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Dassault Rafale Full Module


Colonel_paz

Dassault Rafale Full Module  

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  1. 1. Dassault Rafale Full Module

    • YES
      280
    • NO
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As a fan of delta wing fighters I have to say the having the Mirage 2000 in the game is great, even though I don't own that module yet, and definitely aiming for it to be my next purchase.

 

Also, considering how many newer plane modules are being developed, I think the lack of a Dassault Rafale in this game is quite noticeable and would be amazing to have the Rafale as a full stand-alone module in DCS.

 

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I would love a Rafale but I fear it's too new/classified to be simulated accurately.

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Mission impossible.

It would be guestimated plane like some Raptor mods. At most FC3 standard and many systems would have to be completely ommited.

 

Dassault company wouldn't sign any license nor declassifiy EM charts, avionics, radar and other sensors capabilities, modes etc.

 

Colonel_paz said:
(...)considering how many newer plane modules are being developed (...)

Not really, F/A-18C is already retired by US Navy and replaced by mix of Rhinos and F-35s, that's why we are able to have legacy Hornet faithfully modeled in the DCS. (And if you read between the lines there was still a lot of stepping on the rope to model some of the Hornet's systems by ED team...)

Hornet, Viper, Warthog, Harrier we have are variants used in 2004-2007 but the airframes are designed in 1970s.

It is far better to model some classic declasified planes with real performance and realistic capabilities all being possible to verify.

BTW: What wars did Eurofighters, Rafales, Rhinos, Raptors, Su-35 etc. participated? AT MOST some very low intensity completely asymetric bombing of some helpless insurgencies on the desert...

Even if we would be able to recreate some of them it would be extremally theoretical simulation, we have no idea how this planes would do in real symetric warfare, only guess-work.

What is more this most modern fighters have many systems which are completely classified at this point - we don't even know they exist, especially electronic warfare, radar frequency logic and parameters, detection, encryption - and this systems are crucial for their efficiency in combat.


Edited by bies
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Like you, i share that love for those 4.5+ fighters. Eurofighter, Superhornet and the Rafale would be great for DCS. But here the reality check : those plane contain highly sensitive tech (radar, spectra, ew, etc) that ED wont be given data access to. Let's not even talk about Airbus/Boeing/Dassault granting them licences for those.

 

 

 

Would they be awesome ? Hell yeah. Will we have them ingame ? Hell no.

 

 

 

On another hand, i assess as highly likely that ED do some flight sim for some air forces around the world, but those contract most likely are shroud into secrecy if not under "national security" stamp.

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No

 

Because most of the aircrafts in DCS are GEN IV and also some GEN III..

 

Having a GEN IV+ or GEN V aircrafts would be unbalanced compared to the others!

In addition, aircafts of this génération are classified trade secret and military secret !!

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I see your point guys. It's a shame nonetheless that this beautiful plane wouldn't be a good fit within the DCS world. Hopefully in the near future, DCS will open it's doors to higher GEN airplanes once public knowledge on the technologies used by them has increased.

 

Granted, I would guess (probably wrongly) that france will allow some export versions of the Rafale without most of the classified/highly advanced avionics and systems, especially to those countries with more unstable political backgrounds. Hopefully this will make it easier to replicate the rafale in the near future into DCS.


Edited by Colonel_paz
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As much as I'd like one, it's too modern and is a little beyond the scope of the current DCS environment (meh somewhat anyway). Plus it's a long established fact that modules take significant fractions of a decade to release and god knows how many more years to be feature complete (aside from the Sabre and MiG-15Bis are there any truly complete fixed wing aircraft that don't need an overhaul?)

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Tranche 1 Typhoon would be the most likely of the modern aircraft given they're hitting retirement, and given we can't even get a Sea Harrier II ( or apparently even a Tornado ) thanks to unavailable data, that seems rather unlikely. The AdA are apparently sponsoring a Mirage 2000-5, let's see how that goes.

 

Gen 3 aircraft or early gen 4 with say, early 90s fit hit something of a sweet spot for our purpose, I feel.

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No

 

Because most of the aircrafts in DCS are GEN IV and also some GEN III..

 

Having a GEN IV+ or GEN V aircrafts would be unbalanced compared to the others!

In addition, aircafts of this génération are classified trade secret and military secret !!

 

GEN IV+ is still GEN IV

 

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Probably not going to happen... But there is a mod in development... LINK :pilotfly:

 

Nice one Gruman, I'll keep an eye on this. I haven't used mods yet but I can imagine there is a lot of limitations about them, particularly for multiplayer. Nonetheless, it is a first step to a dream!

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No

 

Because most of the aircrafts in DCS are GEN IV and also some GEN III..

 

Having a GEN IV+ or GEN V aircrafts would be unbalanced compared to the others!

In addition, aircafts of this génération are classified trade secret and military secret !!

 

BALANCE should never be a consideration for a new module. In the real world new planes are built and they obsolete older ones and the cycle continues.

 

For DCS, BALANCE issues should be addressed at the multiplayer SERVER level, not whether a module should or should not be created.

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Tranche 1 Typhoon would be the most likely of the modern aircraft given they're hitting retirement, and given we can't even get a Sea Harrier II ( or apparently even a Tornado ) thanks to unavailable data, that seems rather unlikely. The AdA are apparently sponsoring a Mirage 2000-5, let's see how that goes.

 

Gen 3 aircraft or early gen 4 with say, early 90s fit hit something of a sweet spot for our purpose, I feel.

I was really looking forward to the Tranche 1 Typhoon from ED under VEAO (iirc). I was very disappointing when they canceled the development.

