I even try, sometimes I don't know ... It's a simulator. Aston Martin will not be Volkswagen just because you name it Volkswagen and also the other way around. Right or wrong? Very simple answer.

[Deuce]

It's already easier than drogue. If anything, ED needs to rework AAR refueling as a whole, some items off the top of my head:

 

*Tanker stating speed at which it flies

*Tanker calling turns before executing them

*Possibility to control tanker flight path from f10 map (so you can keep it safe and move it closer to the Frontline as needed)

*Boom effect on refueled aircraft (ie moving it around

*Option for infinite tanker fuel (so it doesn't rtb after a few refuels)

*Create new "hybrid" class of tanker so that KC-135mprs can refuel planes with both drogue and boom

 

Regards

 

Sent from my Xiaomi MI8

 

+1

Bump

[Tom Kazansky]

It's not like that is a good selling point to increase potential customer base and thus increase income right? Good lord, why do I even try, sometimes I don't know ... It's a simulator. Aston Martin will not be Volkswagen just because you name it Volkswagen and also the other way around. Right or wrong? Very simple answer.

 

 

If the boss of Aston Martin stated they want to be like and better than VW they have to do at least something to get towards an ahead VW. Whether Aston Martin buyers like it or not is another question.

 

 

If Wags encourages us to anticipate more game play in DCS then it is not the fault of people to do so.

 

 

And still I'm not stating that easy refuling should be done or not but I won't be surprised if a "better DCS game" gets it some day.

Edited March 8, 2020 by Tom Kazansky

[ac5]

Hi, developers make please an option for easy in air refueling like in the old Falcon4.

 

bye

 

Hi developers, please don't!

DCS is a proper simulator, there are enough arcade

games out there, stick to those....

[MrDieing]

I believe the hipster way of saying that you disagree with people asking for cheats because they cant do it is 'git gud'

[Notso]

Hi developers, please don't!

DCS is a proper simulator, there are enough arcade

games out there, stick to those....

 

Exactly.

 

Also, I still don't understand what the need for the tanker's airspeed is? Is it to be able to do a better rejoin? If so, you have speed and closure rate info available on the Radar and HUD. If its to stay in position on the boom - then you're doing it wrong. If you're looking at your speed trying to match the tankers while trying to connect or stay connected, you're definitely doing it wrong.