LTD/R switch to safe after release a bomb

[Fri13]

By this definition if anything is mapped to your HOTAS other than HOTAS functions then you are cheating. Extra buttons on your X52? NOPE. Cheater. Extra switch on your Warthog... CHEATER.

 

Come on bro, come back to Earth.

 

I have only the aircraft throttle and stick functions in my HOTAS on each module as close as possible. I don't go overboard that I would switch physically throttles and stick grips to replicate the real ones, as it is enough that if there is example two four-way hats on stick, then I use only two four-way hats instead three. Why I opted to joystick that has most capabilities to replicate most possible combinations.

 

And cheating is as well that you cheat yourself. So you should come back to earth from your fantasy world that it is logical to wish realism in the simulator, while binding all kind unrealistic functions to your joystick and throttle that real aircraft doesn't have in its stick and throttle.

 

I completely acknowledge that most players do not have access to luxury items like VR, top joysticks or even pedals. But many fly with a usual and easily available products like Thrustmaster TM.16000 that has limited number of hats buttons and trigger functions in joystick, while throttle can be very good replication for many aircrafts by following Hornet layout.

 

But that is the one of the advantages of the VR, your physical world doesn't matter, your virtual one does. And that is increase in the immersion when you start to use more of the virtual cockpit than the real one.

 

For a long time the physical simulator pit was the ultimate goal for many, that took lot of time to build, effort to find all the measurements and get all the instruments, buttons, switches etc working. Yet so many was flying with a large TV or monitor front of them. Separated from the world while capable use the real cockpit layout. Some put more money and effort and got a 180-270 degree projection around them, that is maybe the next best thing you can get.

 

But what one can do more easily is the VR, and start using the cockpit more like it was designed for the era, for the purpose and for the technology limitations.

 

So you can come back to earth any time you want, but it is cheating yourself that binding functions to your joystick and throttle that doesn't belong there just so you get easier access to them than you should be.

But if one doesn't define rules, they can't be broken and then one doesn't need to cheat. But that is same thing as flying in DCS in Game Mode and thinking to be a master to operate the aircraft by using "Target closest enemy" etc functions, or why not just get invulnerability or active pause etc in use.... One would say cheating, one would say just enjoying from the simulator.

 

So you can come back to earth, as you don't seem to understand how irritating it is to flip that LTD/R switch back On after each release and checking that it stays On middle of the guidance.

It is not fault of the ED if it is realistic, it is just a question for the actual designer who decided that switch should be flipping back to Off automatically. As it is sign of the seek for the information that why it was made so, as there should be a good valid logical reason, as it can't be just "Well, we run out of the normal switches, so we put there this one circuit breaker switch".

 

One can very well just bind that function to button in their HOTAS "just because there is unused button!" but it just becomes cheating as one doesn't want to study and learn the aircraft at deeper level on that moment (if even ever). But that is the life, some people want to get easy, some want to think deeper "why?".

 

Like example the MiG-21Bis module. It got its weapons panel completely redone for correct logic. It was released with a simple assumptions that how it works, but it was completely wrong. So when it got remade, it required relearn how to operate it. The understanding the logic in it was one part of experience for it. And it makes more sense now how it is, so middle of the fight etc you are far more capable pilot.

 

Someone might not enjoy or value that experience, and the effort the developer finally went through to get it right. And thanks to the community members who found it and explained it.

So anyone can bind those switches and knobs functions to their HOTAS so they don't need to lift their hands to use them, but each one I raise my hand to operate them I value the MiG's engineers and designers effort to make real pilots work easier.

 

I am interested to learn what reason is for the LTD/R switch to flip Off automatically, and really why. What is the logic and technicality there. Like does someone have the electronic circuitry that shows the connectors, as I can't find that switch there.

 

it is these design things that makes military aviation history interesting, raising questions that why something was done. Like why the SPO-15 panel is in the bottom right corner deep inside the cockpit in Su-27S? Why not higher, near the HUD? It is purposely placed so low and far as there is space to be located near HUD.

 

Some say that labels ain't cheating, or TrackIR ain't cheating as you can look directly behind blink of a eye in a way you shouldn't. But who is to argue that is not done....

[Guppy]

Fri13, it's important to understand the word "cheating".

 

Cheating: act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination.

 

No one is acting dishonestly or unfairly. Doing something that is not "real" is not cheating. It's just that, not real . When you "fly" do you have a leg pad with all the real procedures and checklists to follow? If not you're cheating simulation.

 

Everytime you start the Hornet do you follow NATOPS standard start up proceedure? You ensure all your switches are in the correct orientation before you start up? If not you're cheating.

