2.7 Tomcat Patch 14-04-2021 Feedback Thread

[Lurker]

5 hours ago, 51thPolux said:

Hello, sorry if the question has already been addressed, but is it normal to spot the R-77s on the F-14B radar?

 

No idea, I never used to before. But you should get a RWR warning once it goes active.

Edited April 17, 2021 by Lurker

[51thPolux]

No, no worries with the RWR. I'm just asking if it's normal to see the R-77 on radar (TWS). And so, to be able to hang it and shoot it ...

[Alphabet_Ghost]

possible game no reasponding when switch VDI/TID to display TCS video. Hard to reproduce.

[captain_dalan]

9 hours ago, Nobody Special said:

AIM-7 sparrows will not track on any target as far as I can tell. I've tested AIM-7M and AIM-7F, mostly against MiG-27s but not exclusively.

 

HB made, instant action on NTTR, Constant Peg Gen III:
Aim-7M's, fired from about 10NM head on, at about mach 1.0, angels 15 have about 50% hit rate against the local MiG-23's. Inside 7NM almost a 90% hit rate against the 23's and the 21. All fired in P-STT (PAL). Haven't tried PD-STT yet.

HB made, SP mission on PG, On alert 5:
Against the Iranian F-4's and Su-24's, the AIM-7M's work with similar consistency. Again, PAL used to lock the targets, so P-STT.

[IronMike]

Just to give a bit feedback to this:

- there was no hotfix yet.

- we did not make any changes to missiles, if you see improvements, than these are on the ED side of things - which I am happy to hear about.

 

 

2 hours ago, Alphabet_Ghost said:

possible game no reasponding when switch VDI/TID to display TCS video. Hard to reproduce.

 

This could be a freeze, bud, due to clouds loading in the TCS or something similar. I had some very few lockups like that, but with my older system I wasn't surprised. Generally it screens across the clouds smoothly though.

Edited April 17, 2021 by IronMike

[captain_dalan]

19 hours ago, Nobody Special said:

AIM-7 sparrows will not track on any target as far as I can tell. I've tested AIM-7M and AIM-7F, mostly against MiG-27s but not exclusively.

 

Addendum:
I made a simple mission, NTTR, standard Atmosphere, one F-14A 4x4 plus two tanks, the Sparrows are all M's (not MH's), bandit is one Su-27, armed with ER's and ET's. Planes are 50+ NM away at the start, angels 25. After about a dozen engagements my impressions are that a 15NM shot made at a hot bandit, somewhere between angels 20 and 25 at the moment of firing, mach number between 1.0 and 1.2 has an almost guaranteed chance to hit the AI as long you crank and defend properly to avoid his shot (ER or ET). It should be noted though, that while the STT lock is established in PD-STT, Jester will automatically change to P-STT once bellow 10NM, which will happen rather fast. Also, the M does seam like it's lofting a bit, but at this range and this speed i can't be sure. Haven't tested the F yet. What would be the proper Soviet counter for an F equipped plane? 

[Awesomejlee]

22 hours ago, Awesomejlee said:

Tonight a bunch of guys from the wing (vCSG-3) had our Friday Night Fight... All the Tomcats (A and B) would freeze on spawn around ~50% of the time, requiring a hard restart to fix. I flew maybe 8 times, had the freeze 3 times. Others had more freezes with similar amounts of flights. Seems intermittent. This is on Caucuses, just an empty map with maybe 20 jets total spawnable, no more than 2 in the air at a time. RIOs would randomly freeze as well when the jet spawned.

 

Edit: We have NO mods that affect the Tomcat.

 

@IronMikeEdit 2: We've tested it quite a bit. We all removed ALL mods, repaired DCS, let it rebuild the Saved Games folder, rebuilt shaders... still happens. I will note that in 2D it is HARD to make it happen, but it did happen once for us (out of around 100 tries). In VR it happens MUCH more, around 50% of the time. All of us tomcat pilots in the wing. Different headsets, different computers, it's consistently happening around half the time. It seems to happen most often when we are in the jet, go back to spectators, hop back in the same jet, and try to spawn. That'll often cause the freeze. The game stops where it is and a steam VR window will appear saying it's waiting on DCS. It just sits there until you force the game to shut down. Generally the first spawn in will be fine, it's the spawns after (although it does happen sometimes on the first try). Hope you guys figure out what the deal is... Tomcat is broken enough that we can't use it in our wing stuff (and we're VERY active... doing stuff every night). Happens on both air starts and ground starts, both the A and B model. Tried on multiple servers.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Awesomejlee

[Nobody Special]

2 hours ago, captain_dalan said:

Addendum:
I made a simple mission, NTTR, standard Atmosphere, one F-14A 4x4 plus two tanks, the Sparrows are all M's (not MH's), bandit is one Su-27, armed with ER's and ET's. Planes are 50+ NM away at the start, angels 25. After about a dozen engagements my impressions are that a 15NM shot made at a hot bandit, somewhere between angels 20 and 25 at the moment of firing, mach number between 1.0 and 1.2 has an almost guaranteed chance to hit the AI as long you crank and defend properly to avoid his shot (ER or ET). It should be noted though, that while the STT lock is established in PD-STT, Jester will automatically change to P-STT once bellow 10NM, which will happen rather fast. Also, the M does seam like it's lofting a bit, but at this range and this speed i can't be sure. Haven't tested the F yet. What would be the proper Soviet counter for an F equipped plane? 

That's really odd. In the mission I've been using, the bandits are MiG-27s. I've tried P-STT as well as PD-STT, typically launching from 5 to 15 miles, and the missile just goes straight - it's obvious there isn't even an attempt to guide. I use both PAL and Jester-assisted locks.

 

I just set up a test-mission with MiG-21s and sparrows worked well. Odd. Change that to MiG-27K and they don't work at all, even at relatively short range (~5 mi).

Edited April 18, 2021 by Nobody Special
Added the last sentence after changing to test MiG-27K again

[Maffers]

50 minutes ago, Awesomejlee said:

@IronMikeEdit 2: We've tested it quite a bit. We all removed ALL mods, repaired DCS, let it rebuild the Saved Games folder, rebuilt shaders... still happens. I will note that in 2D it is HARD to make it happen, but it did happen once for us (out of around 100 tries). In VR it happens MUCH more, around 50% of the time. All of us tomcat pilots in the wing. Different headsets, different computers, it's consistently happening around half the time. It seems to happen most often when we are in the jet, go back to spectators, hop back in the same jet, and try to spawn. That'll often cause the freeze. The game stops where it is and a steam VR window will appear saying it's waiting on DCS. It just sits there until you force the game to shut down. Generally the first spawn in will be fine, it's the spawns after (although it does happen sometimes on the first try). Hope you guys figure out what the deal is... Tomcat is broken enough that we can't use it in our wing stuff (and we're VERY active... doing stuff every night). Happens on both air starts and ground starts, both the A and B model. Tried on multiple servers.

 

+1 on this, as a RIO I've found that about 50% of the time, entering a jet will crash DCS for both me and the pilot since 2.7 update.  No problems with any other modules.

My specs:
CPU 6700K

32GB DDR4 RAM

1080ti
Oculus Quest 2

[nillefix]

Jester calls Bolter everytime I trap no matter what.

[draconus]

13 minutes ago, nillefix said:

Jester calls Bolter everytime I trap no matter what.

Were those an honest good traps? He used to call bolter when you were out of parameters.

 

@51thPoluxThere was RCS database update for aircraft and missiles.

Edited April 18, 2021 by draconus

[nillefix]

13 minutes ago, draconus said:

Were those an honest good traps? He used to call bolter when you were out of parameters.

 

@51thPoluxThere was RCS database update for aircraft and missiles.

 

Yes.

[Moorhuhn]

On 4/17/2021 at 11:26 AM, T-O-A said:

I didnt had time for downloading the patch yet.

Did we get the Skin Contest Liveries?

Or any other new liveries for the late A? Or Helmet logos and suit patches corrected for the different squadrons?

 

The skin contest contains one swordsmen skin for the early A, which is not there yet.

I think they won't split the liveries up and will include them all as once as soon as the early A is released.

 

But are there really no other new liveries for the late A included?

Legendary Gypsy Mig Killers? Tophatters? Black Aces?

Or maybe the legendary urgently awaited Santa Cat for the B with its stunning "Seasons Greetings" Fuel Tanks?

 

I will download the patch today and check it out.

[MBot]

On 4/17/2021 at 2:52 PM, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

I fired about 6 Sparrows yesterday, in SP against AI, and all of them hit (with the F-14). Targets were MiG-21/23/29.