I was really hoping to relive the days of EF2000

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I was really looking forward to the Tranche 1 Typhoon from ED under VEAO (iirc). I was very disappointing when they canceled the development.

I was really hoping to relive the days of EF2000

 

Considering how the Hawk turned out and the fiasco that was the P40, its probably better in the end that EF didn't come into fruition.

 

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Considering how the Hawk turned out and the fiasco that was the P40, its probably better in the end that EF didn't come into fruition.
Yes correct. Would have been bigger bag of dissappiontment.

I wish another developer would pick that aircraft up.

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Among the generation of so called 4.5 gen or 4++ gen fighters, Rafale is probably the prettiest, and one I may be interested in most. Yet, I would much rather prefer other things at this point.

 

Two main reasons, the first is the predictable old one: Rafale is too modern and active for it to have much of a chance to be allowed into a simulation with realistic systems, weapons, and performance figures available. French, especially the Dassault were notorious for not being too welcome to such consumer sim products, but recent collaboration between Razbam and AdA may hint at this improving. Still, Rafale is probably a bridge too far at this point.

 

The second, and for me the more weighty reason: I would much prefer some focus going back to 60s-90s aircraft. For a variety of reasons, I think they fit the best for a DCS module, and I also personally am more interested in aircraft from this period. Recently most of the major module releases were of the modern variety: Hornet, JF-17, Viper, which caused de facto cancellation of an 80s upgraded F-4E which I was very, very anticipating. Razbam is working on an F-15E, which will probably be a 90s one, but still mostly continues this trend.

 

The niche that I am really looking forward to include things like said F-4E, A-6, A-7, MiG-23, MiG-27, Su-17, Mirage III, V, and F-1, Q-5, J 35 Draken etc. Or even modernized MiG-21s and/or F-5s. At this point only MiG-23 seems to be in active development among those. F-4E seems at best a very distant dream, A-6 and A-7 are past hints by Razbam or an AI that have been put in back burner which may or may not become a module at some point. Draken is likewise. Same goes for Mirage III by Razbam. Mirage F-1 will eventually be the work item for Aviodev again, but that is some ways off obviously.

 

I'd really love seeing some of these getting into the sim, or being put into active workbench of devs again.

 

Edit: boy will this be an unpopular opinion :P...

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Rollus's mod (FSX project) had serious issues with Dassault: http://microsim.over-blog.com/article-rafale-de-rollus-110524502.html

 

"La diffusion du Rafale A-M pour FSX est définitivement stoppée suite à un non accord avec la société Dassault Aviation, tous les produits freeware notamment, représentant leurs avions sont également interdits de diffusion. Le Rafale B et l'ensemble des textures Tiger Meet sont terminés mais ne peuvent également être diffusés."

"The distribution of the Rafale AM for FSX is definitively stopped following a non-agreement with the company Dassault Aviation, all freeware products in particular, representing their planes are also prohibited from distribution. The Rafale B and all the Tiger Meet textures are finished but cannot also be served. "

"Not sure" it is a good idea (?) ... unless agreements with Dassault.


Edited by Dee-Jay
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Two main reasons, the first is the predictable old one: Rafale is too modern and active for it to have much of a chance to be allowed into a simulation with realistic systems, weapons, and performance figures available. French, especially the Dassault were notorious for not being too welcome to such consumer sim products, but recent collaboration between Razbam and AdA may hint at this improving. Still, Rafale is probably a bridge too far at this point.

 

The second, and for me the more weighty reason: I would much prefer some focus going back to 60s-90s aircraft. For a variety of reasons, I think they fit the best for a DCS module, and I also personally am more interested in aircraft from this period. Recently most of the major module releases were of the modern variety: Hornet, JF-17, Viper, which caused de facto cancellation of an 80s upgraded F-4E which I was very, very anticipating. Razbam is working on an F-15E, which will probably be a 90s one, but still mostly continues this trend.

 

The niche that I am really looking forward to include things like said F-4E, A-6, A-7, MiG-23, MiG-27, Su-17, Mirage III, V, and F-1, Q-5, J 35 Draken etc. Or even modernized MiG-21s and/or F-5s. At this point only MiG-23 seems to be in active development among those. F-4E seems at best a very distant dream, A-6 and A-7 are past hints by Razbam or an AI that have been put in back burner which may or may not become a module at some point. Draken is likewise. Same goes for Mirage III by Razbam. Mirage F-1 will eventually be the work item for Aviodev again, but that is some ways off obviously.

 

I'd really love seeing some of these getting into the sim, or being put into active workbench of devs again.

 

Edit: boy will this be an unpopular opinion :P...

 

I agree. It's not likely the Rafale is obtainable. It's too modern and I really do think the limit of modern jet modules have been reached anyways, aside from the rare exceptions of products from countries that don't care. Getting more modern modules to go against those isn't a feasible way of dealing with them, even though I get the sense some people may feel that way.

 

I also agree that there should be alot more Cold War era stuff, particularly from the Vietnam time period. That stuff is obtainable, there's likely lots of information on them and can be modeled to a high degree of accuracy. I would kill to have that F-4 Phantom module, which should not have been shelved either.


Edited by CommanderRabb
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Modules - F-18, F-16, Spitfire, F-5, Supercarrier, F-14, A10-C, MiG-21, Huey

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No

 

Because most of the aircrafts in DCS are GEN IV and also some GEN III..

 

Having a GEN IV+ or GEN V aircrafts would be unbalanced compared to the others!

In addition, aircafts of this génération are classified trade secret and military secret !!

 

Why not an early model Rafale like the Rafale C F-1?

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