Mars Exulte Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 @Kev2Go I agree, REDFOR from ED is a no-go, and people need to get over it. ED's answers have become progessively firmer over the years, in contrast to ''keeping the door open''. We need to pester the 3rd parties to do it. That said, I wonder why rotorcraft seem to not be affected by this, since they're doing a Hind? Perhaps the Hind is so simplistic that there's just nothing even the Russians consider ''secret''? Or perhaps Mil design company is more willing to cooperate? Interesting anyway Де вороги, знайдуться козаки їх перемогти. 5800x3d * 3090 * 64gb * Reverb G2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nipil Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Maybe we would not get any Russian stuff still in service, but will get something like Su-17/22? After all, it was retired in the 90's, so there is little to keep classified about it nowadays. And we've already got MiG-23MLA (though 3rd party) and Mi-24P, both are too 70's-early 80's technologies, the latter is still operational with RuAF. An Su-17 is going to be a great addition to the MiG-21/23 and, together with Mi-8 and -24, would pretty much close the major niches of Soviet Cold War era tactical aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fri13 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Maybe we would not get any Russian stuff still in service, but will get something like Su-17/22? After all, it was retired in the 90's, so there is little to keep classified about it nowadays.[/Quote] Because something is out of service, it doesn't mean that newer aircrafts do not use systems that are based to old retired ones, so those can be security risk for new systems. i7-8700k, 32GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 2x 2080S SLI 8GB, Oculus Rift S. i7-8700k, 16GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 1080Ti 11GB, 27" 4K, 65" HDR 4K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fri13 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 You have your forum set up for max post per page. It is on page 100. Exactly... A point that so many doesn't get with the claim "100 pages" as there ain't such.... i7-8700k, 32GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 2x 2080S SLI 8GB, Oculus Rift S. i7-8700k, 16GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 1080Ti 11GB, 27" 4K, 65" HDR 4K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fri13 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 You seem to be cherrypicking small tidbid statements which you cannot source. Its been denied countless times in past on forums ( Ive been around here long enough) , I think you need to re listen the Alert 5 podcast. [/Quote] Thank you providing evidence why I am right and you are wrong. SO in Short Fri wishful thinking on your behalf. IL apply your logic and start making up reasons for an F22 AND F35 are realistic expecations "cuse i want to believe everythings possible and everything subject to change Bruh" Now you are making false arguments, as even in evidence you provided against yourself, you can't read what you quoted.... Go back to your "brain melting" question.... And ED opening new studio.... Somewhere else than Russia. i7-8700k, 32GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 2x 2080S SLI 8GB, Oculus Rift S. i7-8700k, 16GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 1080Ti 11GB, 27" 4K, 65" HDR 4K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fri13 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 That said, I wonder why rotorcraft seem to not be affected by this, since they're doing a Hind? Perhaps the Hind is so simplistic that there's just nothing even the Russians consider ''secret''? Or perhaps Mil design company is more willing to cooperate? Interesting anyway ED has not given any logical or any sound reason "why not", just previously that they couldn't or can't until further notice. (Something can happen that changes situation). What they have implied is that Russian company is not allowed to access to Russian weapons because secrets. But that foreign company in foreign country (even enemy of state) is allowed to have full access to Russian weapons if so wanted to negotiate agreement to do so. So that argument that they just can't, is not logical. There is simply something they can't say. If ED would say "no one can do modern Russian aircrafts..." Then it would be logical. But it can very well as well be that ED has got an warning, why they are not willing to test ice with a stick that could they get away with one.... Anything really can be a reason. i7-8700k, 32GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 2x 2080S SLI 8GB, Oculus Rift S. i7-8700k, 16GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 1080Ti 11GB, 27" 4K, 65" HDR 4K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiG21bisFishbedL Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 ED has not given any logical or any sound reason "why not", just previously that they couldn't or can't until further notice. (Something can happen that changes situation). What they have implied is that Russian company is not allowed to access to Russian weapons because secrets. But that foreign company in foreign country (even enemy of state) is allowed to have full access to Russian weapons if so wanted to negotiate agreement to do so. So that argument that they just can't, is not logical. There is simply something they can't say. If ED would say "no one can do modern Russian aircrafts..." Then it would be logical. But it can very well as well be that ED has got an warning, why they are not willing to test ice with a stick that could they get away with one.... Anything really can be a reason. There's a great deal of difference between a MiG-29 and an Mi-24. It's called "Radar." So yes, that's literally why. Fighters carry much more sensitive information than helos. Reformers hate him! This one weird trick found by a bush pilot will make gunfighter obsessed old farts angry at your multi-role carrier deck line up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mars Exulte Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Fri, the quote directly said ''we're not gonna do it''. It's really clear. The caveat ''if we relocate our main studio'' is a LONG ways from ''we're going to or may''. It's called a ''hypothetical''. They aren't going to move their studio JUST for the sake of making a Russian fighter. They could make a new plane every month for ten years and never touch anything east of the Rhine. ED themselves have declared the solution : PESTER THE 3RD PARTIES IF YOU WANT ONE. ED isn't going to do it, and YES they've been VERY specific about why : because the Russians are uncooperative. Де вороги, знайдуться козаки їх перемогти. 