 

Neither of these target aircraft has a jammer, that is why you get hits.

 

21 hours ago, captain_dalan said:

HB made, instant action on NTTR, Constant Peg Gen III:
Aim-7M's, fired from about 10NM head on, at about mach 1.0, angels 15 have about 50% hit rate against the local MiG-23's. Inside 7NM almost a 90% hit rate against the 23's and the 21. All fired in P-STT (PAL). Haven't tried PD-STT yet.

HB made, SP mission on PG, On alert 5:
Against the Iranian F-4's and Su-24's, the AIM-7M's work with similar consistency. Again, PAL used to lock the targets, so P-STT.

 

Neither the MiG-21 or MiG-23  from the Constant Peg Gen III has a jammer, that is why you get hits. The F-4 doesn't have a jammer either (unless a pod was equipped, which in this mission they have not).

 

The Su-24 has a jammer. Can you confirm that you get Sparrow hits on them? In my tests, AIM-7M do not track Su-24.

 

11 hours ago, captain_dalan said:

Addendum:
I made a simple mission, NTTR, standard Atmosphere, one F-14A 4x4 plus two tanks, the Sparrows are all M's (not MH's), bandit is one Su-27, armed with ER's and ET's. Planes are 50+ NM away at the start, angels 25. After about a dozen engagements my impressions are that a 15NM shot made at a hot bandit, somewhere between angels 20 and 25 at the moment of firing, mach number between 1.0 and 1.2 has an almost guaranteed chance to hit the AI as long you crank and defend properly to avoid his shot (ER or ET). It should be noted though, that while the STT lock is established in PD-STT, Jester will automatically change to P-STT once bellow 10NM, which will happen rather fast. Also, the M does seam like it's lofting a bit, but at this range and this speed i can't be sure. Haven't tested the F yet. What would be the proper Soviet counter for an F equipped plane? 

 

Again, the Su-27 doesn't have a jammer unless unequipped with a pod.

 

8 hours ago, Nobody Special said:

That's really odd. In the mission I've been using, the bandits are MiG-27s. I've tried P-STT as well as PD-STT, typically launching from 5 to 15 miles, and the missile just goes straight - it's obvious there isn't even an attempt to guide. I use both PAL and Jester-assisted locks.

 

I just set up a test-mission with MiG-21s and sparrows worked well. Odd. Change that to MiG-27K and they don't work at all, even at relatively short range (~5 mi).

 

 

The MiG-27 has an internal jammer, thus your Sparrows don't track. The MiG-21 has no jammer.

 

 

All these Sparrow issues are jammer related.

Edited April 18, 2021 by MBot

[T-O-A]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Moorhuhn:

 

The skin contest contains one swordsmen skin for the early A, which is not there yet.

I think they won't split the liveries up and will include them all as once as soon as the early A is released.

 

But are there really no other new liveries for the late A included?

Legendary Gypsy Mig Killers? Tophatters? Black Aces?

Or maybe the legendary urgently awaited Santa Cat for the B with its stunning "Seasons Greetings" Fuel Tanks?

 

I will download the patch today and check it out.

 

Dont get me wrong, I would love to see those squadrons added too,

but instead of adding new ones, I would be happier if the current ones will be fixed.

 

The Mirroring Issues and the Fake skull issue (including missing drop tank art, wrong modex, missing carrier name on shoulders,...) on the current Jolly Rogers liveries.

 

Knowing the skull is wrong wont let me use both VF-103 liveries anymore.

PLEASE correct this.

 

After its corrected, I'd be open for more squadrons and your beloved santa tomcat

 

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

2 hours ago, MBot said:

Neither of these target aircraft has a jammer, that is why you get hits.

Fair enough. I noticed in the patch notes ED added HoJ mode for the Hornet, perhaps there is a dependancy they added by mistake that messes this up when there's a different launching aircraft.

I'll run a few tests myself in a bit

 

 

*edit*

Yes you're correct: I loaded up the Constant Peg III mission in the ME, replaced the MiG-23s by -27s, and the -21 by a Su-24, and ran that twice: out of the 8 Sparrows I fired, none tracked.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Raven (Elysian Angel)

[draconus]

On 4/15/2021 at 10:58 PM, Gromo said:

I have found problem with Caucasus Air-to-air refuel practice Instant Action missions.

Texaco remains silent and does not respond for call outs.