 

Many people do not want to have to reach for a mouse, turn and flick a switch in the pit every time they need to use it. This is far more effort and coordination than what is required in the real world. Especially when you factor turning away from your monitor. You lose spacial awareness.

 

It's a game bro and no one is cheating by mapping controls that arent made for a HOTAS to their HOTAS. Stop being a rivet counter.

 

And to your comment about VR - I would argue it is even more of a necessity to have as much stuff mapped to your HOTAS as possible. Good luck finding that mouse... super immersive.

[JoeFirefox]

@Fri13

no, not seriously now? If I understand it correctly, is it unrealistic to map functions or buttons to the HOTAS that are not occupied in the real physical cockpit, e.g. the F/A-18C? Excuse me - so you would have to have a 1:1 replication of such a cockpit, including oxygen supply via a mask, temperature changes, etc,....? Otherwise, like all of us, you would be a cheater, according to your own words. Please get back to the bottom of the facts - this is just a game and will always be! AND - I love this game as it is currently the best military flight simulation on the market! THX ED!!!!! ...just my 2 Cent :pilotfly:

 

 

 

 

 

 

...........................cheater, all cheater!!!!!:joystick::megalol:

[Fri13]

Fri13, it's important to understand the word "cheating".

 

Cheating: act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination.

 

No one is acting dishonestly or unfairly.

 

You can be honest or fair to yourself, or not.

 

You can lie to yourself "Tomorrow I will start the diet/stop smoking/I will tell to boss that i quit..." and you have kept telling that to yourself for weeks/months/years...

 

It is cheating yourself when you very well know that you are not going to do it.

 

So in DCS when you are binding functions that are not suppose to be in the real throttle etc (excluding the FC3 now as that is only way to do it) is cheating yourself because you know very well that they are not suppose to be there, and you want to get easier access to functions than using "more difficult manner" (be it a mouse or hand tracking etc).

 

If you do not agree with that, then you don't understand what word "cheating" really means.

Cheating is not just about others, it is as well about you to gain something for yourself.

 

For many they think it is OK to cheat themselves, when they don't cheat others, but if they cheat themselves, what denies them cheating others as well?

 

 

We have hardware limitations for the simulator. That can't be denied. That is the limitation but not the cheating as you can't do better. But if you could and you know it and yet you don't because you get the advantage (easiness etc) then you are cheating.

 

We have physics limitations as well, we can not experience what so ever the G forces we would if doing those same things with the real aircraft. But some can get some of the experience by having moving platforms to get the feeling of movement, while not the G forces. Some has installed pull strap systems that will squeeze them on the chair, so they will feel high pressure on their body. That is probably the closest thing you can get to G forces without going to serious simulator, and it can be dangerous for person with heart problems or high blood pressure.

So if someone can't do those things, it doesn't mean they are cheating as it is understandable limitation for their setup. But they shouldn't cheat themselves that they would start thinking they could do the same things in real aircraft as they do in the simulator with limited hardware etc either.

[Fri13]

@Fri13

no, not seriously now? If I understand it correctly, is it unrealistic to map functions or buttons to the HOTAS that are not occupied in the real physical cockpit, e.g. the F/A-18C? Excuse me - so you would have to have a 1:1 replication of such a cockpit, including oxygen supply via a mask, temperature changes, etc,....? Otherwise, like all of us, you would be a cheater, according to your own words.

 

Please read my previous words and my above message. You must acknowledge the limitations of the hardware and physics that when something is cheating and when something is not, by your actions.

 

Please get back to the bottom of the facts - this is just a game and will always be! AND - I love this game as it is currently the best military flight simulation on the market! THX ED!!!!! ...just my 2 Cent :pilotfly:

 

...........................cheater, all cheater!!!!!:joystick::megalol:

 

Yes, get back to facts and don't try to do personal insults.

 

As for you it doesn't matter at all that LTD/R switch turns automatically off after each time lazing stops, it is then by your logic same thing as if it would never do so and would always stay On regardless what as you don't care about that switch location and logic why it does it. You just press a button on stick.

 

You can't answer to question like why does pilot need to take his right hand off from the stick, and turn LTD/R switch On each time before using laser? Why not automatic master arm switch after each weapon release?

 

This is just one of those same things like in the Cold or Hot start. Some people just want to get in ready aircraft, while some enjoy from spending time to start the aircraft. Is the other cheating? Yes. Does it matter? In some cases yes.

