HARM weak?

[JCae2798]

New to AC, but as i practice SEAD using 88C's i'm noticing either they don't hit directly on target or their impact is weak. Takes two missiles to destroy S6 tanks. Is this normal behavior? Did a quick search but dont see anyone complaining about this...

[Emmy]

AGM-88s don’t home on vehicles. They home on radar signals so they will almost always “go high” in relation to the vehicle chassis. Usually, they will appear to air burst over the given radar and you hope they kill the radar and thereby render that particular air defense system irrelevant.

 

They are not a guaranteed “one shot .. one kill” weapon though by any means. They are not Anti-SAM “Mavericks”

[JCae2798]

Ah thanks, that explains a lot and what i've been seeing as far as visually. I'll need to test search atennas better to see that i guess.

 

 

I was going to add this was in TOO mode where i was about 15nm out. Just kept testing now and if i get a lot closer at top speed it does seem to have a better chance of a one shot kill.

 

 

Again thanks for the info on how it works, super helpful

[gonzman]

My limited experience so far was my HARM smashing pretty nicely into a radar array and did no damage, I was a little confused thought maybe they had the invincible tag on for the mission but my friend flying the SU-25T managed to lay waste to them easily with their anti-radar missiles, I pretty much gave up at that point, also found them to be fairly inaccurate anyway, rather underwhelming.

[JCae2798]

Coming from the Jeff i felt the same way. Now understanding better how they work and that they target the air radar rather than the vehicle it does seem to do the trick. It's just understanding the concept. But even still I know what you mean when things seemed so much easier and more effective with the Jeff or other similar approaches...

[Swift.]

If the Jeff's ARMs are targeting the chassis rather than the emitter then they are bugged. ARMs by their nature target radiation sources, they can't magically tell where the actual vehicle is.

 

This issue with HARMs in DCS is that the damage modelling doesnt account for things like shrapnel shredding a radar.

[Preendog]

As consolation, some vehicles become unable to fire if they are below 50% health. Haven't tested, but Gepard is one.

 

E. Thx Moafuleum, didn't know that.

Edited July 3, 2020 by Preendog

[Moafuleum]

You have to set a trigger in the mission editior manually. I dont know exactly how to do it but something like

If health_radar < 50% then disable

 

Of course this is cumbersome can oy be done on one's own missions so no option in the long term

[G.J.S]

As Emmy has intimated, the -88 HARM will target the transmitter, and will detonate when it is close enough, igniting the warhead which as a form of shrapnel, spews tungsten cubes in all directions to shred the emitter (or at least they used to be :smilewink: ).

[Tango3B]

AGM-88s don’t home on vehicles. They home on radar signals so they will almost always “go high” in relation to the vehicle chassis. Usually, they will appear to air burst over the given radar and you hope they kill the radar and thereby render that particular air defense system irrelevant.

 

They are not a guaranteed “one shot .. one kill” weapon though by any means. They are not Anti-SAM “Mavericks”

 

 

Exactly. AGM-88A-C HARMs can only home in on radar signals emitted by whatever airdefense system. If there is no radar emission by the targeted system anymore the missile will most likely miss. Fortunately, the "IADS system" in DCS is not that smart meaning it won't use many of those nasty RL tactics that can give SEAD/DEAD crews a really unpleasant surprise.

 

Targeting capabilities changed with the introduction of the AGM-88D, however. The D model added a GPS reciever to the missile so that it can hit the last known position of the target if the radar signal is lost. The most recent AGM-88E even got a millimetre wave radar installed in addition to the GPS reciever so that it can now target highly mobile air defense vehicles directly. This is a game changer but this capability exists with the AGM-88E, only.

 

Therefore, the best tactic when using AGM-88A-C is to use a flight that has different weapon loadouts. Think of using HARMs combined with intelligent cluster munitions, AGM-65s and/or JDAM. This tactic applies to DCS, also.