Engine sound? Or the lack of?

[Shimmergloom667]

@uist1 Yes so!! .. listen what I am saying then.

 

I do, and unlike btd you don't deliver anything credible that support your claim.

[theGozr]

Seriously ! LOL

 

Here a quick example found on youtube..

 

and this is when we started the new engine on the last Yak9UM back in 2004..

 

and more

 

When you have the helmet on you can feel and ear so well the Harley style rumble.. that those big radial have.

I flew Stagerrwing radial engine and it's the same.. what you ear in the Sim is a external mic

 

IL2 got it better on some sens.. a mix of both sound would be perfect.

 

Now if you do not believe this is fine but it is common sens and honestly .. Don't care

I forgot to not argue , My mistake. and I can understand what you believe as well.

 

Now if at list you drove a motorcycle with an helmet and ear plugs you will understand a better.. very easy to test this

Edited June 9, 2020 by theGozr

[btd]

Dear theGozr,

I'm sure someone will want to make a sound mode based on YouTube. And you will be happy using it. We cannot afford it, having our own audio recordings.

Of course, something always needs to be corrected and improved, but not on the basis of YouTube, if there is a recording from professional equipment. If we didn’t have these sound recordings - perhaps the sound would be exactly the way you want :)

 

Please do not compare the sound of the P47 with the Yak9 and the like. They have a completely different sound. Almost all of P47 exhaust is usually going directly into the turbosuperchargers. Not in the face of the pilot, like in Yak9

[grafspee]

I noticed another issue with sound, i was taking off in bf 109 while my engine was doing 2600 1.4 ata p-47 flew next to me about 200 m-300 m and this p-47 was louder then my engine, i think something is off here.

[Art-J]

Gozr, even though just like you I wouldn't mind sounds being a bit more "beefy", the fact is BTD posted in-cockpit recording of the P-47 they took at Duxford using professional equipment, while you posted Go-Pro recordings which are obviously much less useful for sample research (although that Harley-style bass rumble note is easy to recognize in both in my opinion). Just sayin'.

[theGozr]

Well those are a quick search on youtube to demonstrate what is missing...

Yak9 is me.

It's personal experiences and it's missing what the actual pilot is experiencing.. Now the Developer should listen.. Recognize .. Understand..

There are ways to mix out sonds with the same recording. Low pass..

Anyway.. Well I said my 2c .. Take it in consideration

[Ala13_ManOWar]

It's personal experiences and it's missing what the actual pilot is experiencing.. Now the Developer should listen.. Recognize .. Understand..

Funny you say so while ED's owner is also also a P-47 pilot and owner of one in the recent past :lol:.

 

 

S!

[uist1]

Thank you btd, for getting this module to sound as great and as realistic as it does!

[theGozr]

Ala13_ManOWar So let talk here.. with the owner. Assuming he can fly on the sim as well.

 

A real good talk is possible and positive

[theGozr]

Don't forget we want all the same .. the best.

[SMH]

Funny you say so while ED's owner is also also a P-47 pilot and owner of one in the recent past :lol:.

 

 

S!

 

Apparently his had no turbo. So much for experience! I wonder what household appliance they sampled for the turbo sound.

[Snapage]

Apparently his had no turbo. So much for experience! I wonder what household appliance they sampled for the turbo sound.

 

I don't know about you but I think having a real P47D to eleven without turbo would give me a pretty good idea of how it sounds and feels. At low alt anyway.

 

I'm sure they could have got some sounds from a P47D that has it's turbo if there is one. But I doubt they are going to take it up to 30000 feet so you get nice sound quality for a game.

 

Its no surprise if they needed to supplement the sound effects with sounds from other sources. I'm sure ED did a decent job. It sounds pretty good.

 

It's kind of cool how they got the detail of the reletively quiet in cockpit engine sound due to the turbocharger exhaust behind the pilot.

[NeilWillis]

Yes. My point exactly. If something is wrong with it, now it is time to tell ED.

 

Of course you should. They’d never have thought “we need the thing to make the right noises” without your invaluable input!

 

Or maybe, just maybe ED have done this whole aeroplane thing before. I wonder who is correct?

[Hoffster]

A class 205 thumper turbo recording would be great, turbo size looks similar :lol:

[SMH]

Almost all of P47 exhaust is usually going directly into the turbosuperchargers. Not in the face of the pilot, like in Yak9

 

Oh, good news! You found a P-47 with a functioning turbocharger to record then? Which one?

 

And that turbocharger is fully engaged at startup with the waste gates closed. Who knew?

 

So educational, this product!

[Art-J]

Well, indeed, I'd hazard guess there aren't any restored T-bolts with functional turbo flying anywhere in the world (maybe FHC one has it, as it seems to be the only one that spits smoke from turbo exhaust on all startup videos, or maybe it only has functional ducting...), in this case we're discussing however, it doesn't matter. With a manifold, which also blows into stacks located below wing, it's obviously going ot be more quiet when heard from cockpit than any V-12 with short stacks blowing almost on the windscreen line. I think that's what BTD meant and that's what his recording confirms.

[theGozr]

Head in cockpit.. head out.. with helmet.. in front.. on back.. and props and engine.. all separate effects sounds. need to be re-balanced .

Tonight i will re listen of the sounds with a high end head set. Look at it a second time.

 

They are reach sounds but the position and the EQ is not adjusted imo. for now..

[ArcLite]

Granted, I believe the sounds need some love, but here’s another video that showcases the Jug next to a lot of our other favorites from the sim. Listen to the 109s, Spitfire, Mustang, etc. and then the P-47 at 18:06. Totally different sound profile from the others. And yes, I’m aware of the obvious V-12 vs radial, but listen even to the difference relative to the 190. Interesting if nothing else, and man, all that eargasm!

