Delayed-fuse bombs

[DD_Fenrir]

Easy on the prima-Donna princess. It’s coming, just that - guess what - it’s a feature that requires changes to the core code and as such could cause cascading issues across the whole slew of ground attack weapons if enacted without care or in a hurry.

Whilst FB.VI Mossies often made their attacks at treetop height with delayed fuses it is by no means their only method of delivery; indeed when attacking V-1 launch sites a pop up to 3,000-5,000ft followed by a shallow dive and bomb release @ 1,500ft with instantaneous fuses was the standard deliver technique. This form of attack is entirely achievable in DCS and can be quite accurate with practice but requires a careful monitoring of your flight profile and altimeter to ensure you don’t get sucked into the target and release too low and too late and frag yourself.

Edited October 19, 2021 by DD_Fenrir

[Holbeach]

On 6/29/2021 at 3:12 PM, rkk01 said:

 

(out of interest - were fuse delays set on the ground by the armorers, of could they be adjusted when airborne?)

Bit late, but the timed detonators were fitted by the armourers.

 

 

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[rkk01]

2 minutes ago, Holbeach said:

Bit late, but the timed detonators were fitted by the armourers.

 

 

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Ok, so attack order and timing would need to be strictly followed

[No1sonuk]

17 hours ago, HotTom said:

Sri to be late to the party but since the Mossie appeared I have been blowing myself up with low level shallow dive runs using instantaneous fuses.

Yet (YET!) every source I have read makes it clear the Mossie routinely used time delay fuses, usually 11 seconds. They were used at Amiens and at the Philips plant at Eindhoven. At Copenhagen, one bomb went in the front of the building, out the back and blew up well behind the building because of time delay fuses.

"...it is a core feature and will take time to implement and test." What a lame response! This is a brand new module with a major deal-killing flaw in what was historically a standard feature and it should be fixed immediately.

Please do so!

 

It's called "Early Access" for a reason...

As for the first part:
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result...

Edited October 19, 2021 by No1sonuk
Multi-post in error

[HotTom]

No1sonuk: 

Yes, I understand Early Access. I understand it is an opportunity for the developer to fix stuff that's broken. The lack of time delayed bomb fuses is not historical and it needs to be addressed. My comment is appropriate as this is the time to mention it.

Yes, I agree with your second rude comment and I have stopped making historically accurate low passes and have switched to the also historically correct method of climbing to 3,500 feet and releasing my bombs at 1,500 feet. Because DCS bombs have very little splash effect you have to achieve direct hits with bombs and that leaves no room for error. I'm not doing the same thing over and over but I am avoiding the low passes that made the Mossie so effective at low levels (if they had time delayed fuses). This needs to be fixed.

Good talk, sonuk....

[No1sonuk]

2 minutes ago, HotTom said:

No1sonuk: 

Yes, I understand Early Access. I understand it is an opportunity for the developer to fix stuff that's broken. The lack of time delayed bomb fuses is not historical and it needs to be addressed. My comment is appropriate as this is the time to mention it.

Yes, I agree with your second rude comment and I have stopped making historically accurate low passes and have switched to the also historically correct method of climbing to 3,500 feet and releasing my bombs at 1,500 feet. Because DCS bombs have very little splash effect you have to achieve direct hits with bombs and that leaves no room for error. I'm not doing the same thing over and over but I am avoiding the low passes that made the Mossie so effective at low levels (if they had time delayed fuses). This needs to be fixed.

Good talk, sonuk....

What is your technical background that makes you think a major software rewrite can be done and tested overnight?

[Talisman_VR]

On 10/19/2021 at 9:41 PM, HotTom said:

No1sonuk: 

Yes, I understand Early Access. I understand it is an opportunity for the developer to fix stuff that's broken. The lack of time delayed bomb fuses is not historical and it needs to be addressed. My comment is appropriate as this is the time to mention it.

Yes, I agree with your second rude comment and I have stopped making historically accurate low passes and have switched to the also historically correct method of climbing to 3,500 feet and releasing my bombs at 1,500 feet. Because DCS bombs have very little splash effect you have to achieve direct hits with bombs and that leaves no room for error. I'm not doing the same thing over and over but I am avoiding the low passes that made the Mossie so effective at low levels (if they had time delayed fuses). This needs to be fixed.

Good talk, sonuk....

This issue was flagged to DCS a long time ago, including for other WW2 types.  It is not a fix as they just don't provide it, which is not customer focused at all  and the main reason I have not and will not purchase the Mosquito, even at discount.  Another thing that is annoying me as a customer is that they are not telling us the mg and cannon convergence setting so that I can use the gunsight as per the real life design function.

Apparently DCS are working on the time fuse issue, so we might get bomb fuse timers in due course.  Sometimes just the fundamentals take a long time with DCS.

Happy landings,

Talisman

 

 

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Talisman_VR

[HotTom]

Thank you, Talisman. They gave us a short delay in the update a couple of days ago but it really isn't enough. The standard seems to be 11 seconds although the delays went up to 30 seconds.