[JoeFirefox]

@fri13

 

 

Stop sir, please! If i have insults someone - i'm sorry about that. Thats were never my intention. But im only pick up the words you thow in. And if someone is so critical as you seem (that ist your right), than i understand your disapointing about some "issues" (in your oppion) - but that is on you. For me - "hardcore simer" since the 80th - im trying to get it realistic as it can be - e. g. i builded 3 MFD für the F/A18C with TM Cougar MFD and 7" displays, a TM F/A-18C Stick (for the Hornet) in the middle position, TM F-16C Stick as sidestick (not force sensing, not yet...), rudder pedals, DIY Input Devices for UFC, ICP...., Switchpanel beside the MFD, and so on.... AND its not nearly the functionality of the real cockpit! But i have an real immersion and fun. When I responed your words about cheater, I meant that sarcastically. Because I don't see myself or any other "hardcore simer" here as a cheater, who use the usual hardware as its possibility.

 

Perhaps you own some perfected high-end input devices and I will give you this from the heart. And maybe you can tell me, which hardware setup is yours for your highend the sim-experience ... so i can get some ideas. Thanks in advanced for this informations.

So long.....cya in flight sim :pilotfly:

[Vanguard]

My 2c, I don't think it's cheating in anyway, if anything we've been cheated from the real experience. As a pilot I can use tactile sensation and muscle memory to flick most switches. Removing my head from the action to reposition my head/camera 45 degrees down to the right and using my mouse to flick a switch is hardly realistic compared to glancing out of the corner of my eye and feeling for the switch.

 

IRL I can, while driving my drive my car, use my knee to steady the wheel, twist my arm backward and pull a bottle of water out of a zipped up cooler bag in the back seat. Would be a bloody nightmare in sim with TrackIR haha. I'd probably find myself in a farmer's field pretty quick.

[Guppy]

Fri - I hope when you “die” in the simulation you never boot up again. In real life you only have one life and I hope you aren’t cheating death in game.

[Northstar98]

Fri - I hope when you “die” in the simulation you never boot up again. In real life you only have one life and I hope you aren’t cheating death in game.

 

I'm seriously confused as to why people think this is an argument.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Northstar98

[Fri13]

im trying to get it realistic as it can be - e. g. i builded 3 MFD für the F/A18C with TM Cougar MFD and 7" displays, a TM F/A-18C Stick (for the Hornet) in the middle position, TM F-16C Stick as sidestick (not force sensing, not yet...), rudder pedals, DIY Input Devices for UFC, ICP...., Switchpanel beside the MFD, and so on.... AND its not nearly the functionality of the real cockpit! But i have an real immersion and fun.

 

So you are one of those who tries to go and get it best as possible with limitation of one powers and simulation.

 

When I responed your words about cheater, I meant that sarcastically. Because I don't see myself or any other "hardcore simer" here as a cheater, who use the usual hardware as its possibility.

 

First of all, sarcasm is a hostility, what separates it from the wit. So one should be careful which one to use and when to apply a sarcasm.

 

But, back to the point. One can cheat himself by thinking to be something they are not.

Here comes the simulator part, we are all cheating ourselfs for our passion of the given topic, a aviation and especially military aviation.

 

If we would be doing these things in real life, last thing we would likely want to do is to be at home and fly a simulator, as we more likely would be up there doing it. But, one might not want to go to risk their lives and die, so it can be nicer to be at home and do those bombings etc.

 

So we need to choose what level of cheating we do. It can be from the small things, or large things.

Like one can cheat themselves that if they know how to fly an aircraft in perfect simulator, that they could be doing it in the reality. While it should be agreed that they do have far better skills to fly that aircraft than any person picked from the streets who has only seen aircraft on the sky or airport.

 

So even in this case, we can bind almost any function to almost any device. So we can even bind a landing gear switch to under our thumb in joystick, but that doesn't make it proper function in the stick, nor for the procedure. So that makes big difference as well that if one does need to extend their arm in simulator to position of that landing gear lever and flip it up/down, or press button in joystick. Same thing is with a mouse, that one needs to use mouse cursor to flip it.

 

There is a difference that one learns the process and each step to do something. And then to do something by the means they shouldn't be able to do it.

Like right now people are arguing that they should be able to pull 9G indefinitely in F-16C without visual problems, and same time look at their surroundings searching enemy or look their six with TrackIR, and then do all other fancy things in cockpit. We can not simulate G forces, because those people would right away realize that in 9G pull they would have head on the headrest, staring just the HUD, focusing to breathing and flying by the numbers and trying to get their planned maneuver completed so that once they ease with stick, they can start looking around and see enemy where they expect it would be.