5800x3d * 3090 * 64gb * Reverb G2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiG21bisFishbedL Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 I'd honestly figured that the RuMoD's stubbornness about this would've been in the back of everyone's head by now. Reformers hate him! This one weird trick found by a bush pilot will make gunfighter obsessed old farts angry at your multi-role carrier deck line up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldur Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Can I ask about the Phantom? I cant understand why this has never really been tackled in any sim, including DCS up until now? Mostly because that statement simply is not true. That depends on POV. There hasn't been any phull phi sim of her yet. Not a single one. The closest we got though is in SPh2, and before that we could phly the thing in many games dating back to dunno when, I started out with Phighter Bomber aka Strike Aces on the A500. So yes, she has been simulated multiple times to some extent. But compared to DCS, anything from the past looks like an arcade game and we especially do want to phly that thing in Vee Or with the phull clicky cockpit experience, a decent GIB AI (call Jester, he'd probably gladly jump in) and multiplayer capability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markturner1960 Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) Mostly because that statement simply is not true. List me some sims simulating a full fidelity Phantom please........in development does not count I have been flying combat sims since Falcon super pak days and there was a pay ware phantom you could get for FSX and that’s it afaik....... I can’t understand why it is not more popular or lusted after....and it can do carrier ops........it’s perfect for DCS for so many reasons, not least that development has already been started.... Edited July 9, 2020 by markturner1960 System specs: PC1 :Scan 3XS Ryzen 5900X, 64GB Corsair veng DDR4 3600, EVGA GTX 3090 Win 10, Quest Pro, Samsung Odyssey G9 Neo monitor. Tir5. PC2 ( Helo) Scan 3XS Intel 9900 K, 32 GB Ram, 2080Ti, 50 inch Phillips monitor F/A-18C: Rhino FFB base TianHang F16 grip, Winwing MP 1, F-18 throttle, TO & Combat panels, MFG crosswind & DFB Aces seat Viper: WinWing MFSSB base with F-16 grip, Winwing F-16 throttle, plus Vipergear ICP. MFG crosswind rudders. Helo ( Apache) set up: Virpil collective with AH64D grip, Cyclic : Virpil CM3 base & TM F18 grip, MFG crosswind rudders, Total controls AH64 MFD's, TEDAC Unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kang Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 That entirely depends on what you call 'full fidelity'. A level of detail in the systems modelling like DCS features has obviously been technically impossible for a long time. So, yes, you got it. There is no full fidelity Phantom simulation. But if you want to play that card, why stop there? There is no full fidelity Tornado simulation either (although DI's classic is still pretty good today), for a random example. No, AH-1, no MiG-27, no F-104. Plus the F-4 has been previously announced, as you said it has had some development work done, and is now gathering dust on a shelf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver_Dragon Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 That entirely depends on what you call 'full fidelity'. A level of detail in the systems modelling like DCS features has obviously been technically impossible for a long time. So, yes, you got it. There is no full fidelity Phantom simulation. But if you want to play that card, why stop there? There is no full fidelity Tornado simulation either (although DI's classic is still pretty good today), for a random example. No, AH-1, no MiG-27, no F-104. Plus the F-4 has been previously announced, as you said it has had some development work done, and is now gathering dust on a shelf.Remember, the F-4E and AH-1 was put "on hold" Enviado desde mi RNE-L21 mediante Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfpoor Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 I can’t understand why it is not more popular or lusted after....and it can do carrier ops........it’s perfect for DCS for so many reasons, not least that development has already been started.... I hear you. My personal DCS dream is FF Phantom, Flogger, Foxbat, and FRG/DDR map. But we also have to realize half or most DCS players were born after 1991. AC built in the 1970's can't shoot Fox-Threes and can't turn and burn like newer jets. For me, Cold War jets over Europe would be competitive and exciting. But for a younger audience, this might not be appealing. HORNET/VIPER/HARRIER/SABRE/FISHBED/FROGFOOT/HOKUM/HIND/JUG/ISHAK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gierasimov Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) Not quite I hear you. My personal DCS dream is FF Phantom, Flogger, Foxbat, and FRG/DDR map. But we also have to realize half or most DCS players were born after 1991. AC built in the 1970's can't shoot Fox-Threes and can't turn and burn like newer jets. For me, Cold War jets over Europe would be competitive and exciting. But for a younger audience, this might not be