leafer Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 listen at 2:35 is it true or was he just yapping. ED have been taking my money since 1995. :P
mvsgas Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Maybe (and in some way I hope) we will never find out. F-15 I think is still having problems ( what they are I have no idea) and I don't know how many country own the original SU-27. In another note, the aircraft that guy was sitting on, look like it did not even have ejection seats in it. I wonder if he was able to get out after closing the canopy or they had to pry him out? Sorry just wandering. To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..
Eagle Driver Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 I find it very likely that the Flanker managed to defeat the F-15. By all accounts, it is a more maneuverable airplane at low altitudes with a much lower turn radius and a higher turnrate. If the fight was taken to, I don't know, maybe Angels 35 then the story would likely be different, the Eagle is famous for being the world's best jet for transonic high-altitude dogfights where not even an F-16 has an advantage against it. Interestingly enough, I read an article from a US pilot who's flown Hornets, Falcons and probably others, who said that while the Flanker could turn good and had a great rollrate, it was sluggish on the controls, the aircraft was not good at changing G very quickly and he thought it would likely make a gunshot a lot harder than a Falcon or Hornet who are stable as rocks (and in the Hornet's case, just as fast as one). [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] If you fly a perfect Defensive BFM and the bandit does a perfect Offensive... Someone you know is going to be recieving Insurance money very soon.
Rhen Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Yeah... when you start 3,000ft behind your opponent - and your opponent isn't expecting an engagement in the first place, it's very difficult for you to lose the fight... Guess where the Flanker was.... At least in India, a fight was expected.
tflash Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Did you see it releasing flares at the end of the film? Quite impressive! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Pilotasso Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 This incident as the video shows seems to be referring to an event that happened but did not result in joint mock exercise. The "fighting" was rather a demonstration of exuberance on the russian flier who took the initiative to surprise the american fliers. I dont think this happened again as planes from both countries never met again. I guess US military doesnt like to break the protocols like this. Its possible that Su-27 was/is more agile than F-15/16 but only in sustained close circle. The western types are much quicker though. Hence the sluggishness some american pilots mentioned that I guess seem to referr to transient perfomance. This is something that we can see in LOMAC in a crude way of course. But its there. [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P
leafer Posted December 31, 2007 Author Posted December 31, 2007 does anyone have link(s) to that story? ED have been taking my money since 1995. :P
leafer Posted December 31, 2007 Author Posted December 31, 2007 Pride and prejudice at its worst. Propaganda also goes both ways and there is no shortages of fighter jocks yapping about how awesome their jets are and they wouldn't trade it for anything. I can't stand that crap because I bet if the option is there, they would all be flying the latest and greatest. I'd love to see a mock gun fight between the Flanker and Eagle where the guys behind the sticks are equally skilled. My money on the Su cuz I love her. ED have been taking my money since 1995. :P
ED Team Groove Posted December 31, 2007 ED Team Posted December 31, 2007 Impressive pictures but im not sure the commentary was absolutly neutral ;) Our Forum Rules: http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en
RedTiger Posted December 31, 2007 Posted December 31, 2007 does anyone have link(s) to that story? I think I have the story bookmarked. I'll have to check when I get home. Basically it was a Western test pilot flying a two-seater Flanker with Aanatoli Kvochur in the back. He commented on the ramp-up time needed for a manuever. He said that when he moved the stick all the way to the left or right, there was this very short but perceptible lag between moving the stick and the plane rolling. He noticed this lag when performing other manuevers too. He also noticed that the plane would continue to roll after he returned the stick to the neutral position. He found that he had to pull the stick almost all the way in the opposite direction to compensate and level the plane out. He compared this to the F-16 and how its FBW system auto-compensates the moment the pilot stops input with the stick. EDIT- here it is: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3897/is_199908/ai_n8862137
RedTiger Posted December 31, 2007 Posted December 31, 2007 listen at 2:35 is it true or was he just yapping. I've heard the story he's talking about. Keep in mind, it happened WVR, not BVR.
leafer Posted January 1, 2008 Author Posted January 1, 2008 thanks RedTiger, but I meant link to the event commented at 2:35. But from what I understand, a Russian pilot snugged up behind an Eagle during a show but that doesn't sound right. Seems pretty dangerous and out of character for military personal to pull a stunt like that. ED have been taking my money since 1995. :P
GGTharos Posted January 1, 2008 Posted January 1, 2008 He sat on the F-15's tail, THEN the F-15 (IIRC, it was a D model) tried to shake him for a few seconds, and then gave up. It doesn't really prove anything - once you're saddled up on, losing the guy on your tail is a matter of that guy making some big mistakes, pretty much regardless of what you're flying. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
tflash Posted January 1, 2008 Posted January 1, 2008 The story I read was a bit different, but I can't find the source, I'm sifting to old numbers of Air Forces Monthly. I understood they agreed to do a chase: first, the F-15 would try to chase the Flanker, but couldn't keep up with the manoevres. Then, the Flanker chased the Eagle, and stayed unshakably at its tail. If true, it IS relevant imho: you must always prepare for a scenario where you are outnumbered and bandits get on your tail. Being able to shake him of seems a real advantage. The story as I read it was used as one of many arguments for the F-22. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
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