What is the best VR Headset for DCS now (autumn 2020)???

[Hoirtel]

Anyone got any opinions on the Vavle Index? A friend of mine who is much more clued up on this stuff reckons it's the best option due to FOV and head-tracking which is considerably more precise than the HP Reverb.

 

Tbh it's still a tough decision for me here. I mean I really need both - high res (little screen effect)/ good image quality and something that will run smooth enough to think it's real life. As soon as I have fps drops swiveling my head left and right in a dogfight, that will totally defeat the purpose of having VR in the first place.

 

And if you can't read gauges without leaning in close to them or can't see aircraft and need labels on then that I'm sorry to say is just going to kill the experience for me. This new G2 does look like it will probably not have this issue though so it's just a question of whether the head tracking is good enough and if I can run DCS at least with low shadows and high textures and still get a smooth image... hmmm...

 

Personally I think the valve index is too expensive. Yes the tracking is supposed to be better but this is mostly tracking of the hand controllers, which you may well not use, or just use directly infront of you anyway which won't make a difference. The lighthouse tracking of the headset really makes no difference in a sit down sim scenario. The oculus rift s was one of the first to do inside out tracking and its still really good. Its the one thing that I have never, ever had a issue with.

 

Lots of headsets now you can read gauges easily. More resolution helps so gauge reading should be better on the g2 than the index. MRTV on youtube compare exactly this between these headsets in DCS. Check it out.

 

My limit on a 1.5 SS rift s is that I find the altitude QNH value on the hornet's backup alt meter difficult to read without leaning in. That is pretty small and not a show stopper. I can read all the info on all three MFDs without a problem.

 

FPS slows down the most on the ground at airfields with lows of AI and statics. Dogfighting is usually a time for very good performance.

[Thinder]

Having tried both Index and Reverb the latter has noticeably better clarity for reading instruments and spotting, though it has a smaller sweet spot so you tend to move your head rather than your eyes more. I had no issue with this. For me the slightly larger FOV of the Index was a nice to have. I do prefer the audio of the Index.

 

Head tracking was the same for both although it is possible to get poor tracking with the Reverb in poor light. In my experience the Reverb tracking either works flawlessly or is not working well at all and is generally easily fixable. There is no aspect where the index is smoother once the Reverb is set up right.

 

The Reverb G2 adds the Index audio and addresses the sweet spot issue and reportedly adds even better clarity with its new lenses so for me for DCS is the best option, so I have one pre-ordered!

 

Thanks, Baldrick33!

 

I had a formation and good experience as photographer previous to go to CGI and I can bring some light on the issue of FoV.

 

I was taught that our field of view (males, females have a slightly wider one for some reasons*) was <> equal to that of a 50mm lens.

 

Passed this, you're talking visual field of attention* where you detect an object on motion or contrast but not in focus.

 

 

 

 

 

 

So there is a degree of manufacturers policies and technico-commercial interest behind the PoV issue, on one you can move your eyes through a wider FoV, on the other you might detect the target earlier thanks to a better lens clarity and sharpness.

 

Note that those figures can variate from an individual to another, your own eyesight will play a role, but I believe that with most recent head sets, FoV is adequate. G2's field of view is 98/114 degrees.

 

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Edited October 16, 2020 by Thinder

[Fri13]

I have no doubt that with VR you are at a tactical disadvantage against 2d pilots with a good trackir setup. Even with the very best VR sets the resolution just isn't there yet. Neither is the field of view. The neatest part of VR, looking around like a real pilot, having to crank your neck to check 6, is another one of its disadvantages.

 

We still have servers that insist on no labels of any kind, which is really unfair to VR pilots.

 

That is so because DCS has unrealistically too good spotting capabilities (in VR as well).

And unrealistic behavior where players think that they should be able look their 6'clock middle of turns and all without any G effects.

 

If we ever get to better state, spotting becomes far more difficult or impossible even, and one can't move their head when pulling more G's, having limited color vision and all.

 

It wouldn't just be more realistic, it would bring everyone back to the same level as TrackIR users wouldn't be a owl necks....

Overall while dog fight experience would change radically with improved G effects and and all.

 

But many are against idea of realism as it would remove their unfair capabilities.

[Thinder]

 

But many are against idea of realism as it would remove their unfair capabilities.

 

 

Tell me about it...

[Fri13]

The best HMD one can get for sane price is Pimax 8K that cost about 800-1200 € and then buy the lighthouses for it as individual units.

There is no Index or Reverb that matches it, as one needs to go to 4500 € price range for next.

 

But that if wanted best of the best, that is not most sensible thing.

