Labels

[Malleus]

Just an idea. IMO I think there should be a realistic label option, which would be something like this:

 

-nothing appears unless the object is within visual range

-when in visual range, a dot, or something like that appears

-when it gets close enough that it would be realistically possible to visually identify it, then it displays the type of the object (and not the exact type, just the basic model name, like "M-113" for all vehicles with the same chassis)

-when it gets closer, or is acquired by Skhval, a more exact description appears (like "M-163 Vulcan")

-also, distance should be only a rough estimate (like ~5km ~10km (less accurate when farther, more accurate when closer) or whatever would be possible to guess by a pilot)

 

I tried some label mods for LOFC, but they're just workarounds for the existing system - which is either "labels off" (makes the thing harder, obviously), and "labels on" (feels like cheating).

[TekaTeka]

Did you try mine?

http://bvr.jpn.org/lockon/mod/doc_e/LabelFont.html

[Malleus]

Aw, geez, I knew I missed something.:doh: That kinda looks like what I'm looking for, thanks. :)

[Weta43]

I haven't tried Teka-Teka's label config but as a long time arguer that SA is greatly diminished in a PC game because of the restricted FOV & the low resolution of the displays - & that correctly configured labels INCREASES realism, not decreases it (which reminds me - I should turn mine back on !), I had a go myself & arrived at this ("--" comments out the line):

 

AirFormat = {}

AirFormat[750] = ""

AirFormat[4500] = "%N"

AirFormat[7500] = "-'-"

AirFormat[10000] = ".:."

AirFormat[20000] = "."

 

GroundFormat = {}

GroundFormat[300] = ""

GroundFormat[2500] = "%N"

GroundFormat[5000] = "'"

-- GroundFormat[10000] = "%N%n%D"

-- GroundFormat[20000] = "%D"

 

NavyFormat = {}

NavyFormat[1500] = ""

-- NavyFormat[20000] = "%N%n%D"

NavyFormat[14000] = "%N"

NavyFormat[45000] = "*"

 

I think making both sides labels the same colour makes things more realistic so I also added ...

 

ColorAliesSide = {125, 0, 125}

ColorEnemiesSide = {125, 0, 125}

 

which makes the labels a fairly low visibility purple.

 

I had a hunt around on the internet & looked across at the airport on the other side of the harbour & figured these were optimistic, but not completely unbelievable values. Also remember that the characters are defined in pixels, so the higher the resolution you run the game the smaller your labels will be

[Wdigman]

Just an idea. IMO I think there should be a realistic label option, which would be something like this:

 

Is using labels at all realistic? I know that an AWAC could tell you what everything is or if ground forces are in the area, but the way labels are displayed in FC even with this mod seem unrealistic.

 

When creating missions I let the pilot see everything in the battlefield on the map. Some items can be hidden or randomly turned on or off. There is a Mod somewhere for this as well.

 

The reason for this I figure is that if you are sent out to attack something specific and are briefed, in a real life situaton the pilot will know what is in the surrounding area by intelligence or whatever. After all they can see a platoon of tanks moving this way then they should be able to spot SAMs or larger fixed threats. Its up to the pilot to memorize or take notes with him or her on the flight. Take good enough notes and you will have a very good chance at finding the object you want in flight without labels.

[CAT_101st]

Just an idea. IMO I think there should be a realistic label option, which would be something like this:

 

"labels off" (makes the thing harder, obviously), and "labels on" (feels like cheating).

 

I feal any type of labels on would take away from the experince of a real combat surounding. As stated above their shuld be a good breifing and if your a good pilot you will take as much info along for the ride. (SA) is not allways a learnd skill. Not every one has the abillty to keep track of whare, whin, and what is around thim. Some have what it take and others don't. :joystick:

[Malleus]

Take good enough notes and you will have a very good chance at finding the object you want in flight without labels.

 

That was exactly what I did when playing with labels off. And it worked, I admit. But Weta43 is also right - SA is worse on a PC monitor than in RL, even if in LO ground objects can be spotted from atrociously far away. I can't really decide, it works without labels, but I'm just tired of pixel hunting ground units.

 

Anyway, for labels, Tekateka's solution looks good, although I think I'll add the same color for both sides (thanks for the tip, Weta43).

[RedTiger]

Ah...the age old "label vs. no label" argument.

 

There will probably be a lot of people against labels.

 

Monitors are not real 3D space. Nothing will ever be displayed smaller than 1 pixel. Claiming that not using labels on a monitor is somewhat like what a real pilot must deal with in terms of SA is border-line hogwash IMO. Don't believe me? Take a drive on the highway. Take note of how far away you can see and make out the details on individual cars. Now take the highest rez photo you can of that very same scene and display it on a monitor. Now how far away can you make out the make and model of a car before it all turns into blobs and dots.

 

I tend to use labels off and on. I never use them for ground or naval objects. Only planes and missiles. When I use them, I pick one color for both sides. I also have things labeled as generally as possible. My labels won't say "R-27ET" or "R-27ER", they'll just say "missile". I also set it up so that no label appears before 8nm for a plane and about 4nm for a missile. Unfortunately not all sims let you modify labels to this degree. :(

[GGTharos]

I'll also point out that you should not be able to see a stinger/igla guy at /all/ in most situations, yet you get to spot him pretty well in LO usually ... labels aside.

 

RT, you would need finer segregation still I think ... you -might- be able to spot a Patriot at 4nm, though I kinda doubt it (that's how far you spot an F-5) ... I'd be thinking in general any AAM will not be visible past 1nm (if that) without a contail - bigger missiles, maybe.

[RedTiger]

I'll also point out that you should not be able to see a stinger/igla guy at /all/ in most situations, yet you get to spot him pretty well in LO usually ... labels aside.

 

RT, you would need finer segregation still I think ... you -might- be able to spot a Patriot at 4nm, though I kinda doubt it (that's how far you spot an F-5) ... I'd be thinking in general any AAM will not be visible past 1nm (if that) without a contail - bigger missiles, maybe.

 

Yeah thats probably true. 4nm was simply making my 8nm figure cut in half. I've cut it down to probably 2 knots before. I've read about so many missile evasion techniques that all talk about getting a tally on the missile. In every sim I've played, without labels that talley comes usually when its too late. I just put two and two together and figured if theres all this talk about seeing the missile, I should probably make it so I can see it.