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Skins outdated and incorrect


hazzer

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I assume you are already aware that the skins for the p51 are out dated from previous versions of the sim. All of them have their own issues, a simple fix would be contacting the skin makers from the user files section and putting them skins in the game by default. 

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As nice as that would be, it’s up to the skin creators to maintain their files. I imagine there are some potential legal concerns when it comes to adding third party skins to the game. Namely, intellectual property and in the case of skins representing active units, permissions and licensing. In any case it’s likely that the process would be more complex than it would seem.

Modules

Combined Arms, Super Carrier, A-10A, A-10C, A-10C II, F-14, ,F-15C, F-16C, F/A-18C, P-51, Su-25, Su-27, MiG-21, MiG-29, Ajs-37, UH-1H, Ka-50, Sa-342

Terrains

Nevada Test and Training Range, The Persian Gulf, Normandy 1944, Syria

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12 hours ago, ak12546 said:

As nice as that would be, it’s up to the skin creators to maintain their files. I imagine there are some potential legal concerns when it comes to adding third party skins to the game. Namely, intellectual property and in the case of skins representing active units, permissions and licensing. In any case it’s likely that the process would be more complex than it would seem.

 

It doesn't seem to be the case with WWII content - we've already had community skins adopted by ED for 109, 190A-8 and (soon) P-47.

 

A similar livery competition could be organized for P-51... though it would require an update of official template in the first place (to a quality level at least matching community templates), which seems to be close the bottom of devs priority list.

i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10.

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though they seem to be on a very small scale, as opposed to the whole user skin library. Wasn’t the p-47 just one skin or am I mistaken?

Modules

Combined Arms, Super Carrier, A-10A, A-10C, A-10C II, F-14, ,F-15C, F-16C, F/A-18C, P-51, Su-25, Su-27, MiG-21, MiG-29, Ajs-37, UH-1H, Ka-50, Sa-342

Terrains

Nevada Test and Training Range, The Persian Gulf, Normandy 1944, Syria

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I don't think Hazzer meant adopting all Mustang submissions from the user skins library, especially when most of them isn't compatible with DCS 2.5.xx either. But getting about dozen or so of the best and latest ones, like in 109 and 190 competitions, would suffice.

 

About the Thunderbolt, it has a few default skins already (although some of them are clearly unfinished placeholders) and we've got the community competition running, which ends on March 5th. We'll see how many custom skins will be chosen and put in the game.


Edited by Art-J

i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10.

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16 hours ago, Art-J said:

I don't think Hazzer meant adopting all Mustang submissions from the user skins library, especially when most of them isn't compatible with DCS 2.5.xx either. But getting about dozen or so of the best and latest ones, like in 109 and 190 competitions, would suffice.

 

About the Thunderbolt, it has a few default skins already (although some of them are clearly unfinished placeholders) and we've got the community competition running, which ends on March 5th. We'll see how many custom skins will be chosen and put in the game.

 

Yes exactly this, the current default p51 skins have not been updated by ED for the "New" engine so there are plenty of issues

RTX 2080ti, I7 9700k, 32gb ram, SSD, Samsung Odyssey VR, MSFFB2, T-50 Throttle, Thrustmaster Rudder Pedals

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^ Puttied and sanded, true, but painted silver in the end. Our Mustangs, on the other hand, seem to have zero reflectivity added to the alpha layer of the wing textures. They're just flat grey and that's not accurate no matter how one looks at it. Community skinners like Reflected, VH-Rock and others managed to get this differrence much more "right".

 

Also, "Big Beautiful Doll" has neither fuselage nor wings texture converted to the new standard. "Ferocious Frankie" - same thing for the fuselage, though I guess we can turn the blind eye on that one, since the real life restored original doesn't have natural metal finish on the fuselage either.

 

Last but not least, they should fix the messed up bort numbers of 364th FS skin of TF-51D. Now they're displayed incorrectly on the fuselage - check the "Free Flight" instant action mission for the TF-51D. It's most likely the very first mission newcomers to DCS launch when they want to check what DCS warbirds are all about using free content - and this mess is what they will notice immediately after hitting F2. Not a great adverisement if you ask me.

 

 


Edited by Art-J

i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10.