 

But there they are arguing that they should be able to pull few good 9G circles with enemy, continually looking to front, back to six, to front, to enemy and then just be a rockstars when they maximize their airframe.

 

Simply cheating that they wouldn't be there as their virtual bodies should be there first to give up. So flying in a unrealistic maneuvers is cheating. So if a DCS would start to simulate the G forces better, restricting your capability to turn head, limit your capability to operate any other function than that real HOTAS has etc, it would be already start to better simulation. But many wouldn't like that at all, as already idea to them is bad because something would be restricting their fantasy of a super pilot.

 

This is already one of those things that is big difference between VR and TrackIR, as in VR one capability to look their rear is physically limited, while in TrackIR it is just slight twitch and there you go.

Sure there are people who have neck problems etc and can't turn their heads well, and we shouldn't take away the immersion and features etc, but pulling 9G and look straight to six is just not real. And this is something that limits in VR as one really needs to look at their six to see well. And it reminds from the reality, and as there is restriction, it adds immersion.

 

Perhaps you own some perfected high-end input devices and I will give you this from the heart. And maybe you can tell me, which hardware setup is yours for your highend the sim-experience ... so i can get some ideas. Thanks in advanced for this informations.

So long.....cya in flight sim :pilotfly:

 

As I said, I fly in VR only. All that I need is a joystick, throttle and pedals. And I wanted the controllers that are giving the options that most modules has, so example the joystick needs to have X count of hats, axis and buttons. Throttle should have the same.

This so that as much as possible of the real HOTAS can be set in the joystick and throttle in proper manner.

Example I have a MCG PRO. It has on top one 5-way hat and two mini-sticks and then three buttons. This is not a problem to make a A-10C or F-16C stick work, as I can set the left side mini-stick as 5-way hat. So I have TMS and DMS hats properly there. I could use that mini-stick as a TDC axis, but I don't as it belongs to throttle.

 

So in simple way, bind only the things to joystick that exist in stick, to throttle what exist only in throttle etc. And then everything else in the cockpit I use in the virtual cockpit, meaning I will take my hand off from HOTAS and I will need to move hand on that button, switch etc in that virtual cockpit to flip it.

 

So I am physically limited to operate the aircraft even when it is virtual cockpit. It means that I can not use my right hand that is on joystick, to operate gears lever as I can't reach it as easily. So I use my left hand as it is on the left side of the cockpit.

 

The same thing is with the now Hornet and LTD/R switch, I can not reach it with my left arm without making odd twist that affects my stick handling. So you learn that you need to release grip from the joystick and use your right hand to flip that switch.

 

And because this is VR, I don't need to look the switch where it is as I can move hand very near its location, and then simply glance while I activate it and then back to out.

 

Just like real pilots does, constantly looking outside, inside, outside, wingman, outside, inside, outside, wingman, And you repeat that process. When you need to operate something, they can do it by the touch, but they will after adjusting something glance the setting that they made it correctly etc if the indicator for that is elsewhere.

 

In the VR I can with about 1/3-1/2 change flip the LTD/R switch on without looking at it. But that is not good enough. And it is not "I did flip it or not", but it is "did I flip it, or something else, or nothing?". And at this moment that switch has some odd zone to activate it as it can be a difficult thing even when looking at it sometimes as it does not want to get activated.

 

Would it be easier to bind to a button on joystick now? Sure....

But it would be cheating as I wouldn't need to move my hand on that switch to activate it.

I could do it at any given time, middle of maneuvering, just before/after releasing weapon etc. I would just learn that "Press that unless LTD/R is blinking" kind thing.

 

And that limitation that requires to move hand, it adds immersion. And when it is in everything, it adds more immersion in overall experience to fly in VR than flying in VR and using mouse/keyboard or multibinded joystick.

 

It is just a another level where one learns that it is more fun to have the limitations that they would have in reality, than fly like there is none. Be it a 9G pull and head turning to check six like nothing, or flipping a one switch.

 

And this is so great thing in VR, that one doesn't need to build anything to get the realistic cockpit. As that is the job of the module makers.

 

 

The virtual hands are not yet greatly integrated to DCS.

We have the virtual gloves and not the 3D model of the hand and that is the #1 thing I am waiting for DCS to have and Rift S, a hand tracking from Oculus like they have in Quest.

 

One can already use various other methods like a Leap Motion

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=218484

 

But it needs work from ED side.

We get these things work at acceptable level, but they are just in early phases.

[Fri13]

Fri - I hope when you “die” in the simulation you never boot up again. In real life you only have one life and I hope you aren’t cheating death in game.

