No Joy with my Joy

[E55-EF]

Hi All

I recently purchased the Huey, but a week later and i still cant get this bird to fly stable to the extent it renders the game play impossible, i have tried countless known axis curve settings but its still like trying to swat a fly!

 

The only way for a stable controlled flight is to switch on the Autopilot !, whereas the KA50 flys straight out the box, my JS is a thrust master T flight so not the best but it copes fine with the Ka which for all intents and purposes is a much more complicated heli ?

 

Any assistance or pointers to the fix would be appreciated

 

TIA E55EF

 

 

 

 

[wraith70]

I found the Ka easy to fly compared to the Huey...she is certainly difficult to learn. Do you have rudder pedals? Can't imagine flying without them.

[E55-EF]

Hi Wraith

No Rudder pedals in use, i do have them but they need a repair so not implemented them yet.

 

I do like the Huey but i am disappointed, if i cant resolve the flyability issues i will consider requesting a refund as at present i deem this model unusable and not fit for purpose, but hopefully that wont be the case and i certainly dont believe iam on my own with this issue ?

 

E55EF

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Wrcknbckr]

Unless you want to only fly high speed and never want to land or take-off, you definitely need some yaw control. I'd suggest to fix your rudder pedals and have fun in future!

[E55-EF]

Unless you want to only fly high speed and never want to land or take-off, you definitely need some yaw control. I'd suggest to fix your rudder pedals and have fun in future!

 

Thank You

Ive purchased a better JS to so hopefully things will get better

 

E55EF

[canadianbaken]

As others have stated you need rudder pedals. No real way to fly a helicopter without them. KA-50 doesn't have a tail rotor and has flight stability controls that make it easier to fly.

[Quadg]

there is also a lot of muscle memory involved. like riding a bike.

you will eventually click and just start getting it.

 

there are no shortcuts to learning it. you are better off not changing curves and joystick etc. and just repeating it until it clicks with your muscles.

unfortunately unlike a bike there are no stabilisers/training wheels. so you just have to keep falling off until eventually you don't.

but when you do get it, it is well worth it.

the frustration turns to joy.

 

start with simple things where you can see progress to help fight the frustration.

try landing it anywhere on the runway.

then try to close down to landing on a certain spot on the runway. like the numbers.

mix it up with hover practise. and hover taxi.

repeat that 300 times and you will feel like a pro.

yes pedals are essential. because you need to balance all three controls together.

 

even after a 1000 hours you will still be learning stuff. why the huey is so rewarding.

 

nobody can fly a helicopter at first. it takes lots of repetition

[Tanuki44]

+1 many hours of practice, time to spend to refine the settings, reading some litterature of the flight model etc ... and fun replaces frustration :pilotfly:

 

[E55-EF]

Thanks for the pointers Guys, All taken on board

:pilotfly:

[fatboy]

What joystick did you buy after the Thrustmaster T flight?

[X-31_VECTOR]

E55, if you mean hovering: For me, the "light bulb" moment was sitting in a real cockpit watching the cyclic hand of the pilot as he held a perfect hover. The stick was always in motion, but the motions were extremely small. Over-controlling is very easy to do, and leads to more over-controlling until you are hopelessly chasing after the aircraft. Try holding the stick between your thumb and one finger (no deathgrip), and only using your thumb and finger to make inputs -- no wrist, no arm. It can help to remember that you are sitting in a pendulum that is swinging under the rotor disk; the cyclic moves the rotor disk first, and the fuselage follows, and has its own momentum when the disk stops moving.

 

If you're talking about forward flight, DCS UH-1 models all the quirky aerodynamic effects inherent to single-rotordisk helicopters (note: the KA-50 is a different animal entirely because it has contra-rotating rotors and flight control computers). Just one example: as your forward airspeed increases, your lift increases. But it doesn't do so symmetrically. The attacking blades generate proportionally more lift relative to the retreating ones as airspeed builds, and the tendency to roll toward the retreating-blade side will increase. As a general rule, every change in airspeed or altitude requires inputs of cyclic, collective and pedals.

