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AIM-54 [Phoenix] not showing on RWR


Das Feuer

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Hello,

I've posted on this topic before didn't have the time to test it but now I've.
Last time I wrote this (Under that I would put the test results and other people experience with this issue.) :
 

" I would add later this day a video of this. 

 

The basic idea is:

- 80% of the time the missile won't show on RWR and you would just die.

 

- The time it does show on RWR it usually shows about 0.5 seconds before impact and very rarely it will show 3-4 second before impact.

 

- Also a F-14 will not show on the RWR when it locks you for most of the time, it will maybe blip in RWR twice or a bit more but that's it.

 

(Tests have been done on the Viper [F-16] but a Hornet [F-18] player that I fly with also confirmed that the Phoenix doesn't show on RWR).

 

*I would try to add a video of this happening when I'm home, around 6-4 hours from when this is posted* "

 

On this post I got the response of IronMIKE, he said this;

" Thank you. If this is happening on the RWR of another module, it is likely an oversight on their side and would have to be addressed with them, please. "

 

Before posting my first topic about the issue I've contacted NineLine on the ED Discord he responded by telling me this:

" You may need to report this to HB "

 

Because of that I'm trying to figure out to who should I reach out about this problem. 

 

My first test were in a Viper [F-16] and in the F-15, did it on single player when the A.I got these following settings,

Enemy fighter- Ace, 1 AIM-54C-MK47, at 35,000 feet with speeds of mach 1.0 .

In that test the Viper didn't got the results that I looked for it immediately started warning of a incoming missile the moment the A.I launched, but the F-15 did got the result that I looked for.

In this track file you can see the F-15 not getting any warning of a incoming missile:

 

   

F-15 AIM-54 test bug prood.trk

 

I had a track file of that happening to me but I don't remember which day it was and each track file is at least 2 hours.

 

Also I asked around to see if some players also experienced the same thing, I got some of my buddies to confirm that this has happened to them after the latest update but like me they have lots of file that each one is at least 1 hour long, I've also asked around in the ED's discord, a user named FzK#4325 told me the same thing, he flies the F-14 and he didn't have a track file for me but he did have a Tacview recording.

he said the it had happened to him 3 times in the mission he flew, it may seem like he was defending but he said the he is cranking right after he shots everytime, by the Tacview we can see the he engages a bandit then he foxes and start cranking, not getting any RWR warning and then he just dies.

Is own word (can be found is ED's discord):

Das FeuerToday at 4:54 AM

is anyone experiencing AIM-54 not showing on RWR or showing just half a second before impact

FzKToday at 5:02 AM

I am
[5:02 AM]
Got killed
[5:02 AM]
By phoenixes

FzKToday at 5:02 AM

With no warning
[5:02 AM]
3 times no warning just death
[5:03 AM]
It annoyed me so much

Das FeuerToday at 5:03 AM

Can you just confirm that you weren't in the blind area of RWR and not got killed by a IR missile please

FzKToday at 5:03 AM

I watched the tacview
[5:03 AM]
And he was dead ahead of me
[5:03 AM]
Phoenix to the face

Das FeuerToday at 5:03 AM

and can you please tell me which airframe were you using?

  

Das FeuerToday at 5:04 AM

I would like if can send it to me

FzKToday at 5:05 AM

At first I was shocked like what killed me hehe
[5:05 AM]
Silent phoenixes
[5:05 AM]
That’s dangerous(edited)
 
 
@FzK
Another F14

Das FeuerToday at 5:05 AM

Copy if you can send me the Tacview file it would mean a lot

FzKToday at 5:05 AM

It is a tacview from PGAW Would U mind If i clip it?(edited)
[5:05 AM]
Via video

FzKToday at 5:05 AM

Because it is 3hours long
 

Das FeuerToday at 5:05 AM

it's better to send me the whole file
 
@Das Feuer
it's better to send me the whole file

FzKToday at 5:06 AM

I’ll do that and give ya a time stamp then

Das FeuerToday at 5:06 AM

copy thanks
 

FzKToday at 5:07 AM

So give me about 20minutes
[5:07 AM]
And I’ll send it in your dm’s

Das FeuerToday at 5:07 AM

yup no problem thank you

 

 

By this we can learn that he is probably telling the truth.

Here we can see the Tacview: (wasn't able to add the Tacview you are welcome to DM me in discord I will send it to you.)

look for him (SHARK 1-3|FzK) at 30:55.

 

 

 

Hope someone can give me a answer to this, if help is needed I've no problem helping out.

 

My discord is the same as username here look for me in ED's discord.

 

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I've tested this in single player against AI F14 firing Phoenix. 

The Russian SPO, F15, A10A and F14 rwr gave no warning when AI launched and no warning for Phoenix active range.

 

On the other hand F-16, F18, JF, M2K, Viggen, A10C, AV8 all got a warning as soon as the AI launched a Phoenix, like SARH. Missile never goes active.

 

Seems like it is an FC3 and Tomcat thing that is broken.


Edited by Frostie
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"[51☭] FROSTIE" #55

51st PVO "BISONS"

Fastest MiG pilot in the world - TCR'10

https://100kiap.org

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20 minutes ago, Frostie said:

I've tested this in single player against AI F14 firing Phoenix. 

The Russian SPO, F15, A10A and F14 rwr gave no warning when AI launched and no warning for Phoenix active range.

 

On the other hand F-16, F18, JF, M2K, Viggen, A10C, AV8 all got a warning as soon as the AI launched a Phoenix, like SARH. Missile never goes active.

 

Seems like it is an FC3 and Tomcat thing that is broken.

 

Thanks, thought so as well, although in multiplayer I still get no RWR warning with the Viper.

I hope some stuff member will see this, it's causing servers owners to remove the Tomcat or the AIM-54 and that's really bad for the image of the Tomcat and it's annoying for those who fly the Tomcat and those who fly against it.

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3 hours ago, vtaf_archer said:

is this happening only in sp or mp too?

 

Multiplayer too.

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it has become a usual thing that aim54 gets bugged or rwr warnings disappears.. i wonder how long its gonna take to fix this time and what'll break next 😄
also, do you have a video record of this that u can share? 

 


Edited by vtaf_archer
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10 minutes ago, vtaf_archer said:

it has become a usual thing that aim54 gets bugged or rwr warnings disappears.. i wonder how long its gonna take to fix this time and what'll break next 😄
also, do you have a video record of this that u can share? 

 

 

I uploaded a track file you can watch it download it do to your saved games> dcs> Tracks and put it there lunch your game go to replay and watch it.
 

I'm not able to upload anything above 5mb that's a bit problematic for a video.

I have only only one because the moment I understand that I'm going to die I try to go defensive and then record because it takes me time to turn the recording on.

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1 hour ago, CIChesty said:

I also just tested and confirmed that the F-14, F-15C, JF-17 and F-16 do NOT receive RWR warnings from incoming AIM-54s.

 

F/A-18C and JF-17 do though.

Mind sending me the track files?

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On 6/20/2021 at 1:32 AM, CIChesty said:

I also just tested and confirmed that the F-14, F-15C, JF-17 and F-16 do NOT receive RWR warnings from incoming AIM-54s.

 

F/A-18C and JF-17 do though.

 

I wouldn't make such blanket statements if I were you, I get phoenix RWR warnings when flying the viper. 

This issue is probably related to specific conditions, rather than airframes.

 

Remember that TWS launches don't give warning, only STT launches do, so I wouldn't test this with AI, since there's no way of knowing which radar mode it's using. 

Better test it with other tomcat players, talking via discord / teamspeak / SRS / voice chat, etc. 

Take note of the radar modes being used in each test, as well as other factors like aspect, indicated TTA, whether the lock is dropped, etc. 

 

Unreliable RWR warning when phoenixes are involved might have something to do with the selected radar mode, phoenix's radar losing track / reacquiring, etc. 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi everyone,

 

I'm experiencing this issue as well. However, it seems to be related only to SP and F14 AI vs FC3 aircraft.

In my tests FC3 aircraft (specifically SU27, Mig29, F15) do not receive a RWR warning when a AIM54 becomes active or is fired in STT.

 

In contrast, the F16 and F18 seem to work just fine receiving the RWR warning according to the stage of the AIM54 engagement.

 

I'm able to reproduce the issue 100% of times should a track or video of it be necessary.

 

Thank you.

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On 7/18/2021 at 12:02 PM, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

Wait this is STILL not fixed ?? 

 

🤬  🤬

When you want to bring attention to a thread, don't scream at us. Please call one of us testers using "@".

 

I've just replayed the track in the OP and I confirm the RWR remained silent during the whole AIM-54 flight.

I'll test other aircraft right away and then report the issue.

Don't accept indie game testing requests from friends in Discord. Ever.

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I can reproduce this issue with the F-15C.

I cannot reproduce it wih other aircraft. See attached tracks.

 

I'll report this issue as an F-15C issue. If you want to prove me wrong, please attach tracks. Thank you.

 

EDIT: The F-15C RWR issue with AIM-54 seems to be fixed internally. This fix might not make it in today's OB update though.


Edited by Flappie

Don't accept indie game testing requests from friends in Discord. Ever.

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@Flappie

Hi Flappie, I hope you don't mind me using the @ to ping you. You mentioned the F-15C as well as the F-14 as confirmed, did you get a chance to look at the SPO equipped aircraft (Su27, Mig29, ...)? I did test with those and have the same issue.

 

Do you think that perhaps the fix will address all aircraft that are affected?

 

If you need some more information or the tracks as you mentioned, I'm glad to provide some.

 

Thanks again for your help.

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I've just tested it with all FC3 aircraft in the upcoming OB update. I confirm none of them can hear incoming AIM-54s.

 

The internal fix seems to work for all of them, but as I said earlier, I don't know when this fix will make it to OB. I'll ask the team.

Don't accept indie game testing requests from friends in Discord. Ever.

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That is wonderful news. Even if it only makes it in later, it's fixed and that is what matters 🙂

 

I just want to add something I noticed just now. I ran another test and with the F-14A (the really old AI model) the SPO receives the signal. It's only with the F-14A-135-GR and F-14B that the SPO is silent.

 

In any case, thanks again for your help with this issue.

 

Cheers.


Edited by mousepilot
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  • 3 weeks later...

Tried a J-11, Su-27 and Su-33 against all AIM54 versions. No RWR in any conditions.

 

The only exception is when it is launched by the F14A...then you get RWR warning when the missile goes pitbull. However, when launched by either of the two newer F14 (B or GR) models nothing happens.

 

There was a time when you could also occasionally see the missile in the radar display - but that is gone in the current build (2.7.3).

 

So - almost no assistance at all for defeating the Phoenix.

 

Can this be fixed please ?

 

Thanks


Edited by BrzI
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On 7/21/2021 at 9:09 AM, Flappie said:

I've just tested it with all FC3 aircraft in the upcoming OB update. I confirm none of them can hear incoming AIM-54s.

 

The internal fix seems to work for all of them, but as I said earlier, I don't know when this fix will make it to OB. I'll ask the team.

Did this make it into todays patch - There seems to be nothing in the notes 😞

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