 

Sorry, you are late with your insults....

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4195013&postcount=1

[Guppy]

I'm seriously confused as to why people think this is an argument.

 

In Fri's world of cheating vs. realism that is a real argument. Do I think it is, no. But if you read everything Fri has stated then it becomes the reality of his position. [if you cannot do it in real life you are cheating in the game].

 

Sorry, you are late with your insults....

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php...13&postcount=1

 

Fri, two things. First, I did not make an insult. There is nothing insulting about this statement, "Fri - I hope when you “die” in the simulation you never boot up again. In real life you only have one life and I hope you aren’t cheating death in game."

 

Secondly, your suggestion is just a workaround around for death by implementing a system to make death have a penalty, but it's still not death and will continue to govern rash decisions. This is no different than someone binding a switch that is not a HOTAS command to their HOTAS as a way to make it a bit easier than having to reach for a mouse and flick a switch; VR or not. It's cheating by your definition as it's not what would actually happen; you'd be dead. This is what happens when you make an absolute argument, you paint yourself in a corner and that's what you're doing here.

 

If you believe people are cheating then please write ED a letter asking them to remove ability to bind custom mappings to a HOTAS.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Guppy

[JoeFirefox]

ahh.... now i understand your position - or not?.... or maybe in won´t do any effort to do this? IMO you have a problem with the VR-Solution in generally.... and please excuse me -> momentary it is not realistic enough for that what you want to use it -> and that is not the problem of ED.

If there ist no switch at exectly the same position, that VR makes it visible, then you put just a hole in the air - no physical feedback -> not realistic => Brain-Cheating. One solution for you -> build a pit 1:1 with "blind" Switches in the exact position that your VR makes it visible -> then your brain is no longer cheated and you get (IMO) the perfect illusion.

Good luck sir!

Thats all at this point from my position.

 

For me DCS is a game - not more, not less. I have fun with it - and for shure im not going to get to fly a real fighter, this is an illusion. In my real live, im very happy with my business and my family. And flightsims are my passion, my hobby - not more and not less.

 

So i wish you the very best on your way to the perfect, realistic VR-Simulation....maybe in 10 years there is a solution - or maybe you program by yourself "the best combat flight simulation ever". So long im flying the momentary best combat flight simulation -> DCS-World.... and im being very happy!!!! :pilotfly:

 

Over and out!

[Subferro]

Ok now that we’ve sufficiently derailed... back to the topic:

 

Do we know for sure what triggers the laser to shutoff? In autolase I think it makes sense for it to kill the laser ~5 seconds after TTI which seems to be about the case in game. For manual lase though I’m less convinced. Seems like then the cutoff should be based on either pilot input or if the laser is approaching its mask zone. Right now it still seems to operate on the ~5 seconds post TTI, which defeats some of the purpose of manual lazing

[oldcrusty]

Ok now that we’ve sufficiently derailed... back to the topic:

 

Do we know for sure what triggers the laser to shutoff? In autolase I think it makes sense for it to kill the laser ~5 seconds after TTI which seems to be about the case in game. For manual lase though I’m less convinced. Seems like then the cutoff should be based on either pilot input or if the laser is approaching its mask zone. Right now it still seems to operate on the ~5 seconds post TTI, which defeats some of the purpose of manual lazing

 

It would be nice if they posted the doc detailing this... just to squash the doubts ;)

[Fri13]

In Fri's world of cheating vs. realism that is a real argument. Do I think it is, no. But if you read everything Fri has stated then it becomes the reality of his position. [if you cannot do it in real life you are cheating in the game].

 

Wrong. Read again.

 

Fri, two things. First, I did not make an insult.

 

Yes you did.

 

There is nothing insulting about this statement, "Fri - I hope when you “die” in the simulation you never boot up again. In real life you only have one life and I hope you aren’t cheating death in game."

 

That is insulting as you are not talking about the game, but you are making illogical argument trying to counter a logical argument. So go back to reading.

 

Secondly, your suggestion is just a workaround around for death by implementing a system to make death have a penalty, but it's still not death and will continue to govern rash decisions.

 

First of all, you must understand what is "penalty" for your actions.

 

Lets say your new pilot that you just created has withstanding to G forces only a 5.5 G before it starts to blackout and at 6.5 G it will G-loc.

With a 25 hours flight time you would "upgrade" your pilot to "Experienced", withstanding to G-forces of 7.0 and you G-loc at 8 G.

With a 50 hours of flight time you are "Master" and would have withstanding limit to 7.5 G and G-loc at 9.5 G.

 

And not just that, but fresh pilot has a 1.0 adaptation for the G forces where it takes X seconds in X repeats before able to start pulling higher G's. With the Master it could be 2.5x and so much more faster and less repeats to be able for higher G's. And that would be your periodic time between online logins and total flight hours.

 

Now that is completely different situation for a penalty, than would be "You just lost all your flight hours and rank, please create a new character and restart your campaign" or "Please select a new aircraft from the slot and restart the mission".

 

Because you are directly connected to a real time invested to the pilot. Your real capabilities to fly in the simulator against other pilots. It would not matter what aircraft you fly as much as that by what virtual pilot you fly. So if you kill your virtual pilot you spent 75 hours to build for your ego only to challenge an enemy that you should have fleed if being smart, you suffer your penalty of the 75 hours and capability maneuver as hard as wanted.

So you are back in the flight school if lost all experienced pilots, against those who fly with more experienced pilots.

 

This is no different than someone binding a switch that is not a HOTAS command to their HOTAS as a way to make it a bit easier than having to reach for a mouse and flick a switch; VR or not.

 

It is a different thing. You just don't get it.

 

It's cheating by your definition

 

It is, read again. And it is not my definition, it is definition of the word of "cheating" by itself.

If you want to go for more philosophical then we can start discussing first that is thinking same thing as doing....

 

as it's not what would actually happen; you'd be dead. This is what happens when you make an absolute argument, you paint yourself in a corner and that's what you're doing here.

 

Again insult and fallacy.

 

If you believe people are cheating then please write ED a letter asking them to remove ability to bind custom mappings to a HOTAS.

 

Again fallacy.

[Fri13]

Do we know for sure what triggers the laser to shutoff? In autolase I think it makes sense for it to kill the laser ~5 seconds after TTI which seems to be about the case in game. For manual lase though I’m less convinced. Seems like then the cutoff should be based on either pilot input or if the laser is approaching its mask zone. Right now it still seems to operate on the ~5 seconds post TTI, which defeats some of the purpose of manual lazing

 

I have not found the switch in electronic circuitry at all. So ED must have somewhere a diagram that explains that feature there.

 

As now there are multiple digital safety switches and then these mechanical ones.

 

1) You can not fire laser with trigger unless you box the trigger box on TPOD DDI. So your hand on the grip can't fire any "harmful" lasers "on your own troops".

 

2) Automatic lazing doesn't happen unless you release a weapon. So you can keep pointing TPOD anywhere you want to but no laser is fired until your AUTO release mode finds acceptable parameters.

 

3) You can't launch a weapon if you have a Master Arm Off. So your automatic laser activation can't happen.

 

4) Your weapons are programmed for a specific laser code by the weapons crew on ground. You can't program your laser guided bombs, rockets or missiles to specific code in the cockpit. So you need to as well program your TPOD or JTAC programs theirs designator on the weapon to be launched (by you or third party)

 

So why is there a fourth safety system just for laser that mechanical switch on the right side of the cockpit is required to be flipped back On before any laser designation or laser marker and again after those?

 

It has as much logic as Master Arm would switch Off after each trigger/button press. As after all it is far more dangerous to shoot friendly or release/launch ordinance at friendlies than it is to damage their eyes with a about metre wide laser dot in designation mode.

 

If the switch is directly connected to a laser power circuitry so that laser wouldn't burn out, then it is badly designed if it heats up while not firing and must be turned Off between firing.

And again that can be completely electronic system with AUTO and TRGR modes that until signal from those is received no laser power is connected.

 

And your laser to reach its masked range would just block the beam for that while. Your weapon can't jump to target you. And last thing you would want is to designate target, accidentally / purposely mask yourself for a second or two and have laser turned Off. Now in horry you must move your right hand from stick (used to maneuver back to unmasked attitude) to enable laser back On and then activate manually firing from DDI and back to stick to start firing with trigger.

 

You just failed your delivery because automatic shutoff feature, instead just second or two masking.

Edited June 17, 2020 by Fri13

[Guppy]

Fri - there are reports of new pilots having more endurance than older pilots. You're just throwing an arbitrary rule/experience system in there. This is not an MMORPG.

 

Also regarding "Cheating". I'm not having a philosophical debate with you on what cheating is. I have already provided you the definition of cheating. You are applying elaborate personal rules on what "cheating" is to you and pushing that onto everyone else. IE: If you bind a non-HOTAS command to your HOTAS you are a cheater. Even though that is your personal philosophy of cheating.

