SD-10 ineffective (?)

[nicktune1219]

In multiplayer servers I have been toying around with the jf-17 but it seems that every time im able to get a shot off within the "shoot" queue, the sd-10 always seems to miss the plane no matter what. I dont have tacview so im not exactly sure whats going on, but something seems very awry here. The 120 seems to be working just fine, so im not sure if this is an issue of the warhead not going off or if it is an issue of the missile completely going off course. If anyone could give me insight as to why this may be the case, id appreciate hearing it.

[AeriaGloria]

Would really need track or tacview. There are many ways to defeat a missile, probably chaff and notching or kinectically out running it

[Blinky.ben]

In multiplayer servers I have been toying around with the jf-17 but it seems that every time im able to get a shot off within the "shoot" queue, the sd-10 always seems to miss the plane no matter what. I dont have tacview so im not exactly sure whats going on, but something seems very awry here. The 120 seems to be working just fine, so im not sure if this is an issue of the warhead not going off or if it is an issue of the missile completely going off course. If anyone could give me insight as to why this may be the case, id appreciate hearing it.

 

How interesting I saw you today on the Growling serve asking this question. I was doing Air to ground so didn’t fire the SD-10 but I did end up watching you to see how the missile acted. Didn’t see you fire one tho

 

I know this answered nothing.

Edited July 1, 2020 by Blinky.ben

[AnarchyZG]

I'll record/decode some tracks on DDCS when I get some time to fly.

From my experience it is rather poor as of lately with very low probability of hitting the target even under favorable launch parameters.

 

I do not know if it can be explained by only kinematic nerf.

[dimitrischal]

I don’t have any tracks either but suspect this is due to the lowered chaff rejection from the last patch. Personally I think such high susceptibility to chaff is total bs for such a modern weapon.

[AeriaGloria]

Lowered? The chaff resistance was increased. It went from .14 to .08, LUA CCM number is amount of radians that it accepts chaff, so that’s like from 8 degrees chaff acceptance window to 4.5 degrees, AMRAAM C is .02, or only slightly more then 2 degrees

[dundun92]

Yea notching SD-10s is noticeably harder than before. The bandit likely just outran the missile. Also I dont fly the JF-17 so I could be wrong, but based on the clips ive seen it appears that the WCS's estimation of the no escape zone is actually outside the abort range, so he could very easily outrun it.

Also again, just from flying against them, I havent noticed them to be any easier to evade. If anything, theyre harder to evade due to the better chaff resistence.

[Tango3B]

Lowered? The chaff resistance was increased. It went from .14 to .08, LUA CCM number is amount of radians that it accepts chaff, so that’s like from 8 degrees chaff acceptance window to 4.5 degrees, AMRAAM C is .02, or only slightly more then 2 degrees

 

 

Exactly! Thank you for clarifying that here.

Concerning nicktune1219´s statement we can safely say that chaff is not the problem. It is the ground clutter, though when the missile was lofted and dives for a much lower target or when other severe lookdown situations exist (don´t know about SD-10´s RL capabilities in that respect, though). And that irritates some DCS Jeff drivers as the SD-10 used to excel in that category not too long ago.

And then there is the DCS online community. It is rather small compared to other online games. Sure, you will encounter the occasional "noob" on the popular servers but most of the guys flying there are literally "living" there and are "battle hardened". They fly there nearly every day. These guys are very aware of every working BVR tactic in DCS. You can safely assume these guys will evade many of your missile shots - regardless of the missile used. You need to get your own BVR tactics right to have success online. Yesterday I flew on Growling Sidewinder´s server and scored 9 kills and no losses before I left. I killed six aircraft with SD-10s and three with PL-5EIIs. Statistically, I used three SD-10s for every kill with that missile although I even got a rare double kill. What can I say. I can´t complain. These guys simply knew their business so everything is good. But on the other hand I went up against so many AIM-120s (mostly Cs I suspect) and was able to defeat them so reliable that many a Hornet or Eagle driver might have been in rage. But this is all due to tactics. Get them right and you will get kills or avoid being killed.

For the moment we have to deal with the SD-10 as it is. There will be a time when the SD-10 is able to profit from the new DCS missile API that the AMRAAM uses but until then it is all about tactics. Can´t stress that enough.

[Shively]

We really need to see some tracks/videos of what's going on. There's too many variables at play here.

 

You claim you're unable to hit anything with the SD-10, but I just had a flight on DDCS where I shot 4 of them, and each one scored a kill. What's the aspect of the enemy when you're shooting? If they're running away, you're probably better off not shooting, even if you have the "shoot" cue. Obviously this may change depending on the difference in airspeed between yourself and your target, but you generally should not expect a missile shot at-range toward your enemy's six to hit if they're running away at a high speed.