 

And all of this assumes you are using something for the anti-torque pedal axis -- could be rudder pedals, could be a twist-grip on your stick, or anything folks use for the yaw axis when flying fixed wing in DCS. Technically you can map it to keyboard, but I can't imagine that's flyable.

 

All of this might lead you to want to walk away from the Huey, but the moment when you find yourself holding a stable hover indefinitely (you're not quite sure how, but your hands and feet and brain stem have just learned it on their own) makes it all worthwhile. Good luck!

[E55-EF]

Update:

 

Well after a little more "Airtime" things are getting a little better and i am beginning to understand the dynamics required to fly the Huey in a reasonable fashion, but for a better feel ive opted to replicate her controls using the thrustmasters hand grip and internal electronics in a homebrew cyclic gooseneck and collective stick mashup albeit with much preciser potentiometers.

 

The JoyStick i acquired was a used Saitek x45, dated i know and not really heli friendly, but what a difference it makes to overall control of my flight modules and very well laid out to

 

Again thanks for the info its been invaluable.

 

E55-EF

 

Ps for interest ill post pics of my build as it progresses

[E55-EF]

Here's the Thrustmaster disassembled:

The main pcb shows the lower switch contacts (carbon ptm) and throttle/rudder pot assembly these will be hard wired up to the collective stick.

 

Next move is to bend the goose neck form 15mm copper pipe, attach and extend the grip wiring with 12 core cable.

 

E55-EF

 

 

Edited November 10, 2020 by E55-EF
Added 2 pics of cyclic tube after bending, wiring slid right threw without issue

[notproplayer3]

Well, helos are very hard at first and perhaps even more s the huey, even I who started with arguably the simplest helo to fly in DCS: the ka50, had an extremely hard time to the point where I almost dropped trying to fly it, but now, I must say that all the helos and especially the huey are my favorite aircraft to fly in DCS. By the way I use the z axis on my t1600m joystick for rudder and I've got no VR or track IR, haven't fiddled with any curves too.

Like Quadg said above me, it's muscle memory, flying the huey is something certainly very attainable and enjoyable without rudder pedals and I'm pretty sure there's nothing to worry if it seems impossible at first.

Sorry if I can't give any pointers, it just comes naturally over time, at least for me...

[Tanuki44]

Very good initiative, :thumbup:

 

The realization of commands increases the pleasure and immersion of piloting.

 

 

​

 

Nothing is the same after ​:pilotfly:

 

 

[Grievo]

Also, I'm not sure if this is obvious or not...

 

Use the force trim button, a lot. A real helicopter cyclic is not spring loaded to return to center automatically, and at various stages of flight are in very different positions.

 

For example, when I'm lifting into the hover, I move the stick back and left, and hit force trim. So when my joystick is centered, the cyclic is roughly where I need it to be for the hover, and I can make minor adjustments from there. as soon as I transition to forward flight, I press the cancel force trim button and keep forward pressure on the cyclic to push through the flap-back effect as the helicopter picks up speed, I can then trim an attitude for my desired climb speed. For level flight, set a power, find an attitude where you're not climbing or descending, and trim it off, you'll need to make very fine adjustments to maintain altitude, but it will make much easier. If you want to go faster, pull more power on the collective, and repeat the process. When coming from forward flight to the hover, I lower the collective, and cancel the force trim. The secondary effect of lowering collective is for the nose to drop, by cancelling the force trim it cancels out this effect, and when I am setting up my approach, I again trim slightly aft of center.

 

It sounds convoluted, but it becomes second nature before long. There's a great channel on YouTube called "Helicopter lessons in ten minutes or less" It can really help you understand what's going on aerodynamically and make controlling the beast much less of a riddle.

 

Pedals really will make your life much easier.

[E55-EF]

Thank you all for taking the time to assist with very useful assistance

 

E55-EF :pilotfly: