MiG-23MLA external model WIP

[TLTeo]

what do you mean with strakes?

 

 

The slots in the wing gloves I used my amazing art skills to circle in this post https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4455967&postcount=193

[MKev]

The slots in the wing gloves I used my amazing art skills to circle in this post https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4455967&postcount=193

 

Ah now I understand. I hope RAZBAM is sure on this. There was somebody mentioning that this new wings with "dog-tooth" have been released with the MiG-23MLA already. Can't be sure what is right or wrong. I hope RAZBAM has the correct papers :D

[TLTeo]

As I posted earlier, the big dogtooth wings were a thing since much earlier variants and should not be confused with the small strakes on the wing gloves. Razbam's wings are correct for the MLA they are modelling.

[nsf_zx]

F-14 vs MiG-23 1v1 is not a fair fight, the F-14 is clearly better in both BVR and WVR, there is nothing to argue...

 

 

BUT

 

 

Wiki says that an F-14A in 1977 cost 19.2 million USD, while the MiG-23 between 3.6 to 6.6 million

 

 

If that is accurate, then you could buy 3-5 MiG-23 for the price of 1 F-14A, and production numbers reflect that.

 

 

Based on that I'd say that a 1v4 scenario should be considered when talking about MiG-23 vs US 4th gens like the F-14 or the F-15

 

the f-14 is clearly better in bvr and.... (the rest is propaganda... or a wish or an assumption or... whatever other thing than real)

according to NASA te mig-23 is more agile than the f-14

 

(sourse: NASA technical memorandum 86352 - some fighter aircraft trends)

maniobrabilidad__NASA technical memorandum 86352 - some fighter aircraft trends.pdf

[Snappy]

the f-14 is clearly better in bvr and.... (the rest is propaganda... or a wish or an assumption or... whatever other thing than real)

according to NASA te mig-23 is more agile than the f-14

 

(sourse: NASA technical memorandum 86352 - some fighter aircraft trends)

 

Off topic but:

I would treat that diagram with caution, as explained in the file the agility value is just a theoretical number derrived by division of two physical/aerodynamic values.It does not translate into an absolute statement of the aircraft maneuverability, which is something else.

They arrive at the value by dividing T/W by combat wing loading.The F-14 has a significant lift generating body, but that is not counted as wing area so its not factured in.Also, at the time of the Nasa report there was only the F-14A,

currently in the sim we have -B model with newer engines, providing a sizable thrust increase ,further raising T/W.

 

 

According to that Diagramm , both the F-104 Starfighter(notorious for lack of turnfight ability) as well as the F-4 both come out on top of the F-14.

Does that mean you would really rather go into a knife fight with these two much older aircraft instead of the newer , more maneuverable and more capable F-14? Well I wouldn’t.

 

 

 

Still doesn’t mean that the Mig-23 is unable to out-accelerate nearly everything.

 

Regards,

 

Snappy

Edited September 2, 2020 by Snappy

[Top Jockey]

the f-14 is clearly better in bvr and.... (the rest is propaganda... or a wish or an assumption or... whatever other thing than real)

according to NASA te mig-23 is more agile than the f-14

 

(sourse: NASA technical memorandum 86352 - some fighter aircraft trends)

 

Hermano, not everyone agrees... and also it isn't as simple as that.

 

Start here at post #81, it does have pertinent info about F-14 vs MiG-23 regarding Air Combat Maneuvering.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=140030&page=9

[AeriaGloria]

Sure, but I hope there will be someone online after release to show him the 23 is not “garbage”

 

Just wait, instead of “R-27ET to the face” being the online motto it will be “R-24T to the face”

[Top Jockey]

Sure, but I hope there will be someone online after release to show him the 23 is not “garbage”

 

Just wait, instead of “R-27ET to the face” being the online motto it will be “R-24T to the face”

 

I would not call it "garbage" either.

 

And besides, the MiG-23 did show its "claws" in combat, for instance with a SAAF Mirage F1 kill...

 

http://www.urrib2000.narod.ru/ArticPiercy2-e.html

[_Firefly]

From what I know the R-24 should have similar capabilities to the AIM-7F, so even by Western standards the missile isn't bad. The Flogger will certainly require different tactics to what most 4th gen pilots are used to. Even the Soviet MLD user's manual suggested slash and dash style attacks as opposed to dogfighting, particularly when facing F-15s.

[Кош]

[AeriaGloria]

Choosing what combo of R-24s to take is going to be painful

[_Firefly]

Choosing what combo of R-24s to take is going to be painful

 

With only two wing glove pylons and two variants of the R-24 available that choice is going to be rather limited... ;) Depending on how useful the TP-26Sh IRST turns out to be, I might be inclined to try out an all-IR loadout.