Even today Rift S and especially Quest 2 are best choices for price, tracking and content as support too. Sure one doesn't get widest FOV available but it is more than most people can look a side with eyes, so focusable area is not limited. And with Rift S I can check in a hornet my six a such way that I see an opposite vertical stabilizer, so past 180 degree, without unrealistic seating (but I wouldn't be doing it any means under high G's). But if one doesn't have an Facebook.... That is no go then.

 

My main problem with Rift S is to see downward. Especially somewhere past a lighting knobs in Harrier or Hornet, so if required to operate something at shoulder position or backwards it becomes requiring to shift seating.

 

This is more of a problem in a Mi-8 flight engineer position where the center floor console is annoyingly low.

[Thinder]

I think people should go for what they feel most comfortable with.

 

In my case, I'm after clarity and image quality more than absolute performance and the widest PoV.

 

When I first eared that the G2 release was delayed, I immediately thought that they were looking at further improvements, so to me, it is good news that HP have been working at the lenses.

 

If I'm not mistaking, the G2 Omnicept Edition also features systems which can be used to develop optical qualities further by focusing on what the player looks at.

 

Here we're looking at Eye Tracking and Pupillometry in this topic...

https://www8.hp.com/us/en/vr/reverb-g2-vr-headset-omnicept-edition.html?jumpid=va_cdbrzpgewu

 

......

[hansangb]

I'm just looking at reviews online. So am I right in saying it's really a choice between the HP Reverb and Oculus Rift S? People seem to be impressed with the sharpness of the image with the Reverb.

 

Also just out of curiosity. You know how with track ir you quite often have to reset your default/ neutral head position as it sort of looses it's original centre point after a whole bunch of twisting and turning - is that the same with VR headsets or they stay oriented in space relative to the neutral point constantly without having to hit a button to re-center?

 

 

Rift S is pretty far behind at this point. I wouldn't even consider Rift S.

[Fri13]

Rift S is pretty far behind at this point. I wouldn't even consider Rift S.

 

On the paper yes, but in practice it is not at all so easy to claim so. I compared a week Rift S against Index and decided to return other. Not a such benefit for the price and performance.

 

In overall package the Rift is excellent, the price, the quality and features. But most importantly it is what it requires from the PC to run it well.

 

But that was already year ago when it came out. Now as DCS receiving vulkan becomes closer and closer and new gen graphics cards are out, things can change radically once new DCS comes out.

But it all depends from what the DCS receives in performance capabilities.

 

If we see 3-4x performance increase in Vulkan version, there is no consideration for performance benefit of Rift S.

But if one needs to buy a 3090 to get it, then 1500-1900 € extra price + CPU and all becomes moot point for majority and we are again in case to put 6000 € for a new PC to run it all on best of the best.

[Hoirtel]

On the paper yes, but in practice it is not at all so easy to claim so. I compared a week Rift S against Index and decided to return other. Not a such benefit for the price and performance.

 

In overall package the Rift is excellent, the price, the quality and features. But most importantly it is what it requires from the PC to run it well.

 

But that was already year ago when it came out. Now as DCS receiving vulkan becomes closer and closer and new gen graphics cards are out, things can change radically once new DCS comes out.

But it all depends from what the DCS receives in performance capabilities.

 

If we see 3-4x performance increase in Vulkan version, there is no consideration for performance benefit of Rift S.

But if one needs to buy a 3090 to get it, then 1500-1900 € extra price + CPU and all becomes moot point for majority and we are again in case to put 6000 € for a new PC to run it all on best of the best.

 

You won't see that much performance increase with vulkan. I think people really have it as some kind of mythological beast. If you look at the performance increase xplane had from openGL in 11.4 to vulkan in 11.5 it is an improvement, but not 3 - 4 times. FPS increased a little, more on AMD cards but smoothness improved a lot. However DCS currently performs MUCH better than xplane did on open GL.

 

Vulkan is a graphics API so it also won't suddenly start using more CPU cores either, which is where we will see the most benefit. Vulkan will help is definitely worth implementing but will not be the major change everyone is expecting. Seems that getting flight sims to work well in high quality over multi cores is difficult. Even MSFS 2020 doesn't do this how you might have expected....

[Hoirtel]

The best HMD one can get for sane price is Pimax 8K that cost about 800-1200 € and then buy the lighthouses for it as individual units.

There is no Index or Reverb that matches it, as one needs to go to 4500 € price range for next.

 

But that if wanted best of the best, that is not most sensible thing.

Even today Rift S and especially Quest 2 are best choices for price, tracking and content as support too. Sure one doesn't get widest FOV available but it is more than most people can look a side with eyes, so focusable area is not limited. And with Rift S I can check in a hornet my six a such way that I see an opposite vertical stabilizer, so past 180 degree, without unrealistic seating (but I wouldn't be doing it any means under high G's). But if one doesn't have an Facebook.... That is no go then.

 

My main problem with Rift S is to see downward. Especially somewhere past a lighting knobs in Harrier or Hornet, so if required to operate something at shoulder position or backwards it becomes requiring to shift seating.

 

This is more of a problem in a Mi-8 flight engineer position where the center floor console is annoyingly low.

 

I'm pretty sure I saw a comparison video that actually said the pimax wasn't as clear as G2 or some others (can't remember which) - it was an MRTV youtube video. Seems like it has loads of pixels but spreading them out across a wide FOV means it has a lower pixel density.

[Thinder]

I'm pretty sure I saw a comparison video that actually said the pimax wasn't as clear as G2 or some others (can't remember which) - it was an MRTV youtube video. Seems like it has loads of pixels but spreading them out across a wide FOV means it has a lower pixel density.

 

 

It could be this one...

 

 

I think the lenses also play a role in the quality of the head set, reason why the G2 was delayed, to improve on what was already good but had little flaws.

 

 

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[ColinSigley]

I have been using the Rift S headset for about a year and I have found it to be very good. I have just bought the Quest 2, mainly for the much enhanced graphics claimed in the write-ups. Although the Quest 2 works very well with X-Plane 11, it is impossible to use with DCS despite having the latest drivers etc. When the game gets to the "Fly" stage, there is so much flickering, jittering and freezing of the display that it is impossible to use the game. Has anyone out there got any suggestions. I am awaiting a response from Oculus.

[Svsmokey]

Are you using the official Link cable ?

[TED]

I am using slightly lower spec than you, having recently upgraded specifically for VR, with Ryzen 7 3850, RTX2070. I became a convert to VR about a year ago and have been using Rift S. I honestly will never go back. VR is the only way for me for realism and immersion. You shouldnt have any problem in VR with your spec. I get a steady 40 fps on my rift s and it is smooth without any jumping.

I like the Rift S and it is served me well, but I bought it knowing very little about VR. It has been a great road into the world of VR simming, but I would not buy it today. The main reasoning is just that the resolution is not quite there for what i want now. I still vastly prefer it to flat screen, and would recommend it on a budget, but eventually the limits in resolution in the rift are the constraint and not the performance. For that reason alone I am now saving my pennies and will purchase the Reverb G” as soon as it is released and I have seen some realistic reviews. Based on everything I have seen so far, this should really be a huge advance in the VR realm, finally putting good resolution together with good performance into VR. I really hope that fairly soon we see a good hand tracking or glove option that allows us to replace hand controllers for actions in the cockpit. The options right now are prohibitively expensive for me, although that being said the hand controllers work absolutely fine for this purpose for now.

Either way - i can only recommend jumping into VR and once in I doubt you will go back. The improvements to VR are happening fast and getting better and better. Additionally more and more sims are taking VR seriously and we know ED are aiming to use multicore eventually for the platform. This will open all sorts of new potential. For now though with a Ryzen 9, if you just overclock a little, you have more than enough performance in your system to really enjoy the experience.

[Hoirtel]

I am using slightly lower spec than you, having recently upgraded specifically for VR, with Ryzen 7 3850, RTX2070. I became a convert to VR about a year ago and have been using Rift S. I honestly will never go back. VR is the only way for me for realism and immersion. You shouldnt have any problem in VR with your spec. I get a steady 40 fps on my rift s and it is smooth without any jumping.

I like the Rift S and it is served me well, but I bought it knowing very little about VR. It has been a great road into the world of VR simming, but I would not buy it today. The main reasoning is just that the resolution is not quite there for what i want now. I still vastly prefer it to flat screen, and would recommend it on a budget, but eventually the limits in resolution in the rift are the constraint and not the performance. For that reason alone I am now saving my pennies and will purchase the Reverb G” as soon as it is released and I have seen some realistic reviews. Based on everything I have seen so far, this should really be a huge advance in the VR realm, finally putting good resolution together with good performance into VR. I really hope that fairly soon we see a good hand tracking or glove option that allows us to replace hand controllers for actions in the cockpit. The options right now are prohibitively expensive for me, although that being said the hand controllers work absolutely fine for this purpose for now.

Either way - i can only recommend jumping into VR and once in I doubt you will go back. The improvements to VR are happening fast and getting better and better. Additionally more and more sims are taking VR seriously and we know ED are aiming to use multicore eventually for the platform. This will open all sorts of new potential. For now though with a Ryzen 9, if you just overclock a little, you have more than enough performance in your system to really enjoy the experience.