 

I think you would have much more success with this argument if you said, "I [you] feel like I am cheating if I bind a non-HOTAS command to my HOTAS. I recognize this is allowed, but for me it does not feel like a genuine experience". Instead you are just throwing around "cheater" to everyone who doesnt fall into your definition. That is an absolute argument.

[TonyG]

It would be nice if they posted the doc detailing this... just to squash the doubts ;)

 

And miss this epic breakdown about what constitutes cheating in a video game? Nah, they’re probably eating popcorn and enjoying this.

[Burt]

If I remember wags video which I will watch it again here shortly but when you activate the laser after the Mav locks the target shouldn’t the trigger be held down?

[TonyG]

Once it launches, no need to hold the trigger. I just destroyed two targets with the MavE, works good. Slick system. Just gotta remember to turn the switch back on.

[MurrayCod]

There has been a lot of OT time spent at the keyboard discussing cheating in a video game that could have been spent simming. To each their own though.

[Fri13]

Fri - there are reports of new pilots having more endurance than older pilots. You're just throwing an arbitrary rule/experience system in there. This is not an MMORPG.

 

What you are now claiming is that a complete rookie with first solo flight has better G forces withstanding than a pilot with example 500 hours in acrobatics....

 

We are not talking about 25 years old pilot vs 50 years old pilot here.

 

And you are not following the discussion of LTD/R switch, as topic to bring the fear of death to game to avoid stupid air quake fooling and have reasons to know when it is time to simply escape and save your skin and airframe than try to make a amazing stunt in sake of glory.

 

Also regarding "Cheating". I'm not having a philosophical debate with you on what cheating is.

 

But you have. You wanted to bring it up. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4381068&postcount=27

 

If you don't even understand the word "cheating" and the philosophy behind it, then don't come argue against it.

 

I have already provided you the definition of cheating.

 

Yes, and I explained it to you what it really means as you didn't know.

 

You are applying elaborate personal rules on what "cheating" is to you and pushing that onto everyone else.

 

Completely false. I have from the start said that everyone can choose how much they want to be cheating. It can be either themselves to do something they are not capable, or others while trying to play with same rules.

 

You just do not understand that cheating doesn't define is it a tiny or big action, only is it acceptable or not.

And to show you the point that you would understand anything at all.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4389167&postcount=85

 

There is my suggestion for a "Guess what! Easy AAR!" topic about how to add a simplified easy air refueling capability.

 

Is it in my opinion a cheat? Totally.

Is it acceptable to be added to game? Completely!

 

Because I am not here to say others like you claim, that how they should play the game. Because you do not read and understand what others are saying, you simply can't even notice the big difference that one can discuss about things without having their own personal opinions in it, even to discuss about things that are countering their own opinions.

 

Like in that air refueling thread, I completely acknowledge that it is difficult task and it was difficult task to learn in the first time. But we are playing the game, and people need to have fun time. You have not noticed that is my point here all the time. And if that fun time requires to cheat, then so be it. But if you want realism, then you can't accept unrealistic. And more and more realistic approaches you want, less you can have unrealistic features, and cheats. And when it comes to group of people flying together, then cheating can become problematic. But it is rule of that group that decides what is acceptable in that moment.

There can be a group of players that accepts that one new member for server is allowed to have labels, easy radio, external views etc because he is a 9 year old kid among 20-30 year old ones. It doesn't matter then others that kid cheats as everyone is having fun. But if those same people would host a competitive with example 2000 dollar money prize, you bet that rules would be strict that everyone has the same capabilities (and for context so you understand, the rules would change depending is the prize a 20 dollars, 200 dollars or 20 000 dollars). In a public server for fun sake no one would really care if one use official cheats, but for a big money prize, there would be zero tolerance for cheating.

 

So why does I suggest such a feature that makes air refueling super easy at max setting and easier with minimum setting? Because it is not about me, it is not my opinion that because I wouldn't use it and I consider it cheat, that it wouldn't be allowed to be used by others as their hardware, skills or other factors limits them.

 

The problem here is that you have an attitude that everyone should be like you and share your opinion that cheating is not cheating unless it is just something dishonest against others. So you are excluding the dishonesty from yourself, cheating yourself that I tried to explain to you. But you do not accept that fact that you can cheat yourself just so you can feel good.

And you do not accept that fact that what I have told from the start, and even clarified to you:

 

"I completely acknowledge that most players do not have access to luxury items like VR, top joysticks or even pedals. But many fly with a usual and easily available products like Thrustmaster TM.16000 that has limited number of hats buttons and trigger functions in joystick, while throttle can be very good replication for many aircrafts by following Hornet layout."

 

IE: If you bind a non-HOTAS command to your HOTAS you are a cheater. Even though that is your personal philosophy of cheating.

 

You just do not read. You can cheat others, or you can cheat yourself. There is a difference.

Imagination is one of those skills to make you see things that ain't so. It doesn't make you cheater. I tried to explain it to you, but you do not comprehend the word cheat.

We can all imagine that we are flying, while we sit next to computer. Because we want to cheat ourselves from the reality. Flying DCS is not same thing as imagination. As one can close their eyes and imagine that they are in a cockpit and flying etc. They can become far more accurate and detailed in their imagination by using experiences with the DCS, so they know how to do some correct guns strafe etc.

 

But you are cheating yourself if you think that you are highly skilled fighter pilot.

And you are lying to others if you tell in the bar to unknown people your "war stories".

 

I think you would have much more success with this argument if you said, "I [you] feel like I am cheating if I bind a non-HOTAS command to my HOTAS. I recognize this is allowed, but for me it does not feel like a genuine experience".

 

Well well well....

 

If you just would read.....

Let's run back in a history:

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4378685&postcount=21

 

Instead you are just throwing around "cheater" to everyone who doesnt fall into your definition. That is an absolute argument.

 

I didn't make absolute argument. You did.

 

You have made absolute argument that I called others cheaters if they don't fly as I do.

 

While I specifically wrote in my reply:

 

The great thing about this being a game is that people are free to play it however they want.

 

Yes they are. I didn't say otherwise. You are as well free to cheat, free to get less realistic experiences, free to do what ever you want.

 

So we can see, that you do not understand even what word "You are free to do what ever you want".

 

But you now claim that I said:

"You are not free to do anything else than what I say or otherwise you are cheater".

 

You made absolute claim, and you can't even see that!

It looks that you got emotionally triggered that someone said word "cheating yourself while pretending to be something you are not" and it burst your bubble of experiences you have and now you feel that you are "lower than him" while no one said anything to you.

 

And you ignore to read anything like:

 

"But it has that downside as well, you are limited what you can do with your hands, as if you need to operate right side cockpit, you can't do it with left hand. So you learn the designs and operations better when you need to use proper hands around cockpit. So middle of the combat you learn things that can't be learn by using mouse or bindings. And it increases the immersion a lot when realizing that one needs to move hands and in high G maneuvers one wouldn't be doing it, or when the eyes are needed to be kept on the enemy."

 

 

"That is just cheating to set it to HOTAS or use even mouse on left hand etc.

Properly doing it is that you move your hand away from the stick and you physically move hand to the switch and flip it back to ARM."

 

Because the real pilots needs to use their hands in the cockpit. They need to physically move their fingers on the location of the switch to flip it. They can't bind things to HOTAS that ain't there. If they could, it would be realistic thing in simulator too.

 

You should now really carefully read what means such a phrase as:

 

"We have hardware limitations for the simulator. That can't be denied. That is the limitation but not the cheating as you can't do better. But if you could and you know it and yet you don't because you get the advantage (easiness etc) then you are cheating."

 

The world innovations are done by lazy people. As they want to get things done easier.

But if we have physical limitations, like flying DCS with a 3-button joystick from 80's

 

 

Then you are limited by hardware for functions that how one can play.

And why it is not cheating? Because:

 

"I completely acknowledge that most players do not have access to luxury items like VR, top joysticks or even pedals."

 

And if you just would connect the two dots between that and the above.... You should understand what does mean "Cheating yourself", as that and cheating others doesn't make other not cheating.

[Fri13]

If I remember wags video which I will watch it again here shortly but when you activate the laser after the Mav locks the target shouldn’t the trigger be held down?

 

No need. You just release the Maverick after designation and auto-lazing happens if you had that LTD/R switch On.

 

The Maverick seeker sleeves to the designation position, and you can launch the missile without lazing target. So the weapons firing system checks that once the maverick launches, the laser is ready to activate.

 

So all you need to do after maverick launch is to maintain the proper laser direction (should be lazing behind the missile, not from sideways etc) as almost all laser energy reflects back from target toward the laser emitter, and very little to any other direction.

[Fri13]

There has been a lot of OT time spent at the keyboard discussing cheating in a video game that could have been spent simming. To each their own though.

 

If you like to be simming in a rain while you are sitting in a tent in a forest while waiting weather to clear out.....

 

In these days of mobile devices and wireless internet connections, we can use technology somewhere else than front of the PC in a "gaming cave".

 

Each to their own.....