Edited October 22, 2021 by HotTom

[Art-J]

Well, the module FAQ published on the release day made it very clear that rockets and delayed fuses were not included and would come unspecified "later".

So there's nothing to "fix" in a bug sense - fuses are a feature not implemented yet and that's that.

[No1sonuk]

27 minutes ago, HotTom said:

Thank you, Talisman. They gave us a short delay in the update a couple of days ago but it really isn't enough. The standard seems to be 11 seconds although the delays went up to 0 seconds.

IIRC, that was intended to stop the bombs detonating when dropped from the fuselage bay and hitting each other.

[HotTom]

@Art-J: My point is that this is an historical inaccuracy that needs addressing. Whether that's a "bug" or not depends on your interpretation of the term.

Edited October 22, 2021 by HotTom

[No1sonuk]

9 hours ago, HotTom said:

@Art-J: My point is that this is an historical inaccuracy that needs addressing. Whether that's a "bug" or not depends on your interpretation of the term.

 

Continuously bit**ing about it all over the forum won't make ED work any faster...

[Bozon]

9 hours ago, HotTom said:

Thank you, Talisman. They gave us a short delay in the update a couple of days ago but it really isn't enough. The standard seems to be 11 seconds although the delays went up to 30 seconds.

 

I don’t know if 11 seconds was a standard. It seems to be the delay the used in a few well know raids where a number of aircraft dropped bombs on structures. I suspect that in airstrikes on ground forces a shorter fuse was used.

[Holbeach]

1 hour ago, Bozon said:

I don’t know if 11 seconds was a standard. It seems to be the delay the used in a few well know raids where a number of aircraft dropped bombs on structures. I suspect that in airstrikes on ground forces a shorter fuse was used.

The 250 lb and 500 lb GP Mk V, were exclusively for long delay fuses. 30 mins to 36 hrs.

The Mk IV, MC and 250 lb SAP versions could be fitted with fuses up to 144 hrs. which included an anti tamper device.

Timed bombs had red painted tails.

 

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Edited October 23, 2021 by Holbeach

[Bozon]

3 hours ago, Holbeach said:

The 250 lb and 500 lb GP Mk V, were exclusively for long delay fuses. 30 mins to 36 hrs.

The Mk IV, MC and 250 lb SAP versions could be fitted with fuses up to 144 hrs. which included an anti tamper device.

Timed bombs had red painted tails.

 

..

 

What is the point in using delays that are a few days long?

[Holbeach]

41 minutes ago, Bozon said:

What is the point in using delays that are a few days long?

It's an area denial device.

You don't know when it will go bang, if ever.

 

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[Bozon]

17 hours ago, Holbeach said:

It's an area denial device.

You don't know when it will go bang, if ever.

 

..

That is effective when you dump a large number of bombs on an area, not two or four of them - today this is done with cluster munitions. The bombs need to keep exploding occasionally to maintain the effect. With that few, the enemy will not even know that there are delayed bombs in the area and the effect is lost.

Fuses of more than a couple of seconds are not effective against ground troops and vehicles that will tend to scatter immediately.

[Holbeach]

5 hours ago, Bozon said:

That is effective when you dump a large number of bombs on an area, not two or four of them - today this is done with cluster munitions. The bombs need to keep exploding occasionally to maintain the effect. With that few, the enemy will not even know that there are delayed bombs in the area and the effect is lost.

Fuses of more than a couple of seconds are not effective against ground troops and vehicles that will tend to scatter immediately.

You don't just dump 4, you dump a load of them amongst maybe a thousand contact bombs, dropped on a city or factory.

When hidden in rubble they could be going off for days at different intervals, disrupting rebuild of machinery etc.

The timer pistol can't be removed after arming.

If you found one, the poor sod who had to render it, wouldn't know if it was going to go off in 1 day or 1 minute.

Cluster bombs were also used in WW II.

 

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[Holbeach]

Timers.

 

 

[Mogster]

On 10/24/2021 at 3:11 PM, Holbeach said:

Cluster bombs were also used in WW II.

Napalm also.

[Holbeach]

On 10/25/2021 at 8:43 PM, Mogster said:

Napalm also.

Here's an interesting read, which includes the operational use of Napalm, by Mosquito Mk VI in 1944.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bulbasket

 

..

 

 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Holbeach

[HotTom]

19 hours ago, Holbeach said:

Here's an interesting read, which includes the operational use of Napalm, by Mosquito Mk VI in 1944.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bulbasket

Pity it's in Brittany and thus beyond our maps. Mosquitos were very busy in Brittany, in the Brest area and lots of places we don't have mapped.

HT

19 hours ago, Holbeach said:

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[Basco1]

The DCS Mosquito is going to be an absolute beast of a module once we hopefully receive delayed fuse ordnance.....to be able to get in really low,tree top level and clinically take out targets really excites me.

This is basically what the Mosquito FB VI was designed for,I have so far thoroughly enjoyed my experiences with the new module,and it is set to get a whole lot better......a whole lot better,bring it on.

[Vander]

Delayed fuses have arrived! Have fun blasting those special low level targets guys!

[HotTom]

Wonderful addition, especially for Mossies!