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SEAD/DEAD guide


Fuelburner
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  • 3 weeks later...

Hello Fuelburner.

 

You are asking a VERY broad question.

To answer your question i would need the following information:
1: Which platform are you flying?

2: Which airdefence system are you up against?

3: Which munition are you using?

4: Are you a single flight or a whole formation?

5: What are the terrain?

 

These are just a few of the questions someone would need answers to, to just give you a hint on how to defeat a airdefence system.

SEAD/DEAD is a combined arms operation, with multiple platform performing their own role in the entire machinery.

Escorts, AWACS, shooters, spotters, tankers, EW etc. are all needed to defeat a modern airdefence system with a trained crew.

 

Their are several books about the subject, primarily from 91´ Gulf War and the 73´ October/Yom Kippur war.
If you read them, you get a idea of just how complex SEAD/DEAD operations can be and then how difficult, if not impossible, your question is to answer.

That being said, try Youtubing "How to defeat xx sam system" and sometimes a rather good video comes up on how to defeat a particular system.

But again, that perhaps only apply to that particular scenario under those conditions.
Defeating a Tor in flat desert is not comparable to defeating it in a valley, thats why soldiering requires more brain than many people think; you need to re-invent the spoon each time in a different way.
 

Brian.

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You can go nuts with this.

 

JP 3-01, Countering Air ans Missile Threats (jcs.mil)  You want to try to find the pocket sized guide J-SEAD for illustrations.

 

Be advised to perform true SEAD (suppression) its not easy in DCS cause it's not well implemented.  i.e. While you suppress an area the AAA/SAMs are distracted while you take out your actual target.

 

DEAD is a more accurate picture of what we do in DCS IMHO as we destroy the units and there is no way they can be rebuilt later on.  With SEAD again your just suppressing, not Killing, destroy, neutralize and harass.

 

Sky is the limit with what you want to do here as noted above by bmbpdk.  Use good intelligence and plan accordingly, in DCS remove air threat and then you own the sky.  Thats what I would do.  Hope that helps.

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My CAS (Close air support) JTAC Channel:  RIFLE - YouTube  

RIFLE's Discord:  https://discord.gg/wuANTrhH

Publications

JTAC Bible (see/know chapter #5) https://fas.org/irp/doddir/dod/jp3_09_3.pdf

J-FIRE pocket guide (Don't do battle without it!)  BK2 (fas.org)

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HAWG63
 

Thank you for the link to the publication.
Its interesting that they do not mention DEAD (I did a search and only one instance came up, in a different context).
And its interesting that they define SEAD as:
"Means of SEAD Execution. SEAD operations are accomplished through denial,
degradation, destruction, and disruption."
The word itself contradict its own definition...
I guess that SEAD have different terms depending who you ask, since the books ive read about the subject, the pilots themselves and their squadron clearly differentiate between SEAD and DEAD.
Two very different missions and two very different strategies.
But im not surprised, i have been in the Royal Danish Army myself for 2½ years with deployment to Iraq, we quickly realised that command beyond battalion level is borderlining couchcommanders and they live in a dreamworld and they are never wrong and should be obeyed blindly... we didn...

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I think those open up some of the generic parts.

 

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5 hours ago, bmbpdk said:

Its interesting that they do not mention DEAD (I did a search and only one instance came up, in a different context).
And its interesting that they define SEAD as:
"Means of SEAD Execution. SEAD operations are accomplished through denial,
degradation, destruction, and disruption."
The word itself contradict its own definition...
I guess that SEAD have different terms depending who you ask, since the books ive read about the subject, the pilots themselves and their squadron clearly differentiate between SEAD and DEAD.
Two very different missions and two very different strategies.

 

Aside from how people actually use the two terms in practice, DEAD is a sub-set of SEAD.  DEAD falls under the larger, more general "SEAD umbrella".

From an effects perspective, one way you can look at it is either a "soft kill" or a "hard kill".  An example of soft kill would be conducting an electronic warfare attack against a SAM site that disrupts anything from the radar itself to the communications links between the command/control and the individual batteries.  A hard kill would be actually damaging or destroying the equipment itself.

From a tactics perspective however, when discussing SEAD vs DEAD, the term DEAD is often used to convey a contrasting intent of a mission compared to the more general SEAD.  Are you simply trying to prevent the air defenses in an area from effectively operating for a specific window, or are you trying to remove that capability altogether from the enemy's order of battle?  The former could be accomplished using either "soft kill" or "hard kill" methods, however the latter would require a "hard kill".

 

Other instances that further muddy the waters would be (for example) using land or naval artillery to suppress enemy air defenses, because SHORAD and MANPAD gunners are gonna be inclined to dive into bunkers and such when artillery is raining down on their position; and even crews manning a fire control console in a hardened battery control center may have their attention or equipment degraded with artillery shells raining down overhead.  And while the artillery may damage or destroy some equipment, the intent isn't necessarily to destroy, but to degrade and disrupt the operations of the air defense units for the duration of the bombardment.

 

So to summarize, all DEAD missions are SEAD missions, but not all SEAD missions are DEAD missions.  But we're talking doctrinal definitions, not common usage of the two terms, which can obviously vary depending on the organization or country.

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Afterburners are for wussies...hang around the battlefield and dodge tracers like a man.
DCS Rotor-Head

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BMB,

 

A lot of my work in Iraq had me seconded to an American General in norther Iraq.

I learned there as a Canadian that some of these words that were "generic" to soldiers had significant meaning to scientists!  For example.  A pre planned strike on a house saw massive human resources from the B1 community associated to it.  The pilot was not making a call at all.  Structure shape, material, age etc was all considered to achieve a mathematical formula that equaled "destruction".  Two GBU31 could have done the job but nah!  7 JDAMS!!!  These are calculations that I will never see the definition and a secret no foreign.

But rest assured SEAD is suppression and I can only imagine what dead looks like.  For example, the tracks of the AAA unit must be so unrecognizable that they cant be glued back together to make the track usable again.  For DCS, I suspect we are over engineering killing or simply can't appreciate it.

My CAS (Close air support) JTAC Channel:  RIFLE - YouTube  

RIFLE's Discord:  https://discord.gg/wuANTrhH

Publications

JTAC Bible (see/know chapter #5) https://fas.org/irp/doddir/dod/jp3_09_3.pdf

J-FIRE pocket guide (Don't do battle without it!)  BK2 (fas.org)

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