 

Yeah I hope for some sort of mainstream hand tracking, however I use the mouse in VR. I cannot get on with the controllers, constanly having to pick them up and down to switch between the hotas and "hand". Mouse seems to be much more natural at this. Not a perfect solution, but a good option to try if you haven't found it yet (controllers are default)

[ColinSigley]

Although I am not using the expensive link cable, my cable checks out at 2.9gbs. I am running Win 10, Intel Core i7@3.2 Ghz 32 Gb RAM NVidia Gforce 1070Ti.

[Leaderface]

Although I am not using the expensive link cable, my cable checks out at 2.9gbs. I am running Win 10, Intel Core i7@3.2 Ghz 32 Gb RAM NVidia Gforce 1070Ti.

Have you tried the new updated Link feature of 500 Mb/sg.?

People says it offer very good quality (on static image almost indistiguible from a direct DP connection) but not quite as good on fast moving images like DCS.

Maybe on a future Quest 3 with USB 4/Thunderbolt it will be just as good.

And see this: https://www.roadtovr.com/decagear-vr-headset-megadodo-simulation-games/

It´s not standalone though. But seems promising if it´s not a fraud. (Seems what a future HP Reverb G3 should be).

[CommandT]

I am using slightly lower spec than you, having recently upgraded specifically for VR, with Ryzen 7 3850, RTX2070. I became a convert to VR about a year ago and have been using Rift S. I honestly will never go back. VR is the only way for me for realism and immersion. You shouldnt have any problem in VR with your spec. I get a steady 40 fps on my rift s and it is smooth without any jumping.

I like the Rift S and it is served me well, but I bought it knowing very little about VR. It has been a great road into the world of VR simming, but I would not buy it today. The main reasoning is just that the resolution is not quite there for what i want now. I still vastly prefer it to flat screen, and would recommend it on a budget, but eventually the limits in resolution in the rift are the constraint and not the performance. For that reason alone I am now saving my pennies and will purchase the Reverb G” as soon as it is released and I have seen some realistic reviews. Based on everything I have seen so far, this should really be a huge advance in the VR realm, finally putting good resolution together with good performance into VR. I really hope that fairly soon we see a good hand tracking or glove option that allows us to replace hand controllers for actions in the cockpit. The options right now are prohibitively expensive for me, although that being said the hand controllers work absolutely fine for this purpose for now.

Either way - i can only recommend jumping into VR and once in I doubt you will go back. The improvements to VR are happening fast and getting better and better. Additionally more and more sims are taking VR seriously and we know ED are aiming to use multicore eventually for the platform. This will open all sorts of new potential. For now though with a Ryzen 9, if you just overclock a little, you have more than enough performance in your system to really enjoy the experience.

 

Interesting. Thanks for writing about your experience. Ideally I'd like to not overclock but we will see. I suspect the new G2 will require more computing power than the Rift S so I think that 3080Ti really will be a requirement.

[Thinder]

 

Interesting. Thanks for writing about your experience. Ideally I'd like to not overclock but we will see. I suspect the new G2 will require more computing power than the Rift S so I think that 3080Ti really will be a requirement.

 

If I were you, I'll wait before splashing some dosh at a GPU, two reasons, first AMD might well be able to offer a better option than the 3080Ti in the future, if not in terms of pure performances, certainly in terms of cost.

 

Then the performances of the GPU alone is not enough to make a choice, consider this: If your CPU and GPU are not bound properly and you can end up with a bottleneck percentage over 10%, a large part of the benefit of having a more powerful GPU is gone, not to mention RAM, you end up with more heat, more power consumption and the need for further upgrade...

 

Check out the best bound for a GPU of your choice if you want to stick to your actual CPU or upgrade it, make sure you keep the bottleneck percentage below 10% at 4K resolution, because this is how you're gonna use your combo in VR in the future.

 

The new mid-range GPU should be strong enough to handle DCS at 4K but to achieve this, you'll need the right CPU and RAM, compatibility with your motherboard buses are also important to check before committing to a purchase and one topic almost everyone forget to mention is good case cooling, because the more power the more heat generated so you'll need to vent all of this energy out to reach the optimum performances.

https://forums.eagle.ru/forum/english/reality/pc-hardware-and-related-software/290649-upgrade-complete-happy-player#post290649

.....

 

[BitMaster]

Last but not least, before you buy into VR, try it out and make sure you do not get nausea as bad as I got it. I gave my Rift away a few days ago ( for free ) to my buddies kids. They love it, dont get nausea and thus can actually make use of it.

Some say you will overcome nausea after some time, that never worked for me, actually, the more I tried it the more intense the dizzyness became.

 

I might go back to VR once it has fully matured, is available for a normal price and runs great with sub 1k€ GPU. Until then, I stay with my flat 27" QHD screen.

[Frost_rus]

Guys, correct me if I'm wrong (that are my thoughts after some reading... but I never tried DCS with any VR):

1. new Oculus Quest 2 requires better hardware than Rift S due to higher native resolution. But the result quality is worse (because it uses USB and compression instead of DP)

2. Rift S requires ~2x multisampling to make picture "OK" (but still not ideal). And new high resolution headsets (like Reverb G2) will work with 1x. But Rift S is still better if you don't have high end GPU

3. Reverb G2 will be much much better then current "G1". But G1 is better than Rift S / Cosmos / Odyssey

4. Having a laptop with i7-9700F / 64RAM / RTX2070 (laptop version, closer to desktop 2060 in terms of performance) - Rift S is the only option that will work with reasonable FPS

 

To be clear: I'm not interested in competitive multiplayer (dis)/advantages (that was ages ago). Single player only, but I still want to be able to read gauges / HUD text in VR.

[Krupi]

Guys, correct me if I'm wrong (that are my thoughts after some reading... but I never tried DCS with any VR):

1. new Oculus Quest 2 requires better hardware than Rift S due to higher native resolution. But the result quality is worse (because it uses USB and compression instead of DP)

2. Rift S requires ~2x multisampling to make picture "OK" (but still not ideal). And new high resolution headsets (like Reverb G2) will work with 1x. But Rift S is still better if you don't have high end GPU

3. Reverb G2 will be much much better then current "G1". But G1 is better than Rift S / Cosmos / Odyssey

4. Having a laptop with i7-9700F / 64RAM / RTX2070 (laptop version, closer to desktop 2060 in terms of performance) - Rift S is the only option that will work with reasonable FPS

 

To be clear: I'm not interested in competitive multiplayer (dis)/advantages (that was ages ago). Single player only, but I still want to be able to read gauges / HUD text in VR.

 

Remember you can run the G2 at half resolution if you are in position like me and will struggle to run full res with your PC specs.

 

From these reviews it seems that this will offer improved performance compared to the Rift S and look better...

 

[video=youtube_share;-NT1GFgMsqw]

 

[PhoenixRising]

I run on a 1070 currently. It is barely adequate for my Rift S. I keep the settings fairly low, and still have the occasional hiccup. But like you, I would rather have poorer graphics in VR than look at a screen. I also do not play MP. My understanding is that tasks it even more.

 

Sent from my moto g(7) using Tapatalk

 

 

[Thinder]

I had always heard that VR had very poor graphics quality.

 

Last week I made the mistake to test an Ocultus Rift 1; seeing myself inside the cockpit made me forget poor graphics and focus on the feeling that I was inside the plane.

 

Once you have tried Track IR you cannot go back, once you have tried VR you cannot go back!!!

 

After reading a lot of post, it seems to me that the best VR will be HP Reverb G2.

 

Until now with my PC I can see DCS at high resolution in flat screen, but I could use HP Reverb G2?

 

- AMD Ryzen 5 1600X Six-Core Processor 3.60Ghz

- RAM: 16Gb

- NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti

 

In the specifications, my graphics card does not appear even to see at half resolution.

 

Will the VR work on my pc until I can change the graphics card?

Will the CPU support the VR?

 

Thanks for your support

 

You'll need more than those specs for running the G2 at its highest settings.

 

AMD Ryzen 5 3600X, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 2080 and 32GB DDR4 3200 minimum.

 

The problem you might have is your motherboard and support from your buses, AMD Ryzen 9 3900X or 9 3950X would be a good upgrade with existing buses standard, GeForce RTX

3070 as well.

 

When it comes to RAM, good quality is more important than sheer speed, I'd recommend Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Desktop Gaming Memory, or Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Desktop Gaming Memory (Black), whatever works best with your processor, those two kits are high performance for moderate price.

https://uk.crucial.com/memory/ddr4/bl2k16g32c16u4b

https://uk.crucial.com/memory/ddr4/b...u4b/ct16868388

 

If your motherboard can take them, the next Generation AMD GPU and CPU are a good alternative.

 

For your question about VR with lower specs, yes, I did it with my Oculus Rift CV1 and Ryzen 3 3200 and MSI RX 5700 XT before I upgraded, but you'll got low res and low frame rate from it.