Anyone planning on getting the 3090 for VR?

[dawgie79]

I disagree, DCS performance in VR (especially multiplayer) is... poor. Even if you have a 2080ti you can struggle to maintain 45fps if you want to enjoy the "bells and whistles" such as using 2x MSAA to eliminate shimmer, shadows, whatever.

 

Running FPS VR to chart the distribution of GPU & CPU frametimes will typically show the GPU is struggling to keep up with the CPU, until you start throwing in some crazy mission specific events (lots of units, GRAD spam, etc).

 

So yes I would expect a 3090 would significantly reduce GPU frametimes, and might even get them in line with the ideal 11.1 m/s for 90hz in something like the flight over tibilsi test.

 

9 out of 10 times software is the problem. Hardware nowadays is unbelievably powerful.

 

It's just a combination of tuning the OS, and optimization of the software. First one can be influenced, second one depends on the developer of said software.

 

With regards to tuning your OS, there are a lot of things one can do with Windows to make it run faster, besides the usual tips you can find on forums like these. Granted you have to do some research because you can't just shut down random Windows services or indexing routines and such, but when you dedicate some time investigating and testing there's a whole world to be gained.

 

Optimizing the software, since ED is already working on Vulkan I wouldn't expect much optimizations within the current engine. Sure, if there will be some optimizations announced within the current engine, that's good but not a garantee it benefits every system because every system is differently configured, regardless of hardware used.

 

In my experience, when people say they've tuned their OS that just means 'no, not beyond the standard practices'. To be clear, I don't say this to blame anyone because as I said, you need to do some research.

 

Hardware upgrades should be last on anyone's list. Usually it's the other way around. Because people are people. ;)

Edited September 3, 2020 by dawgie79

[Icebeat]

:thumbup:

I share your concern about CPU, Stuart.

 

Lots of people look at the overall fpsVR CPU usage and think, I’m ok here. However, looking at the individual core readings in fpsVR tells a very different story.

 

I’ve got a 10900K, and still, under certain circumstances, I see frames going below 45 even though GPU is less than 20ms and the overall CPU is in the teens as well. This is because a single core is being stressed at 100%.

 

Most of the time, however, I am GPU bound, so the 3090 should fix that. But, it’s not going to be until we get Vulkan that the CPU issue will be resolved.

 

Roll on 2021!

 

+1, DCS needs to fix their CPU's problems first or the bump from 2080ti to 3090 is going to be marginal.

[Icebeat]

To me the question is if there is a real difference in DCS VR between the 3080 an 90.

Im planning on a Upgrade, since i currently have a GTX 1070 both cards are a huge step forward anyways. Not just the GPU thats gonna be a complete system.

 

But there has to be a good impact on VR Performance for me to spend 700€ extra on the Card.

Currently i thought about the 3080 and spend those 700 to get an Reverb G2.

 

+1.

[speed-of-heat]

9 out of 10 times software is the problem. Hardware nowadays is unbelievably powerful.

 

It's just a combination of tuning the OS, and optimization of the software. First one can be influenced, second one depends on the developer of said software.

 

With regards to tuning your OS, there are a lot of things one can do with Windows to make it run faster, besides the usual tips you can find on forums like these. Granted you have to do some research because you can't just shut down random Windows services or indexing routines and such, but when you dedicate some time investigating and testing there's a whole world to be gained.

 

Optimizing the software, since ED is already working on Vulkan I wouldn't expect much optimizations within the current engine. Sure, if there will be some optimizations announced within the current engine, that's good but not a garantee it benefits every system because every system is differently configured, regardless of hardware used.

 

In my experience, when people say they've tuned their OS that just means 'no, not beyond the standard practices'. To be clear, I don't say this to blame anyone because as I said, you need to do some research.

 

Hardware upgrades should be last on anyone's list. Usually it's the other way around. Because people are people. ;)

curious which VR headset do you run?

[dawgie79]

curious which VR headset do you run?