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

according to NASA te mig-23 is more agile than the f-14

 

[Кош]

 

MF or S most certainly. Much heavier and much less lift than ML.

[Fri13]

Choosing what combo of R-24s to take is going to be painful

 

How so? You have three options:

 

1. R-24R + R-24R
   
2. R-24R + R-24T
   
3. R-24T + R-24T
   

 

It is not so painful thing to do, like with previous variant that had space only for two control boxes inside so you could only carry same seeker missiles without mixing them.

At least you can have four R-60 missiles with those, so when you get to close, you have excellent potential to get them down with agile missiles when you zoom through them.

[_Firefly]

MF or S most certainly. Much heavier and much less lift than ML.

 

Exactly, all models from the ML onwards were substantially lighter than the earlier variants and had more thrust. I'm not so sure about lift, as most of the changes from the M to the ML were internal (except the dorsal fin of course).

[Кош]

Evolution is pretty serious:

http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/fighter/mig23s/mig23s-1.gif

http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/fighter/mig23mf/mig23mf-1.gif

http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/fighter/mig23ml/mig23ml-2.gif

More wing area and more mechanization with each version. Also notice how ML is shorter.

[OverStratos]

I would not call it "garbage" either.

 

And besides, the MiG-23 did show its "claws" in combat, for instance with a SAAF Mirage F1 kill...

 

http://www.urrib2000.narod.ru/ArticPiercy2-e.html

 

 

- and two confirmed and two probable F-14 kills

- and several numbers of (didn´t have the exact number per type right now) F-4s, F-5s, F-16s

- it also has claims of F-15 kills

[pepin1234]

I would not call it "garbage" either.

 

And besides, the MiG-23 did show its "claws" in combat, for instance with a SAAF Mirage F1 kill...

 

http://www.urrib2000.narod.ru/ArticPiercy2-e.html

 

Personal description from the Cuban pilot that pulled the trigger:

 

[Baco]

very interesting documenatry!

[Pinduca]

Quite right Interesting!

[Fri13]

Personal description from the Cuban pilot that pulled the trigger:

 

 

Could be interesting to watch if just understood anything. google translation makes such a odd work that Spanish > English is just impossible to follow.

[pepin1234]

Mig-23 pilot at video beginning: -at about 8km I detect them. They were coming in combat formation but they open break to quickly get into dogfight. I turned right and they turned toward me to get the tail of each other. I pulled hard the control lever with high Gs and I got to get his tail. I pulled the trigger of the close range rocket and I saw it left toward his nozzle. We saw the tail on fire, The rocket did a direct impact on the nozzle and after that we saw him in a hard deep dive. We didn’t see him ejected.

 

Min 4:16 Shilka commander: I left the equipment combat ready. They were coming in low flight to then pitch and dive to bombing our batteries. I saw the 3 targets and quickly we got the system ready, I did two Long burst shot. Two of them got right break and the left one hold a moment and I shot there another long burst shot and it exploded on the air.

 

Min 2:40: The officer is explaining the very important action on his opinion about the mission accomplished of a group of intelligence Cubans explorers. They got to penetrate 20km deep the rearguard of the enemy and they were formed by the intelligence officer, the medic, the artillery officer, the cooker, the Politic officer and some other soldiers. This mission got to detect the enemy position and we were very pleased to get our aviation punching those enemy position.

Edited September 8, 2020 by pepin1234

[_Firefly]

Mig-23 pilot at video beginning: -at about 8km I detect them. They were coming in combat formation but they open break to quickly get into dogfight. I turned right and they turned toward me to get the tail of each other. I pulled hard the control lever with high Gs and I got to get his tail. I pulled the trigger of the close range rocket and I saw it left toward his nozzle. We saw the tail on fire, The rocket did a direct impact on the nozzle and after that we saw him in a hard deep dive. We didn’t see him ejected.

 

Min 4:16 Shilka commander: I left the equipment combat ready. They were coming in low flight to then pitch and dive to bombing our batteries. I saw the 3 targets and quickly we got the system ready, I did two Long burst shot. Two of them got right break and the left one hold a moment and I shot there another long burst shot and it exploded on the air.

 

Min 2:40: The officer is explaining the very important action on his opinion about the mission accomplished of a group of intelligence Cubans explorers. They got to penetrate 20km deep the rearguard of the enemy and they were formed by the intelligence officer, the medic, the artillery officer, the cooker, the Politic officer and some other soldiers. This mission got to detect the enemy position and we were very pleased to get our aviation punching those enemy position.

 

Thank you.

[pepin1234]

San Antonio base, Cuba. with some ML units combat ready after so many years: