insufficent real world evidence Is double GBU-32 possible on rack?

[raelias]

I was wondering, since we can take a double rack of MK-83, is it possible a BRU-55 double rack of GBU-32? Just asking really I don't know but if yes it's not in-game yet

 

It doest looks like it would fit just fine, the fins are the same size as the MK-83 (MK83 racks and GBU38 racks on the screenshot)

 

[med-taha]

Yes. But not available yet on DCS

[Tholozor]

You can find plenty of evidence of it being carried like that on Rhinos. Not sure if it's anything that was ever authorized on legacy Hornets, but it should be technically possible.

[Northstar98]

If BRU-55(?) is okay for our Hornet, I don't see why not.

[raelias]

Great, thank you can't wait

[Ipergallo]

You can find plenty of evidence of it being carried like that on Rhinos. Not sure if it's anything that was ever authorized on legacy Hornets, but it should be technically possible.

 

Hi,

 

you can find plenty of evidence of it being carried like that in F-18C too, like actually we use the same configuration for AGM-154 that share the same rack system of Jdam, we actually use a dual rack for GBU-38, supposed tu be a BRU-55.

[raelias]

Any news from the devs on when we are getting the double GBU-32s?

[JackCooper]

Nice example of GBU-32 on a BRU in RAAF

[raelias]

I know it's possible, been trying to get an answer on this for months...

[Tholozor]

Here's a 1995 research paper on the subject of aircraft capabilities regarding smart bombs.

https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA300588.pdf

 

At the bottom of page 2-14, it states:

Quote

The BRU-55 is compatible with carrying two 1,000 lb. JDAM, JSOW, or WCMD

Granted we already have the BRU-55 carrying JSOW, reason would stand that GBU-32 would fall into this category. We know for a fact that Super Hornets have flown with 32s on BRU-55, but I've never seen it on a legacy Bug. The paper goes into additional detail regarding the Hornet's weight limits for the inboard and outboard stations (at the top of page 2-12), and more on the mechanical interface on page 2-11. Granted this paper is from 1995, and a lot can happen in 10 years. Wiring may have changed, authorized loading doctrine may have changed, etc.

 

Long story short: Is it possible from a technical standpoint? Yes. Did the Navy ever actually do it for the legacy Hornet? Not as far as I can tell, but there are probably others with better first-hand knowledge to answer that. Depending on the result of answering that question though, if 32s aren't going to be on BRU-55, then perhaps JSOW shouldn't either.

Edited March 19, 2021 by Tholozor

[Rescue]

Hello There!

 

03.2019 it was advertised that a BRU-55 could double carry smart Ammo (ED also named GBU-32) in that post for an upcoming update.

 

This Website tells me that JDAMs up to 1000lbs are possible (GBU-32) on a BRU-55:

 

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/systems/bru-57.htm

 

This here:

 

https://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/equip/docs/bru-57-System_Performance_Specification.html

 

Stated that GBU-32 can be carried on them (new gen 1000lbs MIL-STD-1760 class stores). "These Include and is not limited to GBU-32, AGM-154, (...)".

 

 

The document MP-AVT-108-13 state at least that the GBU-32 flight test on BRU-55s is completed (on F/A-18C).

 

As far as I understand BRU-55 and -57 are the same thing but -55 is Navy and -57 Air Force stuff.

 

From the public stuff i get it should be possible like the JSOWs.

Although a gold old unclassified document that says in easy english "yeah this thing fit on it" isn't easy to find.

 

Greetings

 

[raelias]

Wonder why it's taking so long to be avalible, sounds like a relativelly simple feature to implement

[Rescue]

Oh and i found this here:

https://www.l3harris.com/all-capabilities/smart-multiple-carriage-racks

 

Sure it's advertisment but still: "The L3Harris BRU-55/A smart rack doubles the number of MIL-STD-1760 smart weapons that can be carried on tactical strike aircraft such as the F/A-18 C-F.".

 

And from what I found a GBU-32 is part of MIL-STD-1760.

 

Greetings

[Swift.]

It is in no dispute that GBU-32 can be carried on BRU55. The question that has yet to be answered is whether Legacy Hornet could carry GBU-32 on BRU55, there has yet to be evidence presented to support that claim.

[Swift.]

9 minutes ago, rogerkiln said:

I know it's possible, been trying to get an answer on this for months..

How do you know its possible then? Have you seen it?

[raelias]

Well if the BRU-55 suports GBU-32, there is no reason why out lot 20 shouldn't have it

[Ziptie]

15 minutes ago, raelias said:

Well if the BRU-55 suports GBU-32, there is no reason why out lot 20 shouldn't have it

 

Could be a limitation "external" to the BRU-55 (i.e wiring or a hardware/software system limitation on the aircraft itself).

I don't know for sure, one way or the other, and would be speculation if I sided one way or the other.

Hopefully an official Eagle Dynamics representative will be able to sort out your question.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

[Swift.]

6 hours ago, raelias said:

Well if the BRU-55 suports GBU-32, there is no reason why out lot 20 shouldn't have it

That's not a sound like of reasoning, for example MER is capable of carrying 6 mk82s, but hornet isn't.

