Mi-24p Armament

[AeriaGloria]

On 10/31/2021 at 10:53 AM, Sobakopes said:

Actually F is T-baric so tnt equivalent should be like 10 kg. However without much fragmentation. 

 

Sorry I should’ve clarified, I am not quoting real life figures. I am quoting the LUA figures. So in DCS, the warhead is modeled as a 7.4kg warhead

[Apok]

S25. I know we are not geting it. Just posting a teaser.

[AeriaGloria]

On 12/16/2021 at 12:47 PM, Apok said:

S25. I know we are not geting it. Just posting a teaser.

Real photo? Test?

[Quati]

23 minutes ago, AeriaGloria said:

Real photo? Test?

Searching for the image I found this site. It appears to be a good reading.

https://coollib.net/b/246712/read

 

I couldn't find nothing about Mi-24 firing those S-25 except for this.

"Firing NAR S-24 and S-25 requires good piloting skills - when launched, the helicopter is enveloped in a powerful cloud of smoke. "

[jojojung]

I know we dont get it because it was not common use in the USSR but at least there were Hind D and P versions in the GDR with 4 AT missles per pylon.

Link with Foto: https://www.16va.be/4.2_les_mi-24_part1_eng.html

[SmukY]

 

6 hours ago, jojojung said:

I know we dont get it because it was not common use in the USSR but at least there were Hind D and P versions in the GDR with 4 AT missles per pylon.

Link with Foto: https://www.16va.be/4.2_les_mi-24_part1_eng.html

What do you mean we don't get it? You can actually fly Mi-24P with 8 guided AT missiles, and this weapon configuration works, as WSO you have 8 missiles slots to select from when firing.

Edited January 12, 2022 by SmukY

[jojojung]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb SmukY:

 

What do you mean we don't get it? You can actually fly Mi-24P with 8 guided AT missiles, and this weapon configuration works, as WSO you have 8 missiles slots to select from when firing.

 

Yes of course. But we dont get the launchers with 4 missles at one pylon, which were used in the GDR but only the double rack. 

In that config you could equip 16 AT missles.

Edited January 12, 2022 by jojojung

[SmukY]

1 hour ago, jojojung said:

Yes of course. But we dont get the launchers with 4 missles at one pylon, which were used in the GDR but only the double rack. 

In that config you could equip 16 AT missles.

 

Ah now I see what do you mean. Interesting, never saw that before.

[1stBEAST]

i think that 16 ATGM would not have worked not even the mi35 could actually use 16 only 8. yes i know it can carry them but they cant fire them.

[jojojung]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb 1stBEAST:

i think that 16 ATGM would not have worked not even the mi35 could actually use 16 only 8. yes i know it can carry them but they cant fire them.

Very interessting. Do you know why it does not work?

[Apok]

Cuz wiring is available only on right wing on 35M. Just think how much time it would take for a Hind to use all 16 in combat if possible, considering it attacks one by one target. There is no realistic need for 16.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Apok

[fargo007]

On 1/14/2022 at 6:02 AM, 1stBEAST said:

i think that 16 ATGM would not have worked not even the mi35 could actually use 16 only 8. yes i know it can carry them but they cant fire them.

The Cobra can carry & fire I think 12 or 16, but it takes some "imagination."  It will only recognize 8 or so at a time. The crew have to fire some, reset the breaker, and then it will recognize the others.

Edited January 15, 2022 by fargo007

[admiki]

54 minutes ago, Apok said:

Cuz wiring is available only on right wing on 35M. Just think how much time it would take for a Hind to use all 16 in combat if possible, considering it attacks one by one target. There is no realistic need for 16.

 

I can fire at least 2, sometimes 3 with Petrovich in one run. If I have human pilot, I can fire easy 2 missiles per run.

[Dragon1-1]

It's more that it was never designed to carry 16. Mi-28 can do it, but Hind variants are wired for 8 missiles only. On older aircraft you generally don't have an easily reprogrammed computer to manage the weapons, instead you have the configurations hardwired into circuitry. For bombs and rockets it's usually just the matter of programming the sight, since releasing them boils down to "launch" and "arm the fuze(s)" signals, but missiles, especially SACLOS, need a lot more than that. In days of vacuum tubes and clunky discrete transistors, it was wise to limit the amount of electronics being carried, since they could be quite heavy and bulky.

[Avimimus]

7 hours ago, Dragon1-1 said:

In days of vacuum tubes and clunky discrete transistors, it was wise to limit the amount of electronics being carried, since they could be quite heavy and bulky.

Not to mention often requiring tuning by ground crew prior to each flight (at least going off of the CF-100 radar as an example)!

[AeriaGloria]

21 hours ago, Dragon1-1 said:

It's more that it was never designed to carry 16. Mi-28 can do it, but Hind variants are wired for 8 missiles only. On older aircraft you generally don't have an easily reprogrammed computer to manage the weapons, instead you have the configurations hardwired into circuitry. For bombs and rockets it's usually just the matter of programming the sight, since releasing them boils down to "launch" and "arm the fuze(s)" signals, but missiles, especially SACLOS, need a lot more than that. In days of vacuum tubes and clunky discrete transistors, it was wise to limit the amount of electronics being carried, since they could be quite heavy and bulky.

There are two sets of codes that have to be agree between the loaded missiles and 9K113/Raduga Sh complex. This way the missiles IR beacon has the right frequency, and the IR sensor in the periscope can detect the right frequency and send out radio commands in the correct frequency/modulation so that the missile can receive it.

However to fire the missile is extremely simple, you only need to apply voltage at two points along the tube. To rig it up to fire many is probably easy, the CPG just has to have the hardware to select the pylon and wires that go from the pylon to said pylon selector. I can find pictures of Mi-35 with 8 missile racks, but interestingly enough not 2x 8 missile racks. I would bet that the outer pylons themselves are wired to fire 8 individual missiles, but that they don’t carry them Atleast on both sides due to weight and drag. After all , the Mi-35M does benefit from MFDs and some glass in its cockpit 
 

A loaded pair of 9M120 racks(4x missiles) like what we have in DCS Mi-24P is almost 250 kg. I haven’t checked what the 8x weigh on the Mi-28. But if it weighs close 500 kg, they must’ve strengthened the outer pylons quite a bit for the Mi-35 compared to our generation Mi-24

[Apok]

On 1/15/2022 at 7:21 PM, admiki said:

I can fire at least 2, sometimes 3 with Petrovich in one run. If I have human pilot, I can fire easy 2 missiles per run.

True but irl you wouldn't want to get close to target area. Especially if that area has targets that need ATGMs.

[WinterH]

On 1/17/2022 at 10:48 AM, Apok said:

True but irl you wouldn't want to get close to target area. Especially if that area has targets that need ATGMs.

Yes, though technically you can still do the usual "hover and keep sending missiles" thing with Hind too. It requires the helo to be light, altitude low, temp also not too hot, and the operator needs to first fire the missile looking at the boresight, way up above the target, and gently bring the sight down on the target. That's not a "gamism" either, as far as I know it is sometimes practiced by IRL Hind crews. Still though, as said, it is not really what Hind is designed for, and it can only do so under ideal circumstances.

Still though, fact remains that Hind's guidance system is limited to 8 missiles regardless. Looks like this hasn't changed even on Mi-35M.

[AnarchyZG]

Most unusual loadout I've seen on Mi-24 are 4 torpedoes

[AeriaGloria]

4 hours ago, AnarchyZG said:

Most unusual loadout I've seen on Mi-24 are 4 torpedoes

Pictures? Information? 

[admiki]

What Gloria said

[AnarchyZG]

6 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

Pictures? Information? 

Croatia 1995 military parade. Why they did it, beats me. Was it ever used in combat? Nope. Was it ever tested? No idea.

TBH there were some propaganda fakes on that parade but 4 Mk4something torpedoes on Mi-24 looked legit

https://images.app.goo.gl/1sX9BJyEeLKQh6cs7

IIRC, US Mk44

Edited February 12, 2022 by AnarchyZG

[AeriaGloria]

13 hours ago, AnarchyZG said:

Croatia 1995 military parade. Why they did it, beats me. Was it ever used in combat? Nope. Was it ever tested? No idea.

TBH there were some propaganda fakes on that parade but 4 Mk4something torpedoes on Mi-24 looked legit

https://images.app.goo.gl/1sX9BJyEeLKQh6cs7

IIRC, US Mk44

 

Very odd, looks like older Hind also with gun camera. Perhaps they figured out to make them work if they are dropped like bombs, very weird 

[AnarchyZG]

11 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

Very odd, looks like older Hind also with gun camera. Perhaps they figured out to make them work if they are dropped like bombs, very weird 

Well, those were mostly D versions that served in Afghanistan, after operation Storm in 1995 they were decomissioned because they were really worn out, as for torpedoes, Mk44 is completely autonomous when it gets into water it performs the search within preset parameters so I guess they could work.

Mi-24 were liked both by crews and the grunts. Mostly used unguided rockets and sometimes AT-6 for neutralizing fortified positions. They were definitely disliked by the enemy. None were shot down, several were damaged, one crewman injured (supposedly by 50cal round hit in the MG turret and fragment wound up in the cockpit, at least that's what I was told). 

[AeriaGloria]

7 hours ago, AnarchyZG said:

Well, those were mostly D versions that served in Afghanistan, after operation Storm in 1995 they were decomissioned because they were really worn out, as for torpedoes, Mk44 is completely autonomous when it gets into water it performs the search within preset parameters so I guess they could work.

Mi-24 were liked both by crews and the grunts. Mostly used unguided rockets and sometimes AT-6 for neutralizing fortified positions. They were definitely disliked by the enemy. None were shot down, several were damaged, one crewman injured (supposedly by 50cal round hit in the MG turret and fragment wound up in the cockpit, at least that's what I was told). 

I don’t know what you speak of. According to Russian sources 74 were destroyed in Afghanistan, 27 by MANPADs. More were shot down by Contras and Atleast some number was downed during the Iran Iraq were were lost according to sources on both sides. The famous time a Mi-24 was downed by a LGB from a F-15E in Iraq. Many people unfortunetly have died in them, I have no idea where you got the idea none have been shot down and only one person hurt