SandMartin Posted December 28, 2019 Share Posted December 28, 2019 (edited) Guys, our man tested HB F-14B with special script. This test showed that real F-14b had ~2 deg/second of sustained turn rate lower that Heatblur F-14B. At 300 knots and 5000 ft 15.5 deg/sec vs 17.46 deg/sec Link here https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4154927&postcount=4264 https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=223920&d=1577561465 Edited December 28, 2019 by SandMartin Мой youtube канал Группа в VK IBM x3200 Tower, i7 9700k, Asus Z390-P, HyperX Fury DDR4 2x16Gb 3466 Mhz, HyperX Savage 480Gb SSD, Asus RTX3070 Dual OC 8G, 32" Asus PG329Q, Creative Sound Blaster AE-5, HyperX Cloud Alpha + Pulsefire FPS Pro + Alloy FPS brown, Track IR 4 PRO + Clip Pro, Warhog HOTAS + CH Pro Pedal + есть руль Logitech G25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Guys, our man tested HB F-14B with special script. This test showed that real F-14b had ~2 deg/second of sustained turn rate lower that Heatblur F-14B. At 300 knots and 5000 ft 15.5 deg/sec vs 17.46 deg/sec Link here https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4154927&postcount=4264 https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=223920&d=1577561465 Seams all right to me Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snappy Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 Guys, our man tested HB F-14B with special script. This test showed that real F-14b had ~2 deg/second of sustained turn rate lower that Heatblur F-14B. At 300 knots and 5000 ft 15.5 deg/sec vs 17.46 deg/sec Link here https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4154927&postcount=4264 https://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=223920&d=1577561465 Video of „your man“ s testing with all parameters visible, including Alt&OAT pls. Otherwise too many factors involved for such a blanket statement. Regards, Snappy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunaticfringe Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 As dalan illustrated, standing on the Ps curve shows the proper G relative to speed in accordance to the charts. This "special script test" claim smells like another temperature manipulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandMartin Posted January 2, 2020 Author Share Posted January 2, 2020 Video of „your man“ s testing with all parameters visible, including Alt&OAT pls. Otherwise too many factors involved for such a blanket statement. Regards, Snappy Here https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4155519&postcount=4277 Мой youtube канал Группа в VK IBM x3200 Tower, i7 9700k, Asus Z390-P, HyperX Fury DDR4 2x16Gb 3466 Mhz, HyperX Savage 480Gb SSD, Asus RTX3070 Dual OC 8G, 32" Asus PG329Q, Creative Sound Blaster AE-5, HyperX Cloud Alpha + Pulsefire FPS Pro + Alloy FPS brown, Track IR 4 PRO + Clip Pro, Warhog HOTAS + CH Pro Pedal + есть руль Logitech G25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Here https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4155519&postcount=4277 F-14 related replays usually don't work, so i took this one with a grain of salt...... and fortunately this one DID work. Not on the first try, on the first one the F-14 just flew to the stratosphere! :pilotfly: But on the second one: Again, as you can see, 300 KIAS 5.1g, follows that chart you posted beautifully. So if nothing else it is a flight model validation. Now, what seamed to be the problem? :huh: Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nomad Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Again, as you can see, 300 KIAS 5.1g, follows that chart you posted beautifully. So if nothing else it is a flight model validation. Except that it doesn't, so why don't you look again? [brag]European dogfight champion 2006[/brag] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Except that it doesn't, so why don't you look again? You are right. At first i wasn't sure if you meant the video or the diagram, but on closer inspection (depending on how i count the pixels) there seams to be a 0.4-0.5 g difference between the performance in the sim and on that chart. And that is not an insignificant difference, especially at these air speeds. I guess some revisions are in order. I wonder if it's the drag or something else, but i probably won't be able to fly today and evaluate the FM in more detail. Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron886 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Might be slightly over, but I'm going to quibble. 1. Your bot is jumping between 16.something and 17.7. Where you got 16.46 I don't know. 2. Real EM diagrams are experimentally derived meaning they're flown by test pilots, not robots. Test pilots are human, if precise, and having a perfect bot sit in a 30 minute turn is not realistic, even though I commend the coding skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belphe Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 This is equally interesting as it is concerning.. Any chance for an official statement from HB? Never say never, Baby! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Might be slightly over, but I'm going to quibble. 1. Your bot is jumping between 16.something and 17.7. Where you got 16.46 I don't know. 2. Real EM diagrams are experimentally derived meaning they're flown by test pilots, not robots. Test pilots are human, if precise, and having a perfect bot sit in a 30 minute turn is not realistic, even though I commend the coding skill. You can try it yourself without the script, just set your fuel consumption to infinite so you can have enough time. I did it in my first video and got vert similar results. I just another manual eval from 160-750 KIAS, and though not as precise, the results were interesting. The low end of the envelope is very precise, within -0.2 to +0.0g (take into account my stick discipline here), then as i got near the core it was slightly off (+0.4-0.5g), then the core seams to be spot on (350-450KIAS), the high subsonic gave me the most deviation, from +0.7 to +1.2 as i got into transsonic, and finally the very top was extremely off the other way around, from -1.0 to -0.2g. I tried to save the track, but it didn't work on replay (not once out of 5 tries). I could attach it if you wish, but i'd rather other people fly as well, so we can get multiple samples. Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 Addendum: Did some flyouts with the F-15C today, to see how it's performance matches the 220 performance charts. Primary goal, to establish if stores drag affects performance and how much. Turns out the thing is very precisely simulated, both clean and with 4 Sparrows and 4 Sidewinders, from 160 to over 500 knots at 10kft. I have no idea how DCS handles store drag, but for the F-15C at least, it seams spot on. Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draconus Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 I have no idea how DCS handles store drag, but for the F-15C at least, it seams spot on. Keep in mind that drag thing is still WIP and have temporary fixes applied for now. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4108077&postcount=5 Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060 Rift S T16000M TWCS TFRP FC3 F-14A/B F-15E CA SC NTTR PG Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 Keep in mind that drag thing is still WIP and have temporary fixes applied for now. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4108077&postcount=5 Yeah, i know. That's why i mentioned it. I'm just curious as to how the whole system works, as they seams to have tuned it very good with the Eagle Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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