 

There are more things that limit store carriage than weight and wiring. Think about aerodynamic effects of jettison or release, including interference effects one the surrounding stations. Think about asymmetric roll limitations; could a potentially uncontrollable load be created by hung stores.

[Rescue]

On 3/25/2021 at 12:23 AM, Swiftwin9s said:

It is in no dispute that GBU-32 can be carried on BRU55. The question that has yet to be answered is whether Legacy Hornet could carry GBU-32 on BRU55, there has yet to be evidence presented to support that claim.

 

See:

On 3/24/2021 at 11:09 PM, Rescue said:

(...) "The L3Harris BRU-55/A smart rack doubles the number of MIL-STD-1760 smart weapons that can be carried on tactical strike aircraft such as the F/A-18 C-F.".

(...)

 

 

23 hours ago, Swiftwin9s said:

(...)

There are more things that limit store carriage than weight and wiring. Think about aerodynamic effects of jettison or release, including interference effects one the surrounding stations. Think about asymmetric roll limitations; could a potentially uncontrollable load be created by hung stores.

 

See:

On 3/24/2021 at 10:35 PM, Rescue said:

(...)

The document MP-AVT-108-13 state at least that the GBU-32 flight test on BRU-55s is completed (on F/A-18C).

(...)

 

In conclusion it should be possible. Even more if ED keeps the way that the AGM-154s can be carried as double ones.

 

Still no clear stuff but a lot of indications.

 

Greetings

[Swift.]

8 hours ago, Rescue said:

 

See:

 

 

 

See:

 

In conclusion it should be possible. Even more if ED keeps the way that the AGM-154s can be carried as double ones.

 

Still no clear stuff but a lot of indications.

 

Greetings

To the first point, I never said hornet cant carry BRU-55. Just that it cant load GBU-32 thereon. 

 

To the second, an interesting find. I took the time to read the relevant section of MP-AVT-108-13 (an unclassified technical report on The Use of Statistical Tools to Improve Modeling and Simulation of Store Separation) What is contained within is an analysis on the use of computer modelling to simulate stores separation testing. In which it describes the GBU-32 on BRU-55 on Hornet as 'successful' in that the statistical tools successfully repeated the flight testing.

 

Deficiencies in that report, are that its only assessing the suitability of the tools, not the suitability of the stores on the aircraft. And that its related to stores separation, nothing to do with interference and carriage.

Edited March 27, 2021 by Swiftwin9s

[med-taha]

Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18A Hornet receiving fuel  while flying a mission in support of Operation Okra over Iraq.

We can clearly see a GBU-32 mounted on a BRU-55 in a Combat mission.

 

[Rescue]

Today i found the NAVEDTRA 14313B.

 

This Document stated that the BRU-55 is fitted onto the BRU-32.

 

Again BRU-55 is stated that it doubles the amount of 1000lbs bombs.

 

It against refers to MIL-STD-1760 also to non-MIL-STD-1760 armament.

 

Down the document it refers to the publication of the NTRP 3-22.4-FA18A-D (which should be public) for the authorization of any load of weapon and stores.

 

Unfortunately I haven't yet access to a copy of NTRP 3-22.4-FA18A-D.

There is a link online that doesn't work yet for me.

 

Maybe some of you may have a better chance.

 

Nice pictures med-taha!

 

Greetings

Edited March 30, 2021 by Rescue

[raelias]

I really wished for a official statement on this

[Bunny Clark]

On 3/24/2021 at 5:09 PM, Rescue said:

Sure it's advertisment but still: "The L3Harris BRU-55/A smart rack doubles the number of MIL-STD-1760 smart weapons that can be carried on tactical strike aircraft such as the F/A-18 C-F.".

 

And from what I found a GBU-32 is part of MIL-STD-1760.

MIL-STD-1760 is a data communications standard used for transferring position and target information to weapons. The inclusion of 1760 wiring is what distinguishes the BRU-55 from the BRU-33. It doesn't mean that the BRU-55 can carry any MIL-STD-1760 weapon though, as that would also include the GBU-31. 

[Ipergallo]

On 3/30/2021 at 10:13 PM, Bunny Clark said:

MIL-STD-1760 is a data communications standard used for transferring position and target information to weapons. The inclusion of 1760 wiring is what distinguishes the BRU-55 from the BRU-33. It doesn't mean that the BRU-55 can carry any MIL-STD-1760 weapon though, as that would also include the GBU-31. 

We speak about 1000 lb class weapons... GBU-31 is a 2000 lb class weapon...

so...

so...

so two yeas passed and any response, there are docs, there are photos, there are... always the same Torquemada that block any F-18C implementation in weapons stores... Why? I think that... (sorry I can't find a photo for that so I can't say...)

ED have find a brilliant solution for any Torquemada, but... for some reasons, that I don't know, only for F-16C harm gate resolution...

Why we can't have a double rack BRU-55 for GBU-32? No response in 2 years...

Why we can't have a single rack for aim-120 ? No response... If you think that is no good for a Navy F-18C, purists can always use payload restrictions in ME...

Why we can't have a single rack for rockets? No response... If you think that is no good for a Navy F-18C, purists can always use payload restrictions...

 

2 years of no response... Thank you!