 

Edited June 11, 2020 by ArcLite

[kubanloewe]

hm, i only use headphone and it sounds great for me; much better than in IL2 !

The 190A8 on the other hand sounds reallly shit; like in real :-)

[Razorback51]

Just for the record, of the 11 P-47's currently flying in the world, 4 of them have working turbochargers. Those being:

- P-47D-28-RA "Dottie Mae" 42-29150 (N47DM) owned/operated by Allied Fighters

- P-47D-40-RA "Hun Hunter XVI" 44-90460 (N9246B) owned/operated by Neal Melton

- P-47D-40-RA "78th FG" 45-49385 (N47DF) owned/operated by Westpac Restorations

- P-47D-40-RA "Tallahassee Lassie" 45-49406 (N7159Z) owned/operated by the Flying Heritage & Combat Armor Museum

 

The rest of those flying have creative methods of either rerouting the exhaust and/or bypassing the turbo.

 

All of the Youtube cockpit videos that have been shown around the forum were filmed inside the restored P-47D-40-NA "Wicked Wabbit" (44-90438/N647D), which differs from an original stock P-47D. It doesn't have a functioning turbocharger and instead has a 2-speed mechanical supercharger. The exhaust on that one is piped back to/through a replica turbocharger, serving simply as an exhaust nozzle. Without the turbocharger system in-place, it instead has a storage compartment built into the rear fuselage, accessed through replica intercooler shutters that act as doors that can be swung open. It, along with some others flying today, are more like sports-plane versions of the P-47, lighter and faster than their more authentic/complete counterparts. You can see in the videos of "Wicked Wabbit" that it also has an electric primer added to make starting the aircraft easier, with the original manual Parker primer pump fitted just for looks.

 

From those that have flown them with the working turbos, they say the whine from the turbo gets pretty loud by 10,000 RPM. They also notoriously have hot cockpits. One of the pilots that used to fly the CAF P-47N, which also had a working turbo, says that the cockpit would reach 130ºF.

Edited June 12, 2020 by Razorback51

[Art-J]

^ That's very interesting info, thanks.

[SMH]

The rest of those flying have creative methods of either rerouting the exhaust and/or bypassing the turbo.

 

All that should need to be done is locking the waste gates open and removing their actuators. A P-47 normally bypasses exhaust from the turbo when the Boost lever is not engaged. This is why we shouldn't be hearing backfires coming from the rear during startup.

[Calinho]

You can check the startup sound on this video, very good sound quality

 

At 0:11 it's possible to hear the "energize"

 

Edited June 14, 2020 by Calinho

[SMH]

You can check the startup sound on this video, very good sound quality

 

At 0:11 it's possible to hear the "energize"

 

 

Easy to hear. And note that the exhaust is coming out of the waste gates at the front, not the turbocharger in the rear. This would be true during startup regardless of whether the turbo is operational or not. (I hear backfiring coming from behind the cockpit at all times.)

[Razorback51]

On the four P-47's flying today with working turbos ("Dottie Mae" (N47DM), "Hun Hunter XVI" (N9246B), 45-49385 (N47DF) and "Tallahassee Lassie" (N7159Z)), you can find videos of them starting up and the exhaust comes out both the waste-gates and the turbo.

 

Most of the P-47's flying today completely bypass the turbocharger/intercooler section by having custom-made piping running directly from the chin air intake to the carburetor, as is the case on P-47D "Nellie B" (G-THUN), Planes of Fame's P-47G (N3395G), P-47G "Snafu" (N47FG), P-47D "Tarheel Hal" (N4747P) and P-47D "Wicked Wabbit" (N647D). Most of these also have the exhaust directly dumped out the front via custom exhaust stacks in-place of the waste-gates.

 

In the case of P-47D "Nellie B" (G-THUN), the only P-47 flying outside of the US, the waste-gates are sealed shut and the exhaust is directly routed back to the rear fuselage where two big round ports were cut out of the sheet-metal, just forward of the turbo hood, and dumped downward through two short stacks.

 

In the case of John Schofner's P-47D "Wicked Wabbit" (N647D), they didn't want the exhaust exiting out the front as it would cause the aircraft to lose some of the distinct sound of a stock P-47, so the exhaust is directly piped back to/through a replica turbocharger serving simply as an exhaust nozzle. (Among the other modifications done to that aircraft which I've already mentioned in my previous post, because it has a non-stock 2-speed supercharger at the back-end of its R-2800, the size of the oil tank also had to be reduced and an additional oil tank added in the rear fuselage.)

 

In the case of the restored P-47D "Hairless Joe" (N47DA), which also bypasses the turbo, it has a custom-made plenum in the aft fuselage with air-filters and a suction-operated alternate air source. Air flows back through the big central air intake from the chin, enters the plenum in the rear fuselage and makes a U-turn. At the top of the plenum are the two ducts which used to be mounted on the intercooler outlet. From that point the induction air flows forward through the original twin pressure pipes on either side of the cockpit to the carburetor. The exhaust is dumped out the front through custom-made exhaust stacks where the waste-gates used to be.

 

The C-series turbocharger (the type fitted to the P-47) tends to suffer from hydrogen embrittlement around the nozzle box/hot section after prolong operation, resulting in cracking. The only way they can be repaired is through an annealing process. From what I've heard from someone who restored and repaired several functioning turbochargers for the few P-47's flying today with them, welding them is very difficult and usually doesn't hold for long. All of the owners that operate P-47's with working turbos have at least one extra turbo on hand. They also require close inspection after each flight.

Edited June 14, 2020 by Razorback51