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I use Reflected's skins, and they are natural metal throughout with no replication of the puttied areas. The only thing wrong with the "flat gray" is the flatness. There should be a gloss sheen, but the gray look is correct: DSCF0457+%25281024x768%2529.jpg


Edited by Nealius
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No it isn't, unless one wants to recreate a restored bird, which was painted this way - like Ferocious Frankie, or the one on your shot. When they left the factory back in the day, the colour over puttied areas was silver. 

 

Restored Stangs today are a mixed bag in this regard, and that's quite understandable, with the need for airfoil smoothness just not being there anymore. Some restorers go polished NM all around, some paint them glossy grey or grey'ish silver, and only few do it right :

 

P-51D-p1363640027.jpg

 

It's better to check WW-era shots for reference then:

 

P-51D-10-NA_Mustang_44-14214.jpg

 

As for Reflected, he definitely included this difference in his skins. It's subtle, but it's clearly there. He even added these little silver-paint-chipping details all over the wing.

 

Screen_210228_110911.jpg

 

Granted, VH-Rock and CHSubZero's skins have slightly more pronounced difference between the paint and the NM parts, but all three skinners modelled it in one way or another. ED skins just require some tweak here and then they'll be fine.

 

 


Edited by Art-J

i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10.

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21 hours ago, Nealius said:

Is that from Reflected's latest "ultimate default skin pack?" I'm not seeing the same contrast between the wing and control surfaces as you are, but I could be using different liveries.

 

I updated them a while ago, just re-download from the user files section. What most people get wrong - and this is true for stock skins - is that the DuPont aluminum lacquer also has metallic reflection properties, just not as much as natural metal surfaces. but it's definitely not a completely non-metallic grey paint. If you make puttied surfaces non-metallic, they won't look right, no matter how much shine you add to them. Been there, tried that. In one of the channels of the roughmets black is non metallic, white is metallic. Aluminum lacquer is a very, very light gray, at least that's how I managed to achieve a balance that matches original photos.

 

Screen-200221-161555.png


Edited by Reflected
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  • 4 months later...

There's a visual missmatch between the DIF.dds layer genereated by the latest default template and the default NMp.dds layer installed in the game subfolder  ..../TEXTURES/ P51D.zip. So when you use your custom skin done with the default template and the game loads your skin layers and its default NMp layer happens this: 

In the NMp layer the panels are slightly larger than in the newest template layers. Also the USAAF insignia is smaller than in the older template. I guess this visual missmatch doesn't happen in skins done with the older template cause panels sizes in the DIF layer and in the NMp layer properly match.

Screen_210729_183835.png


Edited by OLD CROW
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A simple Human being's Passion

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15 hours ago, NineLine said:

I just looked at our P-51 textures, what issues are you guys concerned about?

 

One main issue is the misunderstanding of the puttied wings. The default DCS liveries have modern restoration gray wings with highly polished/mirror finish control surfaces, instead of the silver-painted wings with natural metal (not mirror finish) control surfaces. 

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I know maybe this issue belongs to any other topic related to LOD or whatever but it's also a question of layers & textures....

 

Screen_210801_130849.pngScreen_210801_130902.png

This permanent (cause it doesn't change with the incident light) translucent layer that simulates the plexiglass bubble reduces a lot the spotting of anything (small fighters or large bombers)  far away from 0.5 miles at some zoom out levels, even with the label dot setting enabled. Beyond 0.5 miles you have to zoom in a lot and it means loosing a lot of Situational Awareness. The problem goes worse cause this layer is always there and it seems its fade in/out is not linked to the incident light and the position & angle of the A/C respects with the light source position.

In modern jet fighters this issue remains minimal cause jets are larger so their LOD is larger too so you can keep having a decent visual to boggeis inside 2-3 miles range, but in WW2 warbirds is critical if not the top 3 things you have to master to keep you alive: the visuals inside your surrounding 3-5 miles range (and everybody knows AI's got no issues in lock on you beyond any human visual range distance. 

 

Same issue was detected a few years ago in the Spitfire model and finally fixed it by fading this layer.

 

I would appreciate from anyone to redirect this report to its correct topic in case this isn't the correct topic. Thanks for advance.

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