I used pilot radio button 1 and got response.

[LanceCriminal86]

Regarding the liveries:

 

There's a lot of underlying work that is being done/needs to be done to get the base textures for the B and A adjusted/corrected. The previously mentioned model changes that need to be made are only part of that, but a good portion of the work needs changes in the Roughmets and Normals. Things like corrections to engine nacelle panel lines, relocating the fire punch-in panels, correcting the leading edge of the tails, etc. Some of this has been "crowd sourced" by a few of us, but more needs to be done to get it where HB likes it for quality. Thankfully some folks in the Livery group and Tomcat Assn have helped get photos of a few of the panel changes between A/B/D which has helped a lot. But almost weekly there are little things that we find that could or should be adjusted to be more accurate.

 

The underlying issue there, is that the template does not include any layers for generating RM/Normals, so you have to edit the .dds files directly. Doing so and saving continually introduces grain and artifacts, which reduce the quality each time. To have them done right we are waiting on a PSD we can use to generate fresh RMs and Normals, and also some of the changes need to be done by HB using the Substance Painter tool so that all 3 texture types will line up, otherwise you can end up with misaligned changes which would be un-cool.

 

Obviously @ensamvargand co would need to give an official reply but that's a good portion of the gist of it as a sideline observer.

 

Oh and if you really want proper 1981 and 1989 Mig killers, then we need to keep twisting @Cobra847's various body parts and get a US Block 95 jet with old gun vents, beaver tail, and TCS-less ALQ-100 done, as that represents the 1981 jets and very closely the 1989 jets (1 and 2 blocks earlier than the 95 but very few differences visually).

[draconus]

There's enough work to build 3D pilots, cockpit gauges and racks before we get to rivets level

[Skysurfer]

3 minutes ago, draconus said:

There's enough work to build 3D pilots, cockpit gauges and racks before we get to rivets level

 

Sure but all of that work is separate from livery corrections (like the rail hole on most of the HGU-33 helmets on the B or livery sepcific pilot textures for the A like we have on the B). Small details do matter. Hopefully once the early and IRIAF A come out we'll have a wide array of -A liveries by then.

Edited April 19, 2021 by Skysurfer

[LanceCriminal86]

9 minutes ago, draconus said:

There's enough work to build 3D pilots, cockpit gauges and racks before we get to rivets level

 

Separate employees. Why do people keep thinking these corrections and work are diverting resources?

[draconus]

56 minutes ago, LanceCriminal86 said:

Separate employees. Why do people keep thinking these corrections and work are diverting resources?

I thought same guy does all texturing.

[LanceCriminal86]

7 minutes ago, draconus said:

I thought same guy does all texturing.

 

I mean he does portions of it, but part of it is also over on the modeling side from what I hear. And if a portion of the project is not currently on their team's priority list he's probably not working on it. I don't think one guy is right now simultaneously texturing the pilot body, Intruder, and Forrestal.

 

@Cobra847drives the bus, maybe he can clarify who does what but stop assuming that "rivet counting" fixes are somehow detracting from other features.

[ensamvarg]

15 minutes ago, LanceCriminal86 said:

 

I mean he does portions of it, but part of it is also over on the modeling side from what I hear. And if a portion of the project is not currently on their team's priority list he's probably not working on it. I don't think one guy is right now simultaneously texturing the pilot body, Intruder, and Forrestal.

 

@Cobra847drives the bus, maybe he can clarify who does what but stop assuming that "rivet counting" fixes are somehow detracting from other features.

 

Hi all, 

 

I'd just like to address any concerns regarding the "rivet counting" holding up any other features or liveries. This is NOT the case. 

Unfortunately, it's due to me falling quite ill for the later half of 2020 and the start of 2021. 

I'm on the mend now and we should start seeing more livery fixes as well as new additions to both the Cat and Viggen as I'm able to ramp up.

 

Thank you for your patience and I do apologize for all the delays!

 

Ensamvarg

[Steve Gee]

Comparing the A and B missions in Instant Action/Caucasus/ Carrier Quals CVN-73 with the Supercarrier, there's a 10 FPS difference for me now that wasn't there before 2.7.

 

I'm guessing it's due to weather conditions differences between the two missions, but I don't delve into missions that come with planes, I stay away from those folders. Default High settings with Shadows and Civilian Traffic on Low. Off to compare other A vs B Instant Action missions.