 

Right now a CV1, Reverb G2 in preorder. Running on a GTX1080 and have no problems regarding fps. Runs on high settings, MSAA 2x, pixel density 1.3, 50-55ish fps on average.

[speed-of-heat]

whilst there are a slew of O/S config/Steam/ background process problems in the world of DCS perf, and that should all be done first...

 

Even then on a clean box (and i mean clean) you wont get a regular 90FPS on the super carrier on deck with shadow and crew etc... even with a 2080TI if you are drive a Reverb or another high resolution headset.

 

I get about 50-60 FPS with my 1080ti which i run with motion smoothing/Vector that gives me a very smooth 45FPS in game practically...

 

on those same setting i get over 144fps in game doing the same thing ... there is a massive overhead in VR.

 

Tbh i think a 3080 will solve it, assuming the rasterization numbers are accurate 160-190% in other games translates to similar in DCS. A 3090 should crush it and enable you to turn on eye candy

[dawgie79]

Of course you wouldn't get 90fps on a clean (you mean a fresh installation of the OS?) box. Like I said, the OS is one thing, the software you use another, hardware the last.

 

ED already stated a few times there's a lot (a LOT!) of legacy code. That's the problem with all (good) simulators (wether it's racing of flying or whatever), a simulator houses a lot of different technologies, real world data, often using an in-house developed engine, which get upgraded in due time, in steps. Rewriting a sim every few years in order to reach maximum optimization in all circumstances is just not feasable for most of those companies.

 

If what people in here claim is true, we would see significant leaps in fps after every new GPU/CPU iteration release. And we don't, we can read it everywhere, the complaining. Think why that is. ;)

 

If one's aim with a 3090 is to solve all fps-related problems one has with a 2080ti, I think they'll be dissapointed.

 

But like I said. People are people and they are not rational, but rather emotional. That's why marketing works. People are easy to manipulate, unfortunately. They're expecting miracles. :)

Edited September 3, 2020 by dawgie79

[speed-of-heat]

no i mean cleaned and optimized ...

[dawgie79]

Then still no. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. Determining what that link is in one's case, is the tricky part. You can only rule out. And if you have a 2080ti you can be pretty sure your bottleneck is not that card.

 

But hey, you don't have to take my word for it though. It's just not the first time I've tried to explain this to people. They should do what they want, buy what they want, etc, who am I to judge? :) Just don't be surprised if it brings you no miracles in performance.

 

Because what you've said in your previous response was the same kind of response I got when the 2080ti was released. And people still complain. Go figure. ;)

[zcaa0g]

3 slots is a deal killer since I use all of my slots so have to go the 3080 route. Anyway, outside of 8K, by the time the 3090 will truly matter, it will be time for the 4080 which will outpace the 3090. Now if they could get the 4090 down to 2 slots...but with that GPU and an insane number of memory chips, that will be tough in terms of keeping it cool.

[FoxTwo]

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-3090-rtx-3080-and-rtx-3070-custom-model-pricing-in-uk

 

1590 GBP for the Strix OC comes or about 2100 USD.

Heck even 1399 GBP 3090 list price is pushing 1850 USD.

 

That's a spicy meat-a-ball.

 

I think the 3080 is the real sweet spot for cost to performance. Judging by the numbers it's still a decent upgrade over the 2080ti.

[kevman]

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-3090-rtx-3080-and-rtx-3070-custom-model-pricing-in-uk

 

1590 GBP for the Strix OC comes or about 2100 USD.

Heck even 1399 GBP 3090 list price is pushing 1850 USD.

 

That's a spicy meat-a-ball.

 

I think the 3080 is the real sweet spot for cost to performance. Judging by the numbers it's still a decent upgrade over the 2080ti.

 

In the UK we have been at ~ 1$ - 1£ on electronic goods for so long now. We also pay 17.5% tax so are used to these high prices.

[Delareon]

Then still no. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. Determining what that link is in one's case, is the tricky part. You can only rule out. And if you have a 2080ti you can be pretty sure your bottleneck is not that card.

 

But hey, you don't have to take my word for it though. It's just not the first time I've tried to explain this to people. They should do what they want, buy what they want, etc, who am I to judge? :) Just don't be surprised if it brings you no miracles in performance.

 

Because what you've said in your previous response was the same kind of response I got when the 2080ti was released. And people still complain. Go figure. ;)

 

 

Ok then plz enlighten us with your stroke of genious super secret optimizations, nobody knows about, which leads us to performance beyond imagination even with my GTX 1070 on a old Rig.

[imacken]

In the UK we have been at ~ 1$ - 1£ on electronic goods for so long now. We also pay 17.5% tax so are used to these high prices.

 

17.5%??

[speed-of-heat]

:) well it used to be 17.5% just 9 years ago :)

[imacken]

Exactly!

[imacken]

On a side note, I've never fully understood why 3rd party cards are so expensive. From what I can see, the main difference is in the core speed specified. But, the same thing can easily be achieved through MSI Afterburner.

I guess what I'm saying is why would you pay £300 more for a card when you can achieve the same effect for free? Is it because the factory overclocked core speed can be pushed even harder by AB?

[verana_ss]

Right now a CV1, Reverb G2 in preorder. Running on a GTX1080 and have no problems regarding fps. Runs on high settings, MSAA 2x, pixel density 1.3, 50-55ish fps on average.

 

juts curious Reverb native res is not enough?

[speed-of-heat]

for EVGA its the three year warrantee (in a lot of cases they will send you a replacement card, for a nominal fee which is returned when you ship them back your card); that has a 90 day upgrade option e.g. if they launch another card inside 90 days from you purchase you can get a new card by returning the "old "one and the "evaluated difference"...

 

if for example I absolutely had to buy a card in the last month or so, i would have bought the 2080ti and then "upgraded" it when the 30x series was announced

 

it's not free, you pay for it in the card ...

[imacken]

juts curious Reverb native res is not enough?

 

A matter of opinion, but in my view, no it's not. I run at 200% SteamVR SS. Cockpit clarity is hugely improved, if your hardware can take it.

[imacken]

for EVGA its the three year warrantee (in a lot of cases they will send you a replacement card, for a nominal fee which is returned when you ship them back your card); that has a 90 day upgrade option e.g. if they launch another card inside 90 days from you purchase you can get a new card by returning the "old "one and the "evaluated difference"...

 

if for example I absolutely had to buy a card in the last month or so, i would have bought the 2080ti and then "upgraded" it when the 30x series was announced

 

it's not free, you pay for it in the card ...

 

Fair enough. Other cards, like my Palit, have 2 year warranties, and from my perspective, that is more than enough. Don't think I've ever held on to a card that long!

[speed-of-heat]

Fair enough. Other cards, like my Palit, have 2 year warranties, and from my perspective, that is more than enough. Don't think I've ever held on to a card that long!

 

:megalol: you are speaking to the man with a 1080ti :)

[Fri13]

A badly optimized game can easily eat 100% of anything you throw at it, but it will work at wide variation of hardware. A well designed and optimized game can only require 10th of the resources but will only work in specific hardware setups.

 

Like compare Unreal 5 engine to what is out there for few years back and there is huge difference in what the game engine does.

[dawgie79]

Ok then plz enlighten us with your stroke of genious super secret optimizations, nobody knows about, which leads us to performance beyond imagination even with my GTX 1070 on a old Rig.

 

Not what I said. At all.

[JoeyJoJoJunior]

It seems to be 1gb less than you have.. I have 11 I'm nearly always at 10, when I had 8 I was nearly always at 7

 

Unused memory is wasted memory. You'll see the same if you pay attention to Windows memory and usage and go from 16GB to 32GB. With the same usage pattern, you will see a rise in memory usage because the OS will simply keep things around in memory longer. When we have maps that take 20+ GB, you can see how the theoretical limit for how much ram you "need" is very high if you never want to swap things in and out of memory.