appealing. First, of, I remember ED saying the average is closer to 40 years old. I am that average and frankly, anything older than our Hornet / Viper as a new module, would not appeal to me. The Flogger is coming though, might be good in lack of other FF RED aircraft. Edited July 9, 2020 by Gierasimov Intel i7-13700KF :: ROG STRIX Z790-A GAMING WIFI D4 :: Corsair Vengeance LPX 64GB :: MSI RTX 4080 Gaming X Trio :: VKB Gunfighter MK.III MCG Ultimate :: VPC MongoosT-50 CM3 :: non-VR :: single player :: open beta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nipil Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 Because something is out of service, it doesn't mean that newer aircrafts do not use systems that are based to old retired ones, so those can be security risk for new systems. I know this, so I don't say we definitely will get this bird, but that maybe we will. I just hypothesized. Still, it's much more realistic than Su-27/MiG-29 and, given that MiG-23 and Mi-24 are already being developed, it has a chance of being allowed by Russian authorities. Or at least there's a possibility that it can be made by a 3rd party, but that's a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zius Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Because something is out of service, it doesn't mean that newer aircrafts do not use systems that are based to old retired ones, so those can be security risk for new systems. Except that (early / export models of the) Su-27 and MiG-29 are already flown by countries that are allied to any major power and even by private citizens. So the US, China and various European countries have had the chance to take both apart and completely reverse engineer them. All in all, I don't think that argument works anymore. Modules: Bf 109, C-101, CE-II, F-5, Gazelle, Huey, Ka-50, Mi-8, MiG-15, MiG-19, MiG-21, Albatros, Viggen, Mirage 2000, Hornet, Yak-52, FC3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splash Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 I honestly think that ED should end with so much speculation, after 1.000 messages written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 I honestly think that ED should end with so much speculation, after 1.000 messages written. :cry::thumbup::D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiG21bisFishbedL Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Except that (early / export models of the) Su-27 and MiG-29 are already flown by countries that are allied to any major power and even by private citizens. So the US, China and various European countries have had the chance to take both apart and completely reverse engineer them. All in all, I don't think that argument works anymore. It honestly doesn't matter if it does or doesn't work, if the right relevant MoDs say no, it's no. Welcome to the world of defense, leave logic at the door. Reformers hate him! This one weird trick found by a bush pilot will make gunfighter obsessed old farts angry at your multi-role carrier deck line up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilbur81 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 I think there are a good number of faithful Eagle Dynamics' Lovers out there whose most anticipated aircraft would be a completed Hornet and Viper. :thumbup: i7 8700K @ Stock - Win10 64 - 32 RAM - RTX 3080 12gb OC - 55 inch 4k Display Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mars Exulte Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 @Zius Whether something is publicly available and whether it's legal are two entirely separate things, that's not rocket science. Try crossing the US border with any of the ''publicly available and legal to own'' flight manuals floating around out there. Congratulations, you just violated ITARS! See, this isn't the wild west, and ED is not a group of private modders tinkering around. They are a for profit corporation, and based in a specific country thereby beholden to their legal system and political whims. So, they actually have to do things in a semi-sensible, legal fashion to avoid being sued or jailed. I don't see why it's so hard for people to understand that. Де вороги, знайдуться козаки їх перемогти. 5800x3d * 3090 * 64gb * Reverb G2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 The lack of Response from ED might be a response in itself . They might be considering it. Might be wrong though , it's just my opinion . Personally i think any new module is welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandMartin Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 The most anticipated unannounced aircraft for me are: AH-64, Yak-3, Panavia Tornado and clickable Mig-29A Мой youtube канал Группа в VK IBM x3200 Tower, i7 9700k, Asus Z390-P, HyperX Fury DDR4 2x16Gb 3466 Mhz, HyperX Savage 480Gb SSD, Asus RTX3070 Dual OC 8G, 32" Asus PG329Q, Creative Sound Blaster AE-5, HyperX Cloud Alpha + Pulsefire FPS Pro + Alloy FPS brown, Track IR 4 PRO + Clip Pro, Warhog HOTAS + CH Pro Pedal + есть руль Logitech G25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StressLess Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 The most anticipated unannounced aircraft for me are: AH-64, Yak-3, Panavia Tornado and clickable Mig-29A Excellent choices! I'd put order of preference of these at 1. clickable Mig-29A, 2. AH-64, 3. Tornado, and 4. Yak-3. Unfortunately, the least likely one is the clickable Mig-29A, while the most likely one is the Tornado and is almost certain to be the mystery module... HP Z230 - Win10 Pro, i7-4770@3.30Ghz, 16GB RAM, EVO 1TB SSD x2, GTX 1660 Super 6GB, Quest 2 VR/TrackIR5; GIGABYTE AERO 17 HDR XD - Creator series laptop DCS World - Terrains: all; Modules: all but MB-339, Mirage F1, Mosquito, I-16, MiG-19P, Yak-52, F-5E, L-39, C-101, MiG-15bis, MiG-21bis, & F-86F; Campaigns: various On My Radar - The Typhoon, and I'm still hoping for